Fermentis Safale vs. Danstar

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phatuna

phatuna

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I just reviewed my receipt from a purchase that I made over the weekend and realized that my LHBS is selling Safale US 05 for $4.95 per packet :mad:.

So I'll no longer make that mistake again, and have started looking online at buying dry yeast in bulk. I've visited a few OLHBS's and notice that Danstar is selling for around $1.40 - 1.50 per packet, while Safale is selling for double that amount (around $3 per packet).

Do you think that this is due to the recall and Danstar pushing to re-gain clientelle, or is Safale really 2 times better? I've used both Safale and Notty / windsor and really can't tell a difference between the two products (other than Nottinghams recall a few months back).

What say you?
 
Well, none of the Danstar products have the same profile as US05 to my taste. Both Nottingham and Windsor have a very English character to them while US05 is pretty clean. So it depends on what you want in your beer which you might use - I don't personally think there is a significant quality difference (barring the whole Nottingham debacle.) I have used US04, US05, Nottingham, Windsor, and Coopers dry yeasts for different end products.

I came at things different than most people - I started with nothing but liquid yeast and have migrated back to using more dry than liquid for the beers where a decent dry strain is available so I think I attuned myself early to using a wide variety of yeasts depending upon the beer. However, at $5 a packet I would be hard pressed to not look for an alternative...
 
I actually prefer the Notty for most of my pale ales, and I too have noticed the price difference. I still use US-05 for a couple of my brews but the price difference surely does effect my choice.
 
yeah, at one time Notty was like $1.99 and US-05 was like $3.75 and that made the choice pretty clear for me, since then US-05 has come down to $2.50 at my LHBS. All I can say as far as quality is that nottingham works faster, but not necessarily better.
 
$5! Almost like liquid yeast. I would shop elsewhere, as that is too much. If it becomes that much everywhere, I'd just buy wlp001/1056 in protest, even though I like the dry better.
 
My LHBS is still selling S04 and S05 for $2.50....should I go ahead and buy everything he has before he raises the price?
 
They are VERY similar yeast strains. US-05 is a mutation of nottingham so these debates are somewhat funny to me.

US-05 has mutated to be much more forgiving of temperature extremes than nottingham. It doesn't attenuate or flocculate quite as well as nottigham, but could very well be the most forgiving and neutral homebrewing yeast around.

Nottingham, if you have the ability to control the temperature of your fermentations, may very well be the most versatile all around yeast. If you ferement nottingham at 58-64 you will get a very clean, slightly tart, lager like, crisp brew. If you hit the "sweet spot" as I call it, between 64 and 67 degrees you will get a very neutral result, almost indistinguishable from US-05. If you hit 70-74 you will get some esters like banana and clove that may be appropriate for some styles. Don't go over 74 with nottinham. Nottingham will floculate(clear) better than US-05 and also attenuate better (dry out your beer).

Personally, I prefer nottingham over US-05, it is kind of like the grandparent of US-05 and is much more versatile. However, if I am lazy I just throw US-05 in a beer and it always works well.




Here is how you deal with the price of yeast. Buy yourself a few nice liquid strains, brew a low gravity ale with them and wash them.....then you have started a cycle of an infinite supply of essentially free yeast.
 
permo said:
They are VERY similar yeast strains. US-05 is a mutation of nottingham so these debates are somewhat funny to me.

US-05 has mutated to be much more forgiving of temperature extremes than nottingham. It doesn't attenuate or flocculate quite as well as nottigham, but could very well be the most forgiving and neutral homebrewing yeast around.

Nottingham, if you have the ability to control the temperature of your fermentations, may very well be the most versatile all around yeast. If you ferement nottingham at 58-64 you will get a very clean, slightly tart, lager like, crisp brew. If you hit the "sweet spot" as I call it, between 64 and 67 degrees you will get a very neutral result, almost indistinguishable from US-05. If you hit 70-74 you will get some esters like banana and clove that may be appropriate for some styles. Don't go over 74 with nottinham. Nottingham will floculate(clear) better than US-05 and also attenuate better (dry out your beer).

Personally, I prefer nottingham over US-05, it is kind of like the grandparent of US-05 and is much more versatile. However, if I am lazy I just throw US-05 in a beer and it always works well.




Here is how you deal with the price of yeast. Buy yourself a few nice liquid strains, brew a low gravity ale with them and wash them.....then you have started a cycle of an infinite supply of essentially free yeast.
Click to expand...

Hmmm, never heard this before. Do you have some kind of source? I'd like to read it.
 
permo said:
They are VERY similar yeast strains. US-05 is a mutation of nottingham so these debates are somewhat funny to me.

US-05 has mutated to be much more forgiving of temperature extremes than nottingham. It doesn't attenuate or flocculate quite as well as nottigham, but could very well be the most forgiving and neutral homebrewing yeast around.

Nottingham, if you have the ability to control the temperature of your fermentations, may very well be the most versatile all around yeast. If you ferement nottingham at 58-64 you will get a very clean, slightly tart, lager like, crisp brew. If you hit the "sweet spot" as I call it, between 64 and 67 degrees you will get a very neutral result, almost indistinguishable from US-05. If you hit 70-74 you will get some esters like banana and clove that may be appropriate for some styles. Don't go over 74 with nottinham. Nottingham will floculate(clear) better than US-05 and also attenuate better (dry out your beer).

Personally, I prefer nottingham over US-05, it is kind of like the grandparent of US-05 and is much more versatile. However, if I am lazy I just throw US-05 in a beer and it always works well.




Here is how you deal with the price of yeast. Buy yourself a few nice liquid strains, brew a low gravity ale with them and wash them.....then you have started a cycle of an infinite supply of essentially free yeast.
Click to expand...

Yep, I agree with a lot of what you're saying here, I ferment in the mid 60's and really can't tell much difference between notty and 05. Especially since I'm going to order a box of 25 packets, the order is either $35 for Notty, or $75 for Safale -05...
 
I'm kind of cynical about this. I used to use Nottingham almost exclusively. I liked the beer it produced, simple as that. When Nottingham went in the tank, I switched to Safale 04 and 05, depending on the beer.

A few months ago, I was given a heads up by my LHBS that Safale was jacking up their prices. This was in the midst of the Notty mess, so I stocked up, but I feel pretty sure that no matter how they spin it, it's because they knew they could get away with it.. The last of those are stting in my reefer right now, and once they are gone, I will go back to Notty. They seem to have solved their problem.

I could tell stories - I've seen this happen over and over in business, no reason to think that Safale would do any different than anyone else. As Charles Colson said, "when you've got 'em by the balls, their hearts and minds are sure to follow."
 
z987k said:
Hmmm, never heard this before. Do you have some kind of source? I'd like to read it.
Click to expand...



Ballantine Brewery used Nottingham in their ales. When the brewery was going under back in '78, Ken Grossman went and visited with the master brewer and it is purported that he brought back the yeast to his new fledgling brewery(Sierra Nevada Brewing Company) and from there it mutated to what we know now as California Ale yeast
 
That's not accurate. Ken Grossman sourced Cali Ale from the Siebel yeast lab. He was looking for a yeast with its characteristics and that was the one that best met his criteria. He writes about it in Beyond the Pale.
 
Funny here in Hawai`i at the LHBS Danstar's run about $4.75 while Fermentas run about $4.50. But I usually buy yeast online.
 
I've used both yeasts, with good results. I have also compared them by splitting a wort and fermenting side by side. The recipe was an APA. 05 attenuated more by 3 points, 1.010 vs 1.013 for the Notty. The 05 was also hoppier, maybe in part due to drying out more, maybe because the Notty floccs harder, stripping out some of the hops.
 
Why would you expect US-05 to cost less than WLP001 when it's more yeast when rehydrated and gives the same result?

Why would you expect a company to keep prices low when demand and quality are high? Oh, and they are trying to increase profits; i forgot

How is a couple dollars per batch not worth it if you like the resulting beer better?
 
Because by and large we are a cheap lot, Sticky. The top two reasons for homebrewing are to control quality and to control costs. For some, a few bucks difference per batch could mean waiting til next month to brew. It's a real factor; our hobby costs some coin. It's absolutely worth it, but costs need to be managed like any other part of the budget.
 
Ok. Seems like it's so minimal. I guess i see homebrewing as a bit of a luxury but it also has kind of a "moonshine" tradition to it i suppose
 

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