After a bad batch I sampled the ambient air.....
I'm brewing in a **** storm (or trying)
- Thread starter sudbuster
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Haha, that's an eye opener! I remember reading somewhere that you should never assume that your beer, even after boiling, is sterile. There are always wild things in there. The trick is to get your yeast busy quickly in order to get the ABV up before the wild things start gnasing their terrible teeth, and rolling their terrible eyes, and showing their terrible claws. Grrr!
Too funny!
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
Looks like you've got lots of airborne nasties where you're brewing... Time to move to where the air is better... 
OP
OP
Looks like you've got lots of airborne nasties where you're brewing... Time to move to where the air is better...
Too late for that. This is the last bastion of my brewing experience. I'm in the process of setting up a closed system from kettle to glass.
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
Too late for that. This is the last bastion of my brewing experience. I'm in the process of setting up a closed system from kettle to glass.
That should be interesting... :fro: Brewing in a bubble??
OP
OP
Yeah, sometimes.. The last batch was pitched with 5 liters of high krausen wort and showed no lag time, yet still smelled and tasted like a pile of wet clothes after a few days. Kinda like the locker rooms at the Y.
OP
OP
That should be interesting... :fro: Brewing in a bubble??
More like brewing in a pipeline...
I'm in the process of setting up a closed system from kettle to glass.
Very interesting. I'd like to hear more about this.
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
I see more than a couple of logistical issues with brewing in a closed system.
Thanks for the great photo and info! I know that there are microbes everywhere, and I cringe sometimes just thinking about it!
I've been lucky, and haven't had infections that I haven't deserved! I had a lacto infection a while back, though, and I still don't know where that came from. I think sometimes the yeast do a good job in spite of us!
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
naysayer! Much bigger issues with closed minds
Didn't say the idea was the product of a senile mind...
Just saying it ain't gonna be easy... Bubba...
Didn't say the idea was the product of a senile mind...
Sudbuster, I think this guy called you senile.
So, anyway, I could see it. The closed boiler is going to be a bit of a problem, but it could be covered at the end of the boil.
Pump into closed/sanitized fermenters. (i.e., a sanke).
Pump from sanke to cornies, or just serve from the sanke after force carbing.
Is this what you have in mind sudbuster?
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
Methuselah knows me better than that, pp...
IMO, using a CO2 push post boil will be the way to move things. I actually do that to move from fermenting sanke keg into serving kegs.
I see the biggest challenge being how he's going to keep things closed, once under ~140F, without having DMS issues. Unless he plans on fabricating a sealed ventilation hood to go directly over the kettle with back-flow prevention. Even then, things won't be easy.
Post chill, things won't be as difficult. But things will need to be considered, tested, tweaked, redesigned, and other modifications made. It could be a long process from initial plans/drawings until there's something that actually works fully.
OP
OP
I may be kinda senile, but I have periods of lucidity and enlightenment which encourgae me to go on. I have already tested sealing the boiler after the boil, and admitting air through a HEPA filter. Also tested out sanitizing the fermenter by recirculating boilig water for 20 min. The water can then be used for washing up. Tested out filtering hops so the plate chiller won't get clogged, using the hop load from the previous brew. Tested pumping wort to the ferminter with a HEPA filter gas exhaust. All hoses and fitting sanitized in boiling water and covered until used.
Tested yeast inoculation by co2 pressure to the fermenter with a HEPA filter air escape.
Jan. 5 will be the test date for the system. I probably missed something, But I have an excuse.
I have always had a closed system from fermenter to glass, but trying to include the boil kettle has been a PITA for me.
Here I am testing the fermenter steriization by boiling water 20 min. The picture shows the start of the process.
I may be kinda senile, but I have periods of lucidity and enlightenment which encourgae me to go on. I have already tested sealing the boiler after the boil, and admitting air through a HEPA filter. Also tested out sanitizing the fermenter by recirculating boilig water for 20 min. The water can then be used for washing up. Tested out filtering hops so the plate chiller won't get clogged, using the hop load from the previous brew. Tested pumping wort to the ferminter with a HEPA filter gas exhaust. All hoses and fitting sanitized in boiling water and covered until used.
Tested yeast inoculation by co2 pressure to the fermenter with a HEPA filter air escape.
Jan. 5 will be the test date for the system. I probably missed something, But I have an excuse.
I have always had a closed system from fermenter to glass, but trying to include the boil kettle has been a PITA for me.
Here I am testing the fermenter steriization by boiling water 20 min. The picture shows the start of the process.
That's impressive sud. You are really taking the bull by the horns.
Have you considered passing the steam from the boil through the fermenter. It would definately sanitize it. DMS would condense in it, but you could leave the lower valve opened and just let it drain.
Or, maybe you can run the hot wort into the fermenter, let it sit for 10 minutes to sanitize, then chill right in that fermenter. It looks like it's all stainless, it can take those temps right?
Anyway, good luck and make sure to keep us posted on your successes and failures. And happy new year.
OP
OP
Because I am old, you may think I'm a real gonzo. I am not yet so
naive as to accept your above post as serious, especially the DMS crap.
Hope you and yours have a happy new year.
OP
OP
Thank you Sir, but I'm just trying to avoid the ambient mold population where I brew. Happy new years to you and yours. .......
OP
OP
Daughters and sons of the barley grain, I have been trying this and that protocol to be able to brew an excellent beer in my horrid environment. White mold is my enemy. Here in the South, It is everywhere and most opportunistic. Yeah, a bunch of you Yanks thinks its all BS. I wish it was too.
But, with much experimenting with extreme sanitation procedures and methods, I can now say I CAN BREW IN A **** STORM. Bring on your molds and fungi, Bring on your bacteria (wimps that they are). None of them will prevail. Their cause is more than futile.
My evolved brewing protocol would cause most new brewers to throw up their hands and run, yet has become common practice to me, even habit. I am not complaining or bragging, here in my environment, it is just something I have to do to produce good beer. It was a choice, quite or find a way.
Well, I found a way. Even have some awards to prove it.
The motto of all of this is just use your God given common since and persevere.
But, with much experimenting with extreme sanitation procedures and methods, I can now say I CAN BREW IN A **** STORM. Bring on your molds and fungi, Bring on your bacteria (wimps that they are). None of them will prevail. Their cause is more than futile.
My evolved brewing protocol would cause most new brewers to throw up their hands and run, yet has become common practice to me, even habit. I am not complaining or bragging, here in my environment, it is just something I have to do to produce good beer. It was a choice, quite or find a way.
Well, I found a way. Even have some awards to prove it.
The motto of all of this is just use your God given common since and persevere.
Clintaurus
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No sir, first thing I said before clicking on this thread was "winds of ****" damn I love TPB
OP
OP
I think some folks are having a bit of trouble understanding what I am talking about when I say "closed system". See, I believe that the hot gasses and steam from the boil forms a protective envelope about the brew kettle such that it is effectively isolated from ambient atmosphere. That is, until the cool. At that time major sanitation methods must be employed in my case. In fact, IMHO, in most cases.
So far so good with my process. Here is a pic of a 9 day wort stabilization test.
What do you think?
Virtually all you brewers don't give a hoot abut some old goat in Arkansas's brewing problems. But, see, I'm Brewing in my wood working shop, with lots of oak sawdust etc Molds love places like this. Some of you may also be brewing in your woodworking space, so just thought what I have learned might help some folks.
So far so good with my process. Here is a pic of a 9 day wort stabilization test.
What do you think?
Virtually all you brewers don't give a hoot abut some old goat in Arkansas's brewing problems. But, see, I'm Brewing in my wood working shop, with lots of oak sawdust etc Molds love places like this. Some of you may also be brewing in your woodworking space, so just thought what I have learned might help some folks.
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First off I must say this is one of the best writing I have read in quite some time. You may feel as though your age is getting to you, as I have read through this thread, but I must admit this writing is both inspirational and admirable in my opinion. It is much like what one would read in US history, and perseverance is what we must strive for in order to produce a product which we can be proud of.
In this regard I appreciate your undertaking. As most, I believe, would cave in to their surrounding enemies. Those who would choose to undo your desired goal should be eliminated and your sanitation practices by far outdo most of what I have seen through your ingenuity.
Brew on!
OP
OP
Well, I appreciate the kind intention of your reply. Having a good wort stability test is just a part of the story though. Thanks for the kind reply.
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