Thoughts/Help on Hop Schedule for DIPA

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ejyoung

ejyoung

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I'm brewing a DIPA tomorrow and this is the grain I have (5.5 gal batch)

13.8# 2-row (81%)
14.4oz Munich (5.3%)
13oz Crystal 20 (4.7%)
12oz Cara-pils (4.5%)
6oz wheat malt (2.2%)
6oz honey malt (2.2%)

This is based on the Can You Brew It? KRBC Citra recipe. I don't have that much Citra, but I do have a lot of Galaxy that I want to use. Here's what I have:

8oz Galaxy (13.3%AA)
1oz Nugget (13.3%AA - want to use for bittering)
4oz Citra (11.4%AA)
3oz Simcoe (12.2%AA)
2oz Amarillo (9.3%AA)

I don't intend to use all of these for this beer, but a good amount of them. I hadn't intended to buy the Citra or Simcoe but they had both so I got a bit. Here's what I tentatively had, again based roughly on the Citra recipe:

1oz Nugget at 60min
1oz Galaxy at 30
1oz Galaxy at 15
1oz Galaxy at 10
1oz Galaxy at 5
1oz Galaxy at 0

1oz Galaxy and 0.5oz Amarillo first dry hop
1oz Galaxy and 1oz Amarillo second dry hop
1oz Galaxy last dry hop (all dry hops 3 days apart)

I'd also like to put the other 0.5oz Amarillo into the boil at some point to use it up. As it stands now the calculated IBU is 97. Other suggestions for the hops?

Also, any help on water suggestions would be great. Our tap water here isn't very good in Phoenix and we have a water softener, so I was thinking about getting RO water and treating with calcium chloride and gypsum. I read thru a good bit of the primer on here about it and from what I can see, if you want to use RO then adding the CaCl2 and gypsum is the thing to do.

Thanks!
 
Never used Galaxy before so I have no idea what that will bring, but I would incorporate some Simcoe and Citra in the boil, maybe at 5 and FO. I would also Dry Hop with them. I do an IPA with Chinook,Simcoe & Citra and it has some tropical fruit like things going on, and some Apricot too. So I think it's a good combo.
 
Really enjoyed a Yazoo Hop Project all Galaxy recently. Very nice.

My advice, worth exactly $.00:
1-use a hop-sack/boil bag to cut back on hop particles along with using a hop-sock weighted with marbles for the dry-hops. Also not a big fan of leaving DHs in for longer than 5-7 days especially in large quantities as it adds grass/vegetal tones.
2-move the 30 min addition to 20 mins and just add your .5 oz. 'extra' to any of the late additions.
3-Don't be afraid to load up on the 5-0 min additions as a lot of flavor/aroma can be added during this time. On this point there are allegedly some fine hop bomb commercial brews/breweries that concentrate flavor/aroma additions at flameout/whirlpool.

Looks good and tasty! Could be a bit too much caramel-etc. in for some, but it'll be a fine bier. Good luck.
 
Galaxy is less tropical than Citra, but it has an added grassiness with less myrcene content... which is the magic stuff that makes hops like Citra, Amarillo, and Simcoe so aromatic. It would work here, but not as well. I would recommend mixing it with Simcoe and Amarillo to create a sort of Falconers Flight blend of hops if you catch my drift. Then, you will have something more akin to Citra.

If you want to skip the 30 minute addition, I suggest moving it to flameout and compensating for lost bittering by upping the later additions. Are you sure you're reaching (and not exceeding) 68-72 IBUs Rager with the current bittering schedule??? A 5 gallon batch would be more like 0.75 oz for bittering and 0.50 for the other 4 kettle additions. Lastly, you'll want about 4.5-5.0 oz. dryhop for this to be more of a Kern clone.

Go with Crystal 10 instead.

14-15 oz. each munich, carapils, and crystal 10
6-7 oz. each white wheat, and honey malt
Base malt is 82% of the bill

I don't know how Kern gets down to 1.010 without sugar. Even by mashing at 148F, I see this reaching 1.012-1.014. I assume you're also using a big starter of fresh WLP001??

I would post in the Brew Science thread about your water. Tell them you are brewing a DIPA and need hard water, high in hardness low in alkalinity. Give them your current water report if you have it. I'm not sure that an "off the charts" sulfate/chloride boost is really that necessary for this beer because it's not all that bitter. But you should have good Calcium health and less than 20 ppm sodium and mag.
 
bobbrews said:
Galaxy is less tropical than Citra, but it has an added grassiness with less myrcene content... which is the magic stuff that makes hops like Citra, Amarillo, and Simcoe so aromatic. It would work here, but not as well. I would recommend mixing it with Simcoe and Amarillo to create a sort of Falconers Flight blend of hops if you catch my drift. Then, you will have something more akin to Citra.

If you want to skip the 30 minute addition, I suggest moving it to flameout and compensating for lost bittering by upping the later additions. Are you sure you're reaching (and not exceeding) 68-72 IBUs Rager with the current bittering schedule??? A 5 gallon batch would be more like 0.75 oz for bittering and 0.50 for the other 4 kettle additions. Lastly, you'll want about 4.5-5.0 oz. dryhop for this to be more of a Kern clone.

Go with Crystal 10 instead.

14-15 oz. each munich, carapils, and crystal 10
6-7 oz. each white wheat, and honey malt
Base malt is 82% of the bill

I don't know how Kern gets down to 1.010 without sugar. Even by mashing at 148F, I see this reaching 1.012-1.014. I assume you're also using a big starter of fresh WLP001??

I would post in the Brew Science thread about your water. Tell them you are brewing a DIPA and need hard water, high in hardness low in alkalinity. Give them your current water report if you have it. I'm not sure that an "off the charts" sulfate/chloride boost is really that necessary for this beer because it's not all that bitter. But you should have good Calcium health and less than 20 ppm sodium and mag.
Click to expand...

I'm shooting for 5.5 gallons but it does look like I am going over the 68-72 IBU Rager just with the 60 and 20 min according to the hop bitterness tool on Beersmith. That's the range for Citra right? I suppose I could tone it down a bit so it's a little closer to Citra, though I wouldn't mind a little more bitterness.

I could definitely add more dry hops, the schedule there was my converted grams to oz from the podcast though I'm not adding at 3 days after pitching because I can't drop the yeast. I do have a starter going with WLP001.

I will post in that thread and see if I can get some help. I filled up my 5 gallon jug with RO water today and can fill up more with my RO system at home. I would like to get our water tested, but the word from other homebrewers around here is that it isn't so great. I suppose a small amount of that with RO water wouldn't be bad though.

Thanks for all the tips.
 
MVKTR2 said:
Really enjoyed a Yazoo Hop Project all Galaxy recently. Very nice.

My advice, worth exactly $.00:
1-use a hop-sack/boil bag to cut back on hop particles along with using a hop-sock weighted with marbles for the dry-hops. Also not a big fan of leaving DHs in for longer than 5-7 days especially in large quantities as it adds grass/vegetal tones.
2-move the 30 min addition to 20 mins and just add your .5 oz. 'extra' to any of the late additions.
3-Don't be afraid to load up on the 5-0 min additions as a lot of flavor/aroma can be added during this time. On this point there are allegedly some fine hop bomb commercial brews/breweries that concentrate flavor/aroma additions at flameout/whirlpool.

Looks good and tasty! Could be a bit too much caramel-etc. in for some, but it'll be a fine bier. Good luck.
Click to expand...

I definitely always use a bag for the kettle hops and dry hops. I will look at cutting down the days of dry hop. Thanks!
 
ejyoung said:
I suppose I could tone it down a bit so it's a little closer to Citra, though I wouldn't mind a little more bitterness.
Click to expand...

My bad, I thought you wanted to get as close to Kern Citra as possible with your substitutions.

ejyoung said:
though I'm not adding at 3 days after pitching because I can't drop the yeast.
Click to expand...

What does this mean? You would not add the dryhops 3 days after pitching the yeast... more like double that. The head brewer even said not to be weary of the suspended yeast and that much of it will still be around at the suggested 67 F temp. But as long as you rack to secondary, you're fine.
 
bobbrews said:
My bad, I thought you wanted to get as close to Kern Citra as possible with your substitutions.



What does this mean? You would not add the dryhops 3 days after pitching the yeast... more like double that. The head brewer even said not to be weary of the suspended yeast and that much of it will still be around at the suggested 67 F temp. But as long as you rack to secondary, you're fine.
Click to expand...

I swear at the end of the podcast they were talking about how he dropped the yeast and added the first dry hop 3 days after. He talked about being worried about the attenuation doing that but it turned out fine.
 
The brewer said that if it's finished in 4 days, they still leave it in the primary for another couple days before their first dryhop addition. He also said that at a solid 67 F fermentation and dryhop temp, there will still be a lot of suspended yeast. And not to worry about this because he feels, in his experience, that the higher dryhop temps help the aroma.

As homebrewers however, our systems are a little different. Kern may have the ability to drop the yeast, whereas we resort to racking. Even so, I would be a little hesitant fermenting for 6 days, dryhopping for 9 days, and then bottling. I usually leave my IPAs in the primary for 3-4 weeks with the dryhops since I don't secondary too often. Personally, I would dryhop for the first stage in the primary and then rack to secondary for the other dryhop additions.
 
bobbrews said:
As homebrewers however, our systems are a little different. Kern may have the ability to drop the yeast, whereas we resort to racking. Even so, I would be a little hesitant fermenting for 6 days, dryhopping for 9 days, and then bottling. I usually leave my IPAs in the primary for 3-4 weeks with the dryhops since I don't secondary too often. Personally, I would dryhop for the first stage in the primary and then rack to secondary for the other dryhop additions.
Click to expand...

I like bobbrew's thinking and would simply ad that brewing processes/practices vary wildly from brewery to brewery commercially. The same is true for homebrewers. Personally I'm about to start practicing with higher pitch rates looking for 3-4 day full fermentation on most biers, gelatin to drop the yeast quickly, and turning standard beers around as servable in 13-17 days, ie brewpub time schedules.
 

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