What's the highest abv I can reach?

I'm curious what's the highest alcohol content I can reach and still have a beer that's drinkable. I'm not a huge fan of barleywine but I can go that route if its the only way. I'm looking to make a beer that I can pull out for my friends that want something different/new, then I can just pull out this bad boy and knock them into the wall :cross:. A novelty beer of sorts. I've been brewing partial mash but I'm planning on making a MLT soon for AG. I'll probably only want to make a 2.5 gallon batch of this stuff. Any cool recipes you guys know/have tried?!

Thanks

Why not a BW? What is it you don't like about them? Do you have any flavor characteristics in mind? And define "drinkable"...it varies from person to person.

I_Brew_Drunk said:

I'm curious what's the highest alcohol content I can reach and still have a beer that's drinkable. I'm not a huge fan of barleywine but I can go that route if its the only way. I'm looking to make a beer that I can pull out for my friends that want something different/new, then I can just pull out this bad boy and knock them into the wall :cross:. A novelty beer of sorts. I've been brewing partial mash but I'm planning on making a MLT soon for AG. I'll probably only want to make a 2.5 gallon batch of this stuff. Any cool recipes you guys know/have tried?!

Thanks

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Stouts tend to get boozy at around 12-13%, barleywines can go up to 15% (case in point DFH Olde School), and then there's the more extreme 120min IPAs, Paradox brews, etc that can round out upwards of 20%.

That being said, I'd try to keep it below 15% if you're looking for something to drink within a year, because it takes a long long time for the big boy beers to mellow out.

It should also be mentioned that yeast health is of the utmost importance to making high gravity beers. You need to be able to make big yeast starters, aerate with pure O2, and control fermentation temperature to end up with a well attenuated, drinkable beer.

Denny said:

Why not a BW? What is it you don't like about them? Do you have any flavor characteristics in mind? And define "drinkable"...it varies from person to person.

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I tend to get a sweet/warm flavor out of BWs (as well as Belgians) that I'm not in love with. I'm more of a high IBU IPA, pales, porters & stouts kinda guy. That being said, this beer wont really be for me so its sounding like I should go with a BW and shoot for around %14 so I don't have to wait an eternity. What type of container would you guys recommend aging in? Carboy? Bottles?

Also, what about Imperial IPAs? whats the abv cap on those? I had a pretty good one at Rogue in SF last night (asked the bartender for their highest alcohol beer).

I brew once a year a 3F Gumballhead that basically doubles the grain bill but only collect 6 gallons. I have had it go as high as 15%, but you need to have a HUGE starter and 4X the hops. Fun to make- great novelty beer. Doesnt take too long to mellow out ( 4 weeks in secondary). Its also great when I am having back pain.....;-) PS: adding extract malt helps achieve the ^ gravity...

My 5 year aging barleywine for my 50th birthday, made with 50 year old honey turned out to be 17.5% ABV. It's in an oak barrel now and is quite drinkable.

here is a thread of someone taking their DFH 120 clone up around 20%. I forget exactly what they were going for.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/dfh-120-minute-clone-259314/

tinman1 said:

I brew once a year a 3F Gumballhead that basically doubles the grain bill but only collect 6 gallons. I have had it go as high as 15%, but you need to have a HUGE starter and 4X the hops. Fun to make- great novelty beer. Doesnt take too long to mellow out ( 4 weeks in secondary). Its also great when I am having back pain.....;-) PS: adding extract malt helps achieve the ^ gravity...

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tinman: I like the sound of that! I don't think I've ever had a wheat with a super high alc content.

You have the recipe by chance?

Revvy: that looks awesome, once I'm out of college & get a place I'm definitely going to have to whip up something like that.

You can always try your hand at an eisbock of sorts. Lots of technique required, but you can get these to push 20%+ if you're lucky

I personally feel that after 9-10% it starts tasting more like liquor than beer.

The 'easiest' brew would be a Belgian. 10% is easy with rabid Belgian yeast and sugar adjunct. I was judging commercial beers last night and I only got through two before realizing I was too buzzed to continue.

I_Brew_Drunk said:

I'm curious what's the highest alcohol content I can reach and still have a beer that's drinkable. I'm not a huge fan of barleywine but I can go that route if its the only way. I'm looking to make a beer that I can pull out for my friends that want something different/new, then I can just pull out this bad boy and knock them into the wall :cross:. A novelty beer of sorts. I've been brewing partial mash but I'm planning on making a MLT soon for AG. I'll probably only want to make a 2.5 gallon batch of this stuff. Any cool recipes you guys know/have tried?!

Thanks

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most ale yeast can survive 12% under ideal conditions
To go big like a utopia clone you need stepped nutrient additions, during fermentation aeration and stirring, flawless temp control and switching yeast strains late in the ferment and feeding them. Its a lot more than adding more grain at the beginning.

And TIME, lots of time.

Revvy said:

My 5 year aging barleywine for my 50th birthday, made with 50 year old honey turned out to be 17.5% ABV. It's in an oak barrel now and is quite drinkable.

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i realize it's all a question of perspective, but those look like the world's largest homer buckets

Eleventy-million percent. That is the answer. How much drunkerer do you want to became?

Nightshade said:

I personally feel that after 9-10% it starts tasting more like liquor than beer.

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Man up and start drinking imperial stouts, Quadrupels, and other high alky beers that DONT have a liquor taste

nickmv said:

Man up and start drinking imperial stouts, Quadrupels, and other high alky beers that DONT have a liquor taste

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Ya know, something's wrong if you have to drink high ABV beers to prove you're a man.

I_Brew_Drunk said:

I tend to get a sweet/warm flavor out of BWs (as well as Belgians) that I'm not in love with. I'm more of a high IBU IPA, pales, porters & stouts kinda guy. That being said, this beer wont really be for me so its sounding like I should go with a BW and shoot for around %14 so I don't have to wait an eternity. What type of container would you guys recommend aging in? Carboy? Bottles?

Also, what about Imperial IPAs? whats the abv cap on those? I had a pretty good one at Rogue in SF last night (asked the bartender for their highest alcohol beer).

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The FG of BW are usually pretty high giving you that warm sweet flavor.
The Warm flavor goes away with age. But you can always try to cover both flavors up with lots of hops.

I will give it a shot:
Maybe start with a Belgium Triple recipe, increase the sugar to malt ratio to achieve 8-12% with a FG under 1.010, increase the late hop additions a bit to get in the IPA range. Use the Belgium yeast esters and hops to cover up the warm/hot taste rather than waiting.

Denny said:

Ya know, something's wrong if you have to drink high ABV beers to prove you're a man.

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Hahaaha, sarcasm was intended.

Denny said:

Ya know, something's wrong if you have to drink high ABV beers to prove you're a man.

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I don't think that was his point. His point was exactly what I thought when I read that same comment... that is, that there are plenty of styles that don't taste like there is much alcohol, even though there is.

JordanThomas said:

I don't think that was his point. His point was exactly what I thought when I read that same comment... that is, that there are plenty of styles that don't taste like there is much alcohol, even though there is.

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bingo. If he says he can't drink anything over 9% because of liquor-style taste, then he's drinking the wrong beers.

mredge73 said:

Maybe start with a Belgium Triple recipe, increase the sugar to malt ratio to achieve 8-12% with a FG under 1.010, increase the late hop additions a bit to get in the IPA range. Use the Belgium yeast esters and hops to cover up the warm/hot taste rather than waiting.

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Trippels 'out-of-the-box' are already 8%-10%. Adjust the entire recipe +10% (grains, adjuncts, hops) and you should be in the 12% range. If your friends complain about the ABV, tell them to drink faster and start looking for new friends.

If you don't pour your beer into a handle of everclear and down it through a beer bong your testicles fell off years ago.

ReverseApacheMaster said:

If you don't pour your beer in to a handle of everclear and down it through a beer bong your testicles fell off years ago.

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I lol'd

nickmv said:

bingo. If he says he can't drink anything over 9% because of liquor-style taste, then he's drinking the wrong beers.

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Thanks. I appreciate the clarification.

So after reading the responses (thanks guys) I'm thinking I want to get into the %15-20 range. I wouldn't mind having some liquor taste, I just want something that tastes like beer but has a serious kick to it. Like I said, this would be more of a novelty brew, not so much a session beer. I think my "still have a beer that's drinkable" was too vague. I'd be fine with making a "beer" with %35 (like a beer shot!) if that was possible but as nickmv said, it would take forever to age (right?) and I don't know if it's even remotely possible to get an OG high enough combined with yeast hungry enough, etc. to make that happen.

QUESTION: What happens If I just use the 2.5ish gallons of wort that I end up with after boiling my partial mash and pitched straight into that instead of adding the 2.5 gallons of water?

I_Brew_Drunk said:

QUESTION: What happens If I just use the 2.5ish gallons of wort that I end up with after boiling my partial mash and pitched straight into that instead of adding the 2.5 gallons of water?

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You get twice the OG the recipe was designed for. That may or may not translate into twice the alcohol, since you may have a higher FG. In just about any high alcohol recipe, it always helps to have sugar as part of the fermentables.

But my question is still...what do you want the beer to taste like? That's always where I start recipe design. Then we can work backwards from there.

how about something like a mocha porter on steroids

I_Brew_Drunk said:

So after reading the responses (thanks guys) I'm thinking I want to get into the %15-20 range. I wouldn't mind having some liquor taste, I just want something that tastes like beer but has a serious kick to it. Like I said, this would be more of a novelty brew, not so much a session beer. I think my "still have a beer that's drinkable" was too vague. I'd be fine with making a "beer" with %35 (like a beer shot!) if that was possible but as nickmv said, it would take forever to age (right?) and I don't know if it's even remotely possible to get an OG high enough combined with yeast hungry enough, etc. to make that happen.

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How about a Vanilla Oaked Bourbon Imperial Stout, with extra bourbon!
Saw one on BYO a few months back, also:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/help-vanilla-oaked-bourbon-imperial-stout-142775/

You can then freeze a portion of it for your beer shots!

I have RIS sitting now that's 11.7% and it tastes pretty smooth. It also depends on what grains and adjuncts u put in.

I_Brew_Drunk said:

QUESTION: What happens If I just use the 2.5ish gallons of wort that I end up with after boiling my partial mash and pitched straight into that instead of adding the 2.5 gallons of water?

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you would *potentially* get a beer that is twice as strong.

however, the strength of a beer is dependent on two main factors: the amount of fermentables in the wort, and the yeast's ability to ferment that much sugar. you would take care of the first (and easiest) half by not diluting (and/or adding more extract). the much tougher part is getting yeast to ferment that much sugar. unless you take extra steps, most yeast will crap out somewhere around 9-10% ABV. to break into the double-digits, you need a lot of healthy yeast that is alcohol tolerant, a lot of oxygen (read: aerate with pure oxygen), and several small additions of sugar. some belgian yeasts will take you up to 12-13%, WLP099 will take you up to 17-18% - if you play with them nicely.

simply pitching a "normal" amount of yeast into double-strength wort and shaking it a bit will not yield a 15% beer. it'll yield a sickeningly sweet 9% beer.

I would think a big Stout that is aged on Bourbon soaked oak would get most people pretty tipsy after a pint...

FuzzeWuzze said:

I would think a big Stout that is aged on Bourbon soaked oak would get most people pretty tipsy after a pint...

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Tell me about it ...

If you're really looking for novelty, you can take that high OG imperial porter/stout/barleywine recipe and pitch it with champagne or wine yeast.

CastleHollow said:

If you're really looking for novelty, you can take that high OG imperial porter/stout/barleywine recipe and pitch it with champagne or wine yeast.

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IMO and experience, champagne and wine yeast generally doesn't make great tasting beer.

start with the ale yeast, and you can try finishing up/boosting ABV with wine yeast... or better yet, use wlp099.

I_Brew_Drunk said:

tinman: I like the sound of that! I don't think I've ever had a wheat with a super high alc content.

You have the recipe by chance?

Revvy: that looks awesome, once I'm out of college & get a place I'm definitely going to have to whip up something like that.

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Cashmir Wheatwine

20# 2 row
16# white wheat
4# caravienne
10# bavarian wheat DME
8# raw wheat (cereal mash-4 gals water+2# 2 row- mash at 150 deg for 30 mins then bring to a boil for 30 mins. Add to mash tun at mashout)

All Amarillo hops:
2 oz @ 55
2 oz@ 15
2 oz @ 5
2 oz @ 0
2 oz @ DH (primary)

2 pkg nottingham yeast rehydrated in cooled wort, or one big starter (key to this one to work)

Mash at 154 deg ~ 60 mins

OG 1.132 FG 1.020 ABV 14.6%. IBU 26.4. Pre-boil 1.109. 90 min boil
Fermented at 65 deg- 14 days, secondary 14 days

Expect crappy effiecentcies.... 60% norm for me

BTW- that was for an 11 gal batch!