All my brews are stopping short of their estimated FG... thoughts?

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lordmaple

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So,

I've been homebrewing for about six months now. I'm on batch five.

My first batch was NB's Caribou Slobber; as expected, my first beer came out passable but not anything to brag about. Final Gravity was around 1018. (Predicted was 1012). OG was 1046.

Next I did NB's Milk Chocolate Stout; predicted was about 1018. Mine came out to about 1022. OG was 1046.

Then I made a Pale Ale; this FG also came in a little high, at 1016. (Predicted was 1010, OG was 1054)

At this point I started to wonder if I was doing something wrong. I was particularly concerned that I was measuring the beer's SG incorrectly. So I bought a Refractometer. I also started a different method of pitching my yeast, namely, rehydrating it in the fashion recommended in How To Brew, and I started to use the books recommended "Churn" method.

When I bottled my Honey Weizen, I tested the beer using my Refracto (I had the original gravity handy), and then did the "adjustment" calculations, and my beer came out to 1008. I was delighted; I thought to myself, man , I'm really glad I bought that book, it finally got me down to to the "magic" number I've been hearing so much about.

Then I cracked one open and drank it yesterday. "Man... this is... sweet." I thought, just a little too sweet for being at 1008. So I poured some of the beer into a cylinder, waited for the gas to bubble out, and then dropped in the hydro.

1018???

I understand that OG and FG , as far as recipe kits are concerned, are merely guidelines. The OG readings don't much concern me; I mean, sugar in, sugar out. It's the FG readings that do, because my own observations have been that all four of my batches have been slightly sweeter in taste than they should have been, and it's starting to get to the point where I can't really ignore it anymore.

Ok. So I have a few questions:

Most important:

1) What could I be doing wrong that is resulting in such a high FG? Do I need to make a Yeast Starter for all of these here batches? I've done both secondary conditioning (with the first three batches) and one-stage conditioning (with the weizen), and I still seem to be coming up short. All beers were in their tanks for 4-5 weeks before bottling. I used Safale US-05 and Safale S-04. All batches were hovering sweet at 65 degrees Fahrenheit during the primary fermentation phase and secondary phases. I understand the rules of apparent attenuation, but I used US-05 on the second and third batches ( the Stout and the Ale ), which I understand (quoting my friend) is a "balls-out booze yeast". So I'm kinda curious as to why the results are consistent across different yeasts w/different attenuations.

(For example, 16 / 54 for the PA would be about 71% attenuation, which is low for US-05, which people report 73-77 , even 80 attenuation for)

2) Am I just hallucinating? Is this not a problem? Is everything going according to plan?


Side questions:

1) What do I trust more, the Hydro or the Refracto?
2) What exactly goes into those adjustment calculations with the Refractometer? Is something assumed?
 
Lordmaple,
Based on what you discribe, I will guess that you are making extract brews. If this is the case, I find that the extract (liquid or dry) does not attenuate as well as all-grain brews in which you can control the attenuation through manipulation of the mash (temp., thickness, time, etc.). So, in order for me to get the gravity down, I substitute a percentage of the malt with cane sugar. This seems to do the trick. Also, you didn't mention aeration but if you're not aerating this could have a negative impact on attenuation as well. I'm just guessing without more information, and I'm hoping this is helpful. Also, I use my refractometer for both o.g. and f.g. but find the using the hydrometer for the f.g. is more accurate because my refractometer gradiation is not very defined. Finally, when checking the f.g. with the refractometer it is important that to realize the the reading will be different if the sample is take from the top or the bottom of the fermentor. I normally take the sample after racking to my bottling bucket or keg for more accuracy. Cheers!
mark
www.backyardbrewer.blogspot.com
 
Lordmaple,
Based on what you discribe, I will guess that you are making extract brews. If this is the case, I find that the extract (liquid or dry) does not attenuate as well as all-grain brews in which you can control the attenuation through manipulation of the mash (temp., thickness, time, etc.). So, in order for me to get the gravity down, I substitute a percentage of the malt with cane sugar. This seems to do the trick. Also, you didn't mention aeration but if you're not aerating this could have a negative impact on attenuation as well. I'm just guessing without more information, and I'm hoping this is helpful. Also, I use my refractometer for both o.g. and f.g. but find the using the hydrometer for the f.g. is more accurate because my refractometer gradiation is not very defined. Finally, when checking the f.g. with the refractometer it is important that to realize the the reading will be different if the sample is take from the top or the bottom of the fermentor. I normally take the sample after racking to my bottling bucket or keg for more accuracy. Cheers!
mark
www.backyardbrewer.blogspot.com

Yep; they are extract brews. I was aware of the F.G difference, this sample was taken from the bottom of the barrel after bottling. I was not aware that extract did not attenuate as well as all grain. Also, while I think I had aeration problems with the first batch, the "churn" method I alluded to basically calls for pouring the water from the fermenter to the boil pot, and then back from the boil pot into the fermenter. I did this twice, and then shook it around pretty vigorously in the carboy itself before pitching.

Thanks mark!
 
Yeah, it sounds like you have enough aeration with that technique. I'd think about just substituting some sugar for some of the malt. If the recipe is 6lbs extract, pull out 1lb and add 1lb. sugar. You might have to play with the percentage over a few batches to get the final gravity you want. Too much sugar may dry the beer out more than you like.
mark
www.backyardbrewer.blogspot.com
 
What are your predicted OG for the NB kits? I've done many NB kits and none of them had an expected FG, but always have the OG listed.

I like to target the expected OG vs the target volume 5(gal) before pitching yeast
 
What are your predicted OG for the NB kits? I've done many NB kits and none of them had an expected FG, but always have the OG listed.

I like to target the expected OG vs the target volume 5(gal) before pitching yeast

Caribou Slobber - 1052
Milk Chocolate Stout - 1050
Pale Ale (not NB) - 1060
Honey Weizen - 1048

The Honey Weizen came closest to the OG , at 1046-1047.

What do you mean by target the expected OG vs the target volume?

I'm getting the FG's from BeerAlchemy, btw, using the Yeast I'm using and including all the fermentables. The OG's dial in to what the recipe kit says. The FG's are generally off.
 
lordmaple said:
I'm getting the FG's from BeerAlchemy, btw, using the Yeast I'm using and including all the fermentables. The OG's dial in to what the recipe kit says. The FG's are generally off.

if BeerAlchemy is software, that may be the source of your cognitive dissonance. It's been my experience that beer software doesn't accurately predict FG.
 
One thing I do is realize that with my partial mash kits I get about 65% brew house efficiency when I have 4 lbs of extract.

I "mash" at a lower temp to get more out of the grains as I know the extract will not ferment all the way down to what I want.
 
I take a gravity reading after topping off to 5 gallons and stirring thoroughly. If its above my expected gravity I will add a bit more water, stir and repeat. Some kits are actually made to put 5.5 gallons in the fermenter to help compensate for wort loss from dry hopping. If your OG is too high, it may not ferment down to the FG you were expecting. Extract leaves more residual sugars too. It can be difficult to really dry them out
 
It also depends on how much crystal grains,etc were used in the extracts production to get the color,etc. More unfermentables will give an artificialy high reading. Besides the amount of yeast pitched vs the ideal amount & it's attenuation rate.
 
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