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DoubleAught

DoubleAught

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My last three brews have all turned out really sweet and am hoping someone can help me pinpoint it. I brewed an ESB at the beginning of May and noticed it was a little sweet. Now I have a Kolsch and a Cream Ale that are both very sweet, almost to the point that I dont want to drink them. Now granted, those two are still somewhat green, two weeks in the bottle, not sure if that has anything to do with it.

I brew AG BIAB and mash between 150-152 for 60 mins, then will raise it up to around 170 for 15 mins. Then of course I will boil for 60 mins. I have a ferm chamber and it stays in the low 60's for the 3-4 weeks that I primary.

Anyone see anything that would cause these to be abnormally sweet, other than little conditioning time?
 
What are your gravity readings (OG and FG)?? Yeast used would help too. Are you using any software to figure out the recipes?

IME, if it's too sweet, then you either mashed MUCH higher than you thought (triple check your thermometer and get another to compare against) or the yeast you used didn't attenuate very well.

Also, with the yeast, are you in the correct temperature range for it to go to work? Are you measuring the ambient temp of the chamber, or the fermenting beer temp?
 
Try using less crystal malts (if you do) and mash at a lower temp maybe. Are you sure that the thermometer you use to monitor mash temps is calibrated?
 
OG on the Kolsch was 1.052, FG 1.012. It was the Midwest Kolsch kit, and dont remember which wyeast it was. My temp probe in the ferm chamber sits in a growler full of star san solution, so the temps I read are from that. I use two thermometers when I mash, although Ive not checked either for accuracy.
 
You can always try to ramp up temp towards the end of fermentation on your ales to see if it will attenuate a little more, but I doubt you'll get much from that. Definitely check your thermometers for the mash.
 
Looks like that Kolsch had over 75% attenuation.

What recipe did you use for it? At 1.012, it's pretty dry/good for a brew. Maybe the IBUs are just lower than you expected, making it appear sweeter (more malt forward). The hops could come out when the batches are fully carbonated, so I'd say there's still some hope for the brews.

I have an ale on deck that I expect to be a bit sweeter than some. I'm using a good amount of honey malt in it (pretty much the only thing besides UK 2 row). Right now the estimated OG is 1.062 and estimated FG is 1.014. It will have about 16IBU's in it (technically a cream ale type recipe), so te IBU/SG ratio is going to be low (0.265 currently). I might increase the hops a bit, or switch the time a little to get a bit more IBUs in it. I'm also going to be hop bursting the batch, so it's all flavor/aroma additions. :D
 
Golddiggie said:
Looks like that Kolsch had over 75% attenuation.

What recipe did you use for it? At 1.012, it's pretty dry/good for a brew. Maybe the IBUs are just lower than you expected, making it appear sweeter (more malt forward). The hops could come out when the batches are fully carbonated, so I'd say there's still some hope for the brews.

I have an ale on deck that I expect to be a bit sweeter than some. I'm using a good amount of honey malt in it (pretty much the only thing besides UK 2 row). Right now the estimated OG is 1.062 and estimated FG is 1.014. It will have about 16IBU's in it (technically a cream ale type recipe), so te IBU/SG ratio is going to be low (0.265 currently). I might increase the hops a bit, or switch the time a little to get a bit more IBUs in it. I'm also going to be hop bursting the batch, so it's all flavor/aroma additions. :D
Click to expand...

+1 on tweaking the IBU's
 
My response is along the lines as Stauffbiers. How much Crystal did you use?

I used to use crstals plugged into BeerSMith to get my color and it works pretty well in that regard. But to much and it makes a sweet beer.
 
I apparently didn't keep good notes on the Kolsh (shame on me), but the Cream Ale, which is not as sweet as the Kolsh is as follows...

7lbs 2-row
2lbs flaked corn
8 0z cara pils
2oz cascade @60
2oz cascade @2

mashed @ 152 for 90 mins
mashed out @170 for 30 Mins

Wyeast American Ale

OG 1.054
FG 1.012

I'm stumped where the sweetness is coming from other than it needs more time to condition...
 
DoubleAught said:
I apparently didn't keep good notes on the Kolsh (shame on me), but the Cream Ale, which is not as sweet as the Kolsh is as follows...

7lbs 2-row
2lbs flaked corn
8 0z cara pils
2oz cascade @60
2oz cascade @2

mashed @ 152 for 90 mins
mashed out @170 for 30 Mins

Wyeast American Ale

OG 1.054
FG 1.012

I'm stumped where the sweetness is coming from other than it needs more time to condition...
Click to expand...

If I was in your shoes I'd maybe use less cara pils and drop the mash temp to 149-150 and see if it helps.. Try a one gallon batch maybe... That's just me, though. Not sure if everyone else would agree. Also, check for conversion at 60 mins with iodine, and if you get good results start the lauter instead of mashing for 90 mins.
 
Thanks, I'll try lower mash temps next time around and see if it helps. I have 10 gallons of pilsner currently lagering that I mashed at 150. I hope it turns out not too sweet.
 
So I tested my thermometers today. I have 4 (I know, stupid OCD). Anyway, there are 3 digitals and an analog. The first two digitals are exactly the same, the 3rd is different. I brought distilled water to a rolling boil, then checked. The two identical digitals had it right at 212, the analog and the other digital had it at 210. So I'm thinking the identical digitals are the accurate ones, but decide to check it in an ice bath just as a fail safe. The two digitals read 34 degrees, the analog and other digital read 32. Now I'm confused, but start thinking the ice bath really isn't 32 degrees.

Then after some research I find this neat little website.

http://www.virtualweberbullet.com/boilingpoint.html

after inputting my elevation and baro pressure it turns out my water boils at 209.6 degrees today :eek:


I use one of the identical digitals for my mash, so it looks like if I'm mashing at 152, it was actually 154. I think on a couple I might have over shot by a couple degrees for a bit before allowing it to lower itself, which would have had it up to 156.

I think I've found out why my beers are coming out too sweet.
 
DoubleAught said:
So I tested my thermometers today. I have 4 (I know, stupid OCD). Anyway, there are 3 digitals and an analog. The first two digitals are exactly the same, the 3rd is different. I brought distilled water to a rolling boil, then checked. The two identical digitals had it right at 212, the analog and the other digital had it at 210. So I'm thinking the identical digitals are the accurate ones, but decide to check it in an ice bath just as a fail safe. The two digitals read 34 degrees, the analog and other digital read 32. Now I'm confused, but start thinking the ice bath really isn't 32 degrees.

Then after some research I find this neat little website.

http://www.virtualweberbullet.com/boilingpoint.html

after inputting my elevation and baro pressure it turns out my water boils at 209.6 degrees today :eek:


I use one of the identical digitals for my mash, so it looks like if I'm mashing at 152, it was actually 154. I think on a couple I might have over shot by a couple degrees for a bit before allowing it to lower itself, which would have had it up to 156.

I think I've found out why my beers are coming out too sweet.
Click to expand...

I almost stopped reading this half way thru to tell you that water doesn't boil at 212F at your elevation, but I decided to keep reading. I see that you discovered that for yourself. My water boils at 206F, and I discovered that the hard way just like you did! :mug:
 
I'm glad you got that figured out! I'm willing to bet you've just solved your "sweet beer problem"! Let me know how this changes things for you in the future...
 
Stauffbier said:
I almost stopped reading this half way thru to tell you that water doesn't boil at 212F at your elevation, but I decided to keep reading. I see that you discovered that for yourself. My water boils at 206F, and I discovered that the hard way just like you did! :mug:
Click to expand...

That is a very cool website. Turns out my water boils at 210.8 so not a huge difference, but thanks for sharing!
 
Stauffbier said:
I'm glad you got that figured out! I'm willing to bet you've just solved your "sweet beer problem"! Let me know how this changes things for you in the future...
Click to expand...

Yes sir, will do! I'm actually a little excited to see how it improves it.
 
The issue seems to be both mash temperature and recipe related. The FG is on the high end for both beer styles. The carapils may be overwhelming the 2-row and corn, as they're both very mild tasting ingredients. For the cream ale, the sweetness should come from the corn, rather than the carapils. You might want to try eliminating the carapils entirely, or at least cutting it in half.
 

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