Motorizing my Barley Crusher

My first two batches through the barley crusher with drill power had too much flour come through. I figure it is a good excuse to use an old 1/3 HP/1725 rpm motor I have in the basement.

So far the plan is to use a 1.5" (Pitch Dia. 1.05") and a 14" (Pitch Dia. 13.55") pulleys from Grainger.

that will bring the RPM's down to (1725 * 1.05) / 13.55 = 133 RPM, whcih should cut down on the flour that is produced.

For the physics types, how far out should I put the motor to avoid the belt slipping during "normal" use grinding grain?

I've looked at this site: Notes on Pulleys and Belts which has a pretty cool calcualtor, but I haven't had physics for years and I'm not sure what numbers are important and which aren't.

Thoughts?

A little flour is a good thing. Did you get a stuck sparge?
If I got a stuck sparge from a bit to much flour, I would first open the gap on my crusher a bit, that will alleviate the flour problem better than the speed at which it is crushed.
Not knocking your excuse to build more equipment. Hopefully someone that knows about pulleys will come along and help with that aspect.

the flour made what looked like fulffy clouds in the wort as I was was chilling the first batch on Sat. The second batch we filtered through an old set of pantyhose. There was less "cloud" in the second one, but there was still more than I was use to.

I used a Monster Mill for the rollers on mine, but it is the same idea you will just have to get some kind of bushing to adapt to your 3/8" shaft. Anyway, I also had a 1/3 hp 1725 rpm motor and decided to hook it up because the drill was slipping all the time and to keep it from jamming I had to run it way too fast. It is the best thing I have ever done.

I used 1.5" and 10" sheaves, so using a 3L belt put me between 189-190rpm. I don't know what the barley crusher is rated at but the monster mill is made to run between 150-250rpm. I chose to keep it under 200 since everything I read said you will get a better crush at that speed. So right now it can do over 6lbs a minuet at that speed and set at 0.037 I get 75% efficiency. As for tensioning, as you can see I took the easy way out and just let the motors weight do the work. I like this because it will allow the belt to slip easier if something got jammed in the rollers and I can also fold it in when transporting it and remove the belt very easily. It also saved me a lot of time because I already had the base made and didn't have to build a new one, I just screwed the hinges on and I was done.

Great idea.

I pulled the back cover off the motor last night and switched the wires around so it would turn in the opposite direction; stopped by Grainger this morning before work and will pick up a 1.5" and 12" pulley, 3/8 to 1/2 adaptor bushing and a 50" 3L belt this afternoon.

I looked at the numbers on that website that I posted and decided against the bigger 14" pulley. Actually a 10" would have been ok, but I like having the additional torque with the 12" and the lower speed.

Any ideas on an easy belt guard so fingers don't get caught up in the works? I imagine you'd be looking at an amputation or near that if they did get caught.

With a 12" you will have more power than you will ever need. I am no engineer, but my father is and when I asked him if it is a direct exponential equation of speed reduced to power gained he said it is pretty close. So with a 9x reduction of speed and a 1/3hp motor I am basically looking a mill with just over 3hp.

I agree that the 14" would have been to big, but the 12" should put you right at 156-157rpm and 3 3/4hp. That sounds pretty great to me.

I still haven't come up with any kind of guard, I plan to some time but for now I am the only one operating the mill and there is no kids or animals around. But I am still careful to only run the mill with the drive side away from me, because it would almost certainly be an amputation or at best broken bones.

A couple of pieces of thin plywood or plastic (sides) screwed to a 3/4" board (top, end) makes a nice guard. Too much bother right up until the trip to the emergency room, when it looks like very little bother at all, comparatively.

I'd strongly suggest bothering.

I have to put motorizing a mill into the nice-project-but-totally-unnecessary catagory. I use my Dewalt XRP cordless on mine and seriously, unless you brew once a week or more, it's not that much of a hassle to chuck a drill on. I even made my mounting base accomodate clamping the drill on so it's hands free. For the money you'll spend on sheaves, you might as well upgrade to a nice cordless drill that you'll use all over the house.

Bobby_M said:

I have to put motorizing a mill into the nice-project-but-totally-unnecessary catagory. I use my Dewalt XRP cordless on mine and seriously, unless you brew once a week or more, it's not that much of a hassle to chuck a drill on.

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I enjoy my brewday a lot more now that I have a motorized mill. I was using a corded 1/2" Milwaukee hammer-drill and it had a hard time keeping up unless you were just pouring it in at the same speed as it was grinding. That sucked because it almost always required a second person. So it is faster and it grinds at a lower consistent speed and I can do it myself. This may not be as big of a deal for some people, but I usually brew 3-4 times a month and do ten gallon batches. So although it is not necessary, it was one of the best additions to my brewhouse.

Bobby_M said:

For the money you'll spend on sheaves, you might as well upgrade to a nice cordless drill that you'll use all over the house.

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This I completely disagree with. I spent $15 total on my sheaves and V-belt, you cannot get a decent drill for that price. Even if you do get a very nice drill, milling with it is a lot of work for it and will substantially shorten it's life. Motors are made to do exactly that and with running for a half hour or so every month it will outlast any drill and will probably outlive me. I have less that $150 total into my mill setup, most of which was the rollers and I highly doubt it will ever give me a hiccup.

Where did you get your sheaves for $15? Mine are running me near $30, with the belt and adaptor it will be about $45.

Actually, I should have said that we get a discount through work, it would a bit over $30 for everything I got. I probably spent more like $20 now that I look at it, but the mill was still under $150 for everything, even at full price.

1.5" sheave $4.13
10" sheave $22.67
3L 40" V-belt $6.17

I was thinking that one nice thing about you going with the 12" is that if you ever want to run it faster you can swap out the belt for a 4L and it will run at like 196rpm.

RobertHSmith said:

Where did you get your sheaves for $15? Mine are running me near $30, with the belt and adaptor it will be about $45.

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Where from? Last I checked Grainger was the most reasonable here in town.

Getting mine from Grainger. They have a convient location on the way into/from work.

RobertHSmith said:

the flour made what looked like fulffy clouds in the wort as I was was chilling the first batch on Sat. The second batch we filtered through an old set of pantyhose. There was less "cloud" in the second one, but there was still more than I was use to.

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That's cold break. It's not due to the flour, it's actually proteins that precipitate out of solution when the temp drops rapidly. That means your chiller is working well...and so is your mill. If you're worried about flour, adjust your spacing ever so slightly....but if you haven't had a stuck sparge I wouldn't touch it. Like they say, crush til you're scared

On another note, I've heard that the barleycrusher needs to be direct-driven. The manufacturer even warns about this in the literature. The lateral forces put on the bushings and axle by the pulley will damage the mill. Other mills like the monster mill are okay with pulleys, but the BC is not. Buy a drill that you can lock the trigger to "on". I got a cheap but powerful corded drill from harbor freight that works awesome. I plan to build a table with a "jig" that seats the drill in a fixed position, but allows it to be removed for other jobs. To each his own, but do be careful with your mill. They're too expensive to break

ScubaSteve said:

On another note, I've heard that the barleycrusher needs to be direct-driven. The manufacturer even warns about this in the literature. The lateral forces put on the bushings and axle by the pulley will damage the mill. Other mills like the monster mill are okay with pulleys, but the BC is not. Buy a drill that you can lock the trigger to "on". I got a cheap but powerful corded drill from harbor freight that works awesome. I plan to build a table with a "jig" that seats the drill in a fixed position, but allows it to be removed for other jobs. To each his own, but do be careful with your mill. They're too expensive to break

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My LHBS has a Barley Crusher that is motorized and runs at like 500rpm. I wouldn't recommend doing it this way, but this thing has crushed thousands of pounds of grain and still works fine. So although it is less than ideal and had he know he would be motorizing it he could have gotten a different mill, I doubt he will destroy his mill by sticking a pulley on it.

If you wanted to be safe (and with a minimal increase in cost). You could use an intermediate shaft to direct drive the barleycrusher and connect your pulley to that. Use a pair of pillow blocks to support the shaft and take the strain of the belt tension. It'll take up more room but at least it won't harm your barleycrusher.

ScubaSteve said:

That's cold break. It's not due to the flour, it's actually proteins that precipitate out of solution when the temp drops rapidly. That means your chiller is working well...and so is your mill. If you're worried about flour, adjust your spacing ever so slightly....but if you haven't had a stuck sparge I wouldn't touch it. Like they say, crush til you're scared

On another note, I've heard that the barleycrusher needs to be direct-driven. The manufacturer even warns about this in the literature. The lateral forces put on the bushings and axle by the pulley will damage the mill. Other mills like the monster mill are okay with pulleys, but the BC is not. Buy a drill that you can lock the trigger to "on". I got a cheap but powerful corded drill from harbor freight that works awesome. I plan to build a table with a "jig" that seats the drill in a fixed position, but allows it to be removed for other jobs. To each his own, but do be careful with your mill. They're too expensive to break

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Good to know that it's probably cold break.

On the drill, I have 2 already and had this motor sitting in the basement. With either drill they bog down. I have a 3rd drill, but it isn't a variable speed. It is a huge 1/2" Makita hammer drill which would work too, but the speed isn't variable and if something got stuck in the mill, the mill would definately break using that bigger drill.

I'll be using the motorized mill in a week or so and will try to take some pics to post.

ScubaSteve said:

On another note, I've heard that the barleycrusher needs to be direct-driven. The manufacturer even warns about this in the literature. The lateral forces put on the bushings and axle by the pulley will damage the mill. ....To each his own, but do be careful with your mill. They're too expensive to break

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Word on the street is that this is actually about liability concerns regarding lopping off of fingers etc... But as mentioned above, they ARE too expensive to break! At least, for most of us.

Robert,

If you have the chance, can you snap a pic of your wiring on the back of the motor? Thanks!

Why not direct drive and vary the voltage to reduce RPM?

You can do that if you have a permanent magnet DC motor. If you try it with AC then the hertz change with the voltage, shortening the life of the motor. I went with an AC 1/3HP gearmotor with an output speed of 181rpm. No large pulley to build around or get caught in, just 2 small sprockets and a piece of chain. If you search long enough on Ebay you can get the motor for under $30 plus shipping. For a little more you could get a right angle gearmotor to reduce bearing stress on the mill and eliminate the sprockets and chain.

why cant u direct drive a elec. moter is this a homemade mill? reduce it get rid of belts chains 1 fourth hp will handle 200 rpm v .035 crush. fill out of a 2 liter bottle vol vs speed.

Do you happen to know where you got the 3/8 to 1/2 adaptor bushing?

Where did you get the 3/8 to 1/2 adaptor bushing?