AAAAAAAAAAAARRRRGGGGHHH My Damn Roomate!!!

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fiddup_is_a_middup

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I just finished boiling the wort for my first lager and went to the keg fridge to grab my four gallons of 34 deg water to put in the fermenter and I find that he had unplugged the refrigerator some time ago. All the water was room temp. I have no other means of cooling the wort to 50 deg (the temp my starter is holding at, except in the lager fridge. the wort is sitting around 90 deg now. so who nows how long it will take. Man I'm pissed. Sorry had to vent somewhere. Anybody have a homebrew they want to bring to Columbia MO. Didn't think so. Have one for me!!
 
Try bags of ice dipped into the wort. Make sure the bags are sealed though b/c you don't want the water getting in and watering down your beer. Also Sanitize the bags. You can pitch lager yeast around 70f and get it going as long as you keep the fermentor at 50.
 
You could do both: make him shotgun a BMC, then while he's got his head tilted back roshambo him in the jimmy!
 
lol. my roomate's usually the one that's pissed at me cuz i'm always trying to get him to put more of his HB in the fridge when i drink all of mine :D

Shouldn't take too long, but yeah...he should be punished for his insolence
 
fiddup_is_a_middup said:
Anybody have a homebrew they want to bring to Columbia MO. Didn't think so. Have one for me!!

Man if my first two batches weren't sitting in the primary I'd bring you some. I'll be heading into town to celebrate the holidays with some friends.

Hmm no homebrew, but there is always flat branch?
 
Just after I posted this, my roommate arrived home. I sent him to the store for some Ice and all is well now. I'm gonn have to cut him off from the homebrew for a while. That'll learn'em good
 
fiddup_is_a_middup said:
Just after I posted this, my roommate arrived home. I sent him to the store for some Ice and all is well now. I'm gonn have to cut him off from the homebrew for a while. That'll learn'em good

Put a big sign next to the elec receptacle that says 'IF YOU UNPLUG THIS FRIDGE, I WILL CUT YOUR NUTS OFF WITH A RUSTY GARDENING TOOL'. That'll also learn'em good.
 
Why not? Even if he pitched at 90, it would be at his desired temp, 80 or 70 or whatever he's going for, within a few hours, what are the yeast going to do in a few hours? make a bunch of esters and ruin his beer?
Anyway looking at the timestamps this is hours old. Personally I would have pitched, and then gone to bed.
 
Imbranato said:
I've heard of people pitching at as high as 115 with no bad effects. I would have done it at 90 without worrying much.

Imbranato said:
Why not? Even if he pitched at 90, it would be at his desired temp, 80 or 70 or whatever he's going for, within a few hours, what are the yeast going to do in a few hours? make a bunch of esters and ruin his beer?
Anyway looking at the timestamps this is hours old. Personally I would have pitched, and then gone to bed.

Honestly I would not take this advice.

The temp will NOT drop to "80 or 70" in a few hours either.
 
fiddup_is_a_middup said:
Anybody have a homebrew they want to bring to Columbia MO. Didn't think so.

I'm heading to Columbia this afternoon!

Unfortunately I have a family function to attend this evening and will return to STL first thing in the morning....

I'll drop a line next time I'm coming to town.

fridgerunning.jpg
 
Imbranato said:
Why don't you let me know what is wrong with it then smartguy?

BTW it's 'There'

Haha....you are starting off great! Are you in the marines by chance?

I really need to quote various homebrewing experts to prove your advice is shoddy? Okay......
 
Sorry to stir this one up again, but lets just stop and think about what's going on here. You made wort, bitter sweet wort. As long as you keep it out of light to avoid skunking, and have done a good job with sanitation and sealing it off from the air what can happen to the beer overnight? It probably won't get stale, and if it gets oxygen in there good! Now, I've heard of other people brewing, sealing it off and then pitching the next day. I don't know if they were experts or not but they said that they made good beer. I think it'll be ok if you let it set a day, not ideal but ok.
 
Imbranato said:
I disagree, but there's nothing wrong with letting the wort sit and pitching in the morning either.

I think the main concern with that is that the likelihood of infection goes up a fair amount the longer it sits. You want the yeast of YOUR choice getting a leg up on the competition with first dibs not some random wild yeastie.

As for pitching at 90, I think he wanted to have the wort much closer to his starters temps to avoid stressing the yeast.

:mug:
 
Imby,

A few words to the wise...

  1. Dude never gets in fights around here. I've gotten into debates with him several times, and he's always been respectful.
  2. You started this thing down the wrong path when you got defensive in response to Dude's respectful disagreement. Um, what was it, you sarcastically called him "smartguy" and blithely corrected a meaningless spelling error. Not cool.
  3. Without any sort of additional cooling apparatus, the law of diminishing returns means that, sitting at room temp (probably around 70f), it would take more than a few hours for 90f wort to drop to lager fermenting temps.
  4. The longer your cooled/cooling wort sits un-inoculated by yeast, the better chance there is of something ELSE getting to it first (e.g. wild yeast or bacteria). If this weren't the case, then I highly doubt there'd be a need for the many products out on the market that are designed to quickly cool the wort (see: plate chiller, immersion chillers, counterflow chillers). I know a pro brewmaster who uses extremely expensive chiller sleeves around his conicals; something tells me he wouldn't have spent all that money if he could have just "let it sit overnight". Indeed, the worries about bacteria and wild yeast are real, and the quicker it's cooled to fermenting temps, the quicker the good yeast can get started, minimizing the chances of infection.
  5. There's really no need to get defensive when someone questions your assertions. These boards are renowned for being civilized (for the most part).
 
Trappist Artist said:
Sorry to stir this one up again, but lets just stop and think about what's going on here. You made wort, bitter sweet wort. As long as you keep it out of light to avoid skunking, and have done a good job with sanitation and sealing it off from the air what can happen to the beer overnight? It probably won't get stale, and if it gets oxygen in there good! Now, I've heard of other people brewing, sealing it off and then pitching the next day. I don't know if they were experts or not but they said that they made good beer. I think it'll be ok if you let it set a day, not ideal but ok.

No, not ideal. ideal would be making your jerkass roommate go to the store and get you a few bags of ice, which is exactly what Fiddup did.

You may have sanitized everything to the hilt, but that doesn't mean that there's no air in the carboy. And with no CO2 production, the air sits right on the wort. And, while the chances of infection are reduced if you seal it up nice and tight, that doesn't mean that there's nothing in that air that could infect it if given enough time.

I'd drive to the store and buy ice before I let anything sit overnight. It's not worth the risk for me.
 
Imbranato said:
Sounds like you get into a LOT of fights here so I'll be the grown up and walk away.

LOL! Hmmmm....who was the one that started with the name calling?

Imbranato said:
Why don't you let me know what is wrong with it then smartguy?


Back on topic, I don't even need to quote the experts to consider your above advice faulty. It is a well known fact that not only can yeast viability suffer greatly when pitched at high temps (above 86° f), but numerous fermentation faults that will affect the final flavor of the beer will occur as well. You'll create unwanted diacetyl, fusel, esters, and by allowing an extended lag time to cool down to "80 or 70" you are also allowing more time for contaminants to impose on the wort.

But, don't take my advice--let's quote an expert anyway. How about some Palmer?:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]8.1.3 Temperature Factors[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The third factor for a good fermentation is temperature. Yeast are greatly affected by temperature; too cold and they go dormant, too hot (more than 10°F above the nominal range) and they indulge in an orgy of fermentation that often cannot be cleaned up by conditioning. High temperatures encourage the production of fusel alcohols - heavier alcohols that can have harsh solvent-like flavors. Many of these fusels esterify during secondary fermentation, but in large amounts these esters can dominate the beer's flavor. Excessively banana-tasting beers are one example of high esters due to high temperature fermentation.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]High temperatures can also lead to excessive levels of diacetyl. A common mistake that homebrewers make is pitching the yeast when the wort has not been chilled enough, and is still relatively warm. If the wort is, e.g. 90¡F, when the yeast is pitched and slowly cools to room temperature during primary fermentation, more diacetyl will be produced in the early stages than the yeast can reabsorb during the secondary stage. Furthermore, primary fermentation is an exothermic process. The internal temperature of the fermentor can be as much as 10F above ambient conditions, just due to yeast activity.
[/FONT]


I don't think that it is any secret that every professional brewer would never pitch that warm, nor should we as homebrewers. IMHO, you are doing an incredible disservice to your beer and your time if you don't take care of the yeast. It is only the most important aspect of homebrewing.

I'm not going to let younger brewers read something that is totally off the cuff false information.
 
Evan! said:
Imby,

A few words to the wise...
  1. Dude never gets in fights around here. I've gotten into debates with him several times, and he's always been respectful.
  2. You started this thing down the wrong path when you got defensive in response to Dude's respectful disagreement. Um, what was it, you sarcastically called him "smartguy" and blithely corrected a meaningless spelling error. Not cool.
  3. Without any sort of additional cooling apparatus, the law of diminishing returns means that, sitting at room temp (probably around 70f), it would take more than a few hours for 90f wort to drop to lager fermenting temps.
  4. The longer your cooled/cooling wort sits un-inoculated by yeast, the better chance there is of something ELSE getting to it first (e.g. wild yeast or bacteria). If this weren't the case, then I highly doubt there'd be a need for the many products out on the market that are designed to quickly cool the wort (see: plate chiller, immersion chillers, counterflow chillers). I know a pro brewmaster who uses extremely expensive chiller sleeves around his conicals; something tells me he wouldn't have spent all that money if he could have just "let it sit overnight". Indeed, the worries about bacteria and wild yeast are real, and the quicker it's cooled to fermenting temps, the quicker the good yeast can get started, minimizing the chances of infection.
  5. There's really no need to get defensive when someone questions your assertions. These boards are renowned for being civilized (for the most part).

Thanks, Evan!, couldn't have said it better myself.

Let's keep it civilized around here; Imbranato, there's no need to be a smart-aleck. That doesn't play well around here. Nobody likes a spelling-Nazi, either. Consider this your warning.

EDIT: And Fiddup? Go kick your roommate in the balls, anyway. For us.
 
Dude said:
Their isn't? Where are you getting this keen advice? :rolleyes:

Evan, I think this is where it got ugly, and it wasn't my post.

Believe it or not I'm also here to learn, and a lot of you have more experience than me. I think there are two schools of thought here, one structured and scientific, and the other RDWHAHB.
My thoughts are: Pitch the yeast, plug the refridgerator, put the beer in the fridge, and don't worry about it.

Am I wrong in thinking that anything negative that these temps produce will be negligable, especially if the beer is at nominal temp during HK? I find it hard to swallow.

The origional poster is long gone, and his beer is long since cooled.
 
Imbranato said:
Why not? Even if he pitched at 90, it would be at his desired temp, 80 or 70 or whatever he's going for, within a few hours, what are the yeast going to do in a few hours? make a bunch of esters and ruin his beer?
Anyway looking at the timestamps this is hours old. Personally I would have pitched, and then gone to bed.
Imbranato said:
Am I wrong in thinking that anything negative that these temps produce will be negligable, especially if the beer is at nominal temp during HK? I find it hard to swallow.

In short...yes...

Here are a few more things to think about:

If the yeast were a particularly hearty strain, it might really take off at high pitching temperatures. A vigorous fermentation creates heat, so the wort would actually remain at a relatively high temperature for longer than it would have without yeast activity.

Yeast works hardest during the first few days of fermentation. Many beers will actually rapidly approach their final gravity within three to four days, then finish slowly as the fermentable material diminishes. Most of the flavors for which the yeast are responsible are produced in the first few days, if not hours, of fermentation. To pitch at a high temperature would likely produce quite a few off flavors, including esters, diacetyl, and fusel alcohols. High temperatures also increase the rate of yeast mutation.

In addition, the beer in question is a lager. The ill effects and off flavors created from pitching lager yeast at high temperatures are well documented. Most lager brewers will chill their wort to 50-60 degrees before pitching, and some will actually recommend pitching at even colder temperatures.

You may well have heard of someone pitching yeast at abnormally high temperatures without noticing any ill effects. Perhaps that person got pretty lucky, perhaps the beer was a steam beer or hefeweissen where esters are desirable, or perhaps that person's palate was not detecting the flaws created by his haste.
 
We need an icon indicating that a poster is going to fall on his/her sword and there isn't any thing anyone can do about it.

Edit: Crisis Averted?

In general though: the need is there.
 
Imbranato said:
Why don't you let me know what is wrong with it then smartguy?
I didn't expect a kind of Spanish Inquisition
post-7-71517-Monty_Python_Spanish_Inquisition.jpg


scottthorn said:
I'll drop a line next time I'm coming to town.

Yeah, let me know. You can come over and have a homebrew at my homebar
5918-Phils_Bar001.jpg


After sending my roommate to the store and icing my wort down, I was able to get it to 50 deg by midnight and pitched my starter. All is well, but if anyone still wants to bring me homebrew...
 

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