Im using this one for the first time. I originally had intended to drop 0.75 lbs of sugar into the fermenter for a little extra strength and apparent dryness, but all the stories here make me wonder if thats at all necessary to reach my goal, if not outright detrimental.
Heres my grain bill:
9 lbs Belgian pale malt
1 lb flaked wheat
1 lb Munich 20L
1 lb Caravienne
Mashed around 151.
OG ~ 1.050
Started fermenting @ 68, and plan to raise 1-2 degrees a day until it reached 75 and then hold.
Hailing all experienced 3711 homebrewers what do you think? Would adding a measly 0.75 lbs of table sugar significantly hurt or help?
Now I would like to a +1 to the conversation earlier about seeing a relatively low krausen with this yeast. I did a 1L starter on a stir plate, and usually see a good chunky head the following day covering up my vortex. With this one however, it looked like nothing but murky wort. No visible signs of yeast activity. Was a little worried, but I pitched anyway, and it did begin to ferment within 12 hours as evidenced by the airlock. But there have been no yeast theatrics to speak of. 24 hours later there were soapy bubbles on the surface, and 3 days later (today) Ive got a yeast head no thicker than my pinky. Still, lots of churning, so its working.
Im discovering that you have a very valid point regarding the unfermentables. I threw this recipe together on a napkin while driving from work to LHBS and didnt put my usual efforts into researching the style before I formulated my grain bill. Having now looked about a bit, I see that a pound of cara is not going to be to style, so I guess Id better start expecting something of a Saison meets a Biere de Garde. Which could be interesting nonetheless.I'd be worried about good attenuation and it being dry enough with that high of a mash temp and a full pound of caravienna. My saisons are mashed at 149 or lower and I only throw in a 1/4lb of crystal or cara malt. So that table sugar may be needed after all to help with the over all dryness.
Im discovering that you have a very valid point regarding the unfermentables. I threw this recipe together on a napkin while driving from work to LHBS and didnt put my usual efforts into researching the style before I formulated my grain bill. Having now looked about a bit, I see that a pound of cara is not going to be to style, so I guess Id better start expecting something of a Saison meets a Biere de Garde. Which could be interesting nonetheless.
(For the record, it turns out that I mashed @ 150, not 151. So, thats a wee help in the dry direction.)
I think I will go ahead and add the sugar. Maybe even bump it up to a full pound. If it's big, that's fine. It'll probably get stored cold in the keg for a couple months before getting tapped.
Thanks for the style navigation!
I have a question for all who have bottled with this strain. It might have just been my water or grain but my bottles all had a haze left on the bottom half with this yeast. This is the first yeast to really ever do that. When I pour no yeast pours out of the bottle either so I think the haze is the yeast stuck to the bottles. I dropped them an oxyclean soak and while I think the yeast are gone (if it is in fact yeast) there is still a haze left. I had to scrub them with a bottle brush.
Anyhow any one else experience a persistent haze from bottling conditioning with this yeast.
I have a question for all who have bottled with this strain. It might have just been my water or grain but my bottles all had a haze left on the bottom half with this yeast. This is the first yeast to really ever do that. When I pour no yeast pours out of the bottle either so I think the haze is the yeast stuck to the bottles. I dropped them an oxyclean soak and while I think the yeast are gone (if it is in fact yeast) there is still a haze left. I had to scrub them with a bottle brush.
Anyhow any one else experience a persistent haze from bottling conditioning with this yeast.
Appearance: Often a distinctive pale orange but may be golden or amber in color. There is no correlation between strength and color. Long-lasting, dense, rocky white to ivory head resulting in characteristic “Belgian lace” on the glass as it fades. Clarity is poor to good though haze is not unexpected in this type of unfiltered farmhouse beer. Effervescent.
To everyone worrying about the haze, check out this excerpt from the BJCP Guidelines for the style:
Tried a sample of the saison I brewed with 3711 on Sunday & the gravity was already down to 1.005 (OG: 1.050) after one week!
Normally I'm a long primary guy, so this is weird for me - but I'm almost considering kegging it after a week. Would anyone advise against this?
The sample tastes great, with a nice silky mouthfeel for how dry it is, and I'm not sure I want the gravity to drop below where it's at right now.
So - to keg, or not to keg (and let 'er condition a little bit)...?
Tried a sample of the saison I brewed with 3711 on Sunday & the gravity was already down to 1.005 (OG: 1.050) after one week!
Normally I'm a long primary guy, so this is weird for me - but I'm almost considering kegging it after a week. Would anyone advise against this?
The sample tastes great, with a nice silky mouthfeel for how dry it is, and I'm not sure I want the gravity to drop below where it's at right now.
So - to keg, or not to keg (and let 'er condition a little bit)...?
Quoting myself here for reference.Im using this one for the first time. I originally had intended to drop 0.75 lbs of sugar into the fermenter for a little extra strength and apparent dryness, but all the stories here make me wonder if thats at all necessary to reach my goal, if not outright detrimental.
Heres my grain bill:
9 lbs Belgian pale malt
1 lb flaked wheat
1 lb Munich 20L
1 lb Caravienne
Mashed around 151.
OG ~ 1.050.
Ok, so it's been in bottle for 2 weeks, and I drank a couple. Really, really tasty. Pepper notes are there, and some real sour/twang. You could almost call it a sour beer! Seems to be much stronger than the sublte lemon I get from Saison Dupont. Wondering if anyone elase has experienced the sourness?
Sounds wonderfully pure. Some folks'll tell you to reduce the crystal for increased fermentability, but as I have discovered for myself, this yeast can make short work of what would otherwise be only moderately fermentable worts.I am using this yeast in a pretty simple rec:
8# 2 row
1# 20L
1 oz pearle @ 60
1 oz saaz @ 20
1 oz saaz @ 5
Any thoughts?
Sounds wonderfully pure. Some folks'll tell you to reduce the crystal for increased fermentability, but as I have discovered for myself, this yeast can make short work of what would otherwise be only moderately fermentable worts.
Then I'll say a little prayer that you don't get a stuck ferment.It just dawned on me I have Belgian Saison and not French. Either way, that recipe will likely maintain.
Then I'll say a little prayer that you don't get a stuck ferment.
Actually, my sources tell me that the Belgian Saison doesn't really get stuck so much as it just slows. It hits the brakes around 1.035'ish, but as long as you can keep it warm and can wait several weeks or more, it'll eventually do the job you asked of it. This is all second-hand knowledge for me.I may run it back and swap it. Everything I read says to get 3711.
The guy at LHBS acted like he knew I'd be swapping it. I'm hoping to do mine prob next weekend, or early the week after.
Do you guys do a long secondary fermentation with it or anything?
Edit: I am also swapping out the 20L for Munich, and adding a little Carafa III for color.
Thanks for the feedback, I guess I won't ramp up the fermentation temp and try and keep it around 70 the whole time.
dcHokie said:Has anyone else harvested and reused 3711 with unexpected results??
For context, I've reused multiple other Wyeast strains without the yeast mutating much between batches before.
I previously brewed a Saison that had bitter lime peel, then harvested the yeast, and recently reused for a standard recipe Saison, but the batch turned out extremely tart. Its been bottled for about a month, and the tartness has a citrus-like bite and I'm wondering if it just picked up that lime peel, or if I've simply got some Acetaldehyde from using about 3 ounces clear candi sugar.
any feedback from the HBT hive-mind?
It can't be acetylaldehyde from 3 ozs of candi sugar. I'd bet the farm on that. I'd imagine it's the yeast. Did you use the whole cake from your previous batch? If so, you WAY overpitched and this is likely why the characters are so different. If you didn't pitch the whole cake then I have no idea.
dcHokie said:Haha, not the whole cake. I used a cup or so of slurry to get an appropriate sized starter going (used mr malty calculator).
DannPM said:Just checked my saison the other day, 1.057 to 1.005 in less than 4 days after pitching starter. Thing is a beast, great esters in the hydro sample too!
What temps are you working with?
Enter your email address to join: