Adding Ball Valve to Brew Pot - what kind of pickup to install for whirlpooling

Hey everyone!

I just built a new 3 tier set up and am installing a ball valve on my brew pot. Here's some background:

-Brew pot = 15 gallon Super pot
-I use an immersion chiller
-I usually whirlpool and siphon from the side
-I use pellet hops and dump them directly into the wort
-I'll be installing a weldless ball valve / bulkhead from bargainfittings.com
-I'd like to continue using the whirlpool technique

Here's my question:

-what kind of pickup should I use inside of the pot to pickup the wort, leaving the trub in the cone from the whirlpool and leaving as little wort as possible in the kettle?

I found this in another forum and think it looks good, but I read that you had to whirlpool hot and use a CFC to make this option work. Why would I need to whirlpool hot? If this would would work fine on cooled wort, I would whirlpool clockwise so which way would the copper tube be angled (opening with or against the flow of the whirlpooling wort like the one in the picture)?

Thanks guys!!!

The way I see it, you would be whirpooling hot when using a CFC only if you don't circulate back to the kettle in a loop while cooling. Using a single pass arrangement, naturally the wort will be hot while still in the kettle. How could it be otherwise if it has not yes passed through a chiller.

The direction you point the pickup tube doesn't much matter as you won't be draining anything while the wort is moving. Even straight down would work nearly as well. I think the long pickup tube shown is simply to permit it to reach as close to the side as possible. I see no reason why you would be limited to using only a CFC with this configuration. You should be able to use an IC to cool the wort then remove it, stir to get the whirlpool action going, wait 10-15 minutes and drain.

The point of using a chiller is to get the wort cooled quickly. You will want to start the whirlpool right away and get it started doing it's thing. While it's moving stuff to the center, I'm setting up my CFC. Then I get it chilling.

If you use an IC, I'd recommend dropping that in during the last 10 -15 minutes of the boil, and start the whirlpool right away when you turn the heat off. When the wort is cooled, you can drain with the dip tube, leaving the chiller in there or take it out.

There is a hybrid system called a whirlpool chiller that essentially utilizes an IC, but also recirculates the wort using a pump. The pump flows the wort back into the BK in a whirlpool fashion. It may also run through a CFC device as well. The purpose is to have the speed of a CFC's chilling power, combined with the added chilling of an IC, while chilling the entire volume of wort at one time (A CFC only chills the portion of the wort that is currently passing through it, leaving what's in the BK at a high temp), and also helping to clarify the wort with a whirlpool.

It's a dandy piece of work, but is the most complicated and expensive method out there. And I, personally, don't think the amount of time shaved by using one is going to be noticeable in the final product. My CFC only takes about 10-15 minutes at worst. No doubt that there is some amount of bad things happening in the wort during that time, but unless if can be measured, I just believe that it's not nearly enough to taste.

If I had 10 gallons of wort to cool, that may be another story.

Homercidal said:

A CFC only chills the portion of the wort that is currently passing through it, leaving what's in the BK at a high temp

Click to expand...

This isn't quite right. Pumping wort through a CFC and back to the BK in a continuous loop also drops the temp of the main volume in the kettle as the returning cooler wort blends with that remaining in the kettle. With each pass through the chiller, the wort leaving the kettle is substantially cooler.

I can drop the temp of the entire volume of a 12 gallon batch to below 140F in about five minutes using tap water and no ice. I built my CFC using 1/2" ID hard copper pipe. The pumping rate is about 2.5 gallons/min. IMO, the key tp rapid chilling when using this technique is a fast flow rate for both the wort and the cooling water through the CFC. My point is that you don't need to use both a CFC and an IC when circulating back to the BK. A CFC alone will work just fine if the flow rate sufficient.

Catt22 said:

This isn't quite right. Pumping wort through a CFC and back to the BK in a continuous loop also drops the temp of the main volume in the kettle as the returning cooler wort blends with that remaining in the kettle. With each pass through the chiller, the wort leaving the kettle is substantially cooler.

I can drop the temp of the entire volume of a 12 gallon batch to below 140F in about five minutes using tap water and no ice. I built my CFC using 1/2" ID hard copper pipe. The pumping rate is about 2.5 gallons/min. IMO, the key tp rapid chilling when using this technique is a fast flow rate for both the wort and the cooling water through the CFC. My point is that you don't need to use both a CFC and an IC when circulating back to the BK. A CFC alone will work just fine if the flow rate sufficient.

Click to expand...

Sorry, I meant to describe a CFC alone, with gravity feed and no recirculation.

And you are right. The one point that really needs to be made here, is that although you want to pitch yeast in a decent amount of time, the key to chilling is to get the wort down to less than 140F as fast as possible.

Then again, some others have been "no-chill" brewing and having great luck with it. Personally I have done this (although leaving the BK in the snowbank overnight might not qualify as "no-chill"...) and have made the best beer yet that way.

One day, when I have a RIMS system, and a pump, I may also recirc. But until then, I am perfectly happy to spend an extra 10 minutes during the drain to get my wort down to 65.

Homercidal said:

Sorry, I meant to describe a CFC alone, with gravity feed and no recirculation.

And you are right. The one point that really needs to be made here, is that although you want to pitch yeast in a decent amount of time, the key to chilling is to get the wort down to less than 140F as fast as possible.

Then again, some others have been "no-chill" brewing and having great luck with it. Personally I have done this (although leaving the BK in the snowbank overnight might not qualify as "no-chill"...) and have made the best beer yet that way.

One day, when I have a RIMS system, and a pump, I may also recirc. But until then, I am perfectly happy to spend an extra 10 minutes during the drain to get my wort down to 65.

Click to expand...

Actually, I understood what you were saying. I just wanted to clarify it some for others that might not have.

I've been at this a while and I've tried just about every chilling method including no chill and the snow bank technique. I started with a 25 ft 3/8" OD copper IC. That worked, but not as fast as I wanted and it still required keeping the wort stirred up. I then moved up to a store bought 25 ft 3/8" ID tubing in a hose CFC. This also worked and somewhat better than the IC, but still slower than I wanted and at about the same time I started brewing the larger 12 gallon batches which took much longer to chill. That's when I built my own CFC with the larger rigid pipe and began circulating back to the BK. This has been working very well. The only improvement I'm planning is to pump ice water through the chiller near the end with a second pump. The only thing holding this up is my budget.