First RIMS brew! Questions/Observations

Hey all.

My wort is boiling behind me, so the title is a bit misleading. I'm not quite done with my first brew day using a RIMS system.

A little bit about my system. I started off as a eBIAB person and have slowly made my way towards multiple vessel systems due to my inability to achieve certain perimeters.

Today, I used a 10 Gallon round cooler with a false bottom, CPVC Dip tube, a BIAB Bag and an awesome RIMS tube from Bobby over at Brewhardware.

The biggest problem I encountered was my inexperience. I'm not sure how well I can ride the line between compacted grain bed and perfect grain bed. My circulation flow is merely a trickle. Nowhere near the seeming average 1 gallon a minute. I also worry about tunneling as I just have the bare end of the the sitting in the grain bed, and it's rigid enough that it forces it's way down without regard.

Questions:

I can hardly run more than a trickle without apparently compacting the grain bed. I'm assuming the solution is to ditch the BIAB bag, or just continue to run a very slow recirculation.

Secondly, if my return tube just buries itself into the mash, it is going to tunnel. What to people use to lay the wort on top of itself? I see a lot of manifolds etc but Bobby's site warms against anything ridgid because if it blocks up, it essentially turns the rims tube into a pipe bomb, which by all reports, it a sub-optimal outcome.

I used a siphon spray tip, but it's smaller than the silicone hose diameter and would require a hose clamp to stay put at a higher flow rate.

Please advise,

Mark

I use loc-line as my return, and lots of other folks just use a short length of silicone tubing which works well for them. When you're starting the recirc I strongly suggest just barely cracking the valve and letting the wort flow for a couple of minutes at a slower pace just to help set the bed, then you can open her up a bit.

Do you prime the pump, shut the valve, turn on the pump, then crack the valve? Or do you prime the pump, turn on the pump, then back off the valve?

KramE said:

Do you prime the pump, shut the valve, turn on the pump, then crack the valve? Or do you prime the pump, turn on the pump, then back off the valve?

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Do you not have a valve on the return-port? You can't restrict the in-flow on these mag pumps. You need to regulate volume by a ball-valve after the pump.

Do you grind you own grain? If so what mill gap do you use. Usually BIAB can mill finner without stuck sparge issues, could you have overlooked the need to adjust your crush?

I have a valve on the output of the pump only, so no, on the output of the rims tube.

I do not grind my own grain. I order mostly from brew master's warehouse

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I don't use a full false bottom but rather a screen tube from bargain outfitters and then I use an even finer copper screen tube inside of that which has worked awesome so far... two brews and not even a hint of a stuck sparge. Or flow to my herms coil. I use a smaller topsflo 12v pump but the flow is close to 5 gallons per minute.... (12L per minute I think) my old system would plug if I SET THE FLOW AT 1/4 of the speed.
I also found that an old stainless strainer with few larger holes (part of a steamer system I think) works well if I lay it on top of my grain bed and let the silicone hose coil around slightly and drain into it.

I have my pumps controlled with a pwm knob but I mash through the herms coil sometimes at full speed and have sparged at full speed.

I would ditch the BIAB bag and just go with the false bottom. Here's my method:

Fill the MLT with strike water and recirculate through the pump, RIMS tube and return until temperature is stable at the strike temperature. That assures me that the pump is primed and the MLT has been preheated. Stop the pump, close the valve on the pump output, then mash in. After stirring thoroughly, start the pump and barely open the valve. Recirculate a couple of minutes and then gradually open the valve more until there is a good flow. I also use BobbyM's Loc-Line for return, adjusting it to just above the grain bed.

Do you have pics of your crush? It could be that simple. I just stuck my new falsebottom (crushed too tight) but it did lend 90% efficiency.

ChuckO said:

I also use BobbyM's Loc-Line for return, adjusting it to just above the grain bed.

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Are the Loc-Lines hard to clean?

Any advantage to the one Bobby sells over the ones from loc-line?

disney7 said:

Are the Loc-Lines hard to clean?

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I just pumped pbw and water for a while through mine after I got all the grains out of my mash tun and it cleaned up just fine. Wiped down all the links with a wet cloth and splashed some of the pbw cleaner on it and it came out good as new

augiedoggy said:

Any advantage to the one Bobby sells over the ones from loc-line?

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I would say loc-line is loc-line chime in anyone if i'm wrong but the one Bobby sells has all the fittings and such for a one stop shop and it works out great.

Indian_villager said:

Do you have pics of your crush? It could be that simple. I just stuck my new falsebottom (crushed too tight) but it did lend 90% efficiency.

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Sadly, I don't. I have some small batch stuff that I ordered from the same place. I'll post a picture tonight.

M

Nothing special about my locline kits. You can piece them together from other vendors if it works out cheaper for you.

Sorry about the delay...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/whistlingtripod/11981334025/player/4a4b3ef84a

Sorry, I tried 3-4 times to get the photo to show up. Did the [IMG="xyz"] with no luck.

Bobby_M said:

Nothing special about my locline kits. You can piece them together from other vendors if it works out cheaper for you.

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thanks,
I wasnt sure if you modified them in some way... I believe I saw you use them in a youtube video a while back.. I am still doing what I would consider test brews on my new setup and deciding which options are best for my liking but the lockline does seem like it works well and is a great idea.

loc-line is the best. I had the problem with a silicone tube burying itself. You just point the loc-line where you want it. Not hard to clean. I use it to sparge through, so that gets the inside good enough. Little light scrubbing in the sink gets the outside. Don't wait too long to clean the outside. Once the sugar water hardens it gets much harder to clean

BadWolfBrewing said:

loc-line is the best. I had the problem with a silicone tube burying itself. You just point the loc-line where you want it. Not hard to clean. I use it to sparge through, so that gets the inside good enough. Little light scrubbing in the sink gets the outside. Don't wait too long to clean the outside. Once the sugar water hardens it gets much harder to clean

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I was setting my silicone hose in a flat bottomed steam tray which prevented that but...

I purchased loc-line but I also got about 4 ft of the orange loc line with the little side holes in each section so I might get creative... I found it on ebay for $6 and $2 shipping for all which was much lower than its original cost I'm sure but all four packages were new and unopened so I jumped on it. I saw someone using them on youtube (It might have even been one of Bobbys older videos I cant remember. but I bought a cap for the end so this will act like a gentle sprinkler.

Bobbys prices for the black kit he sells are actually very good compared to what I found.

ChuckO said:

I would ditch the BIAB bag and just go with the false bottom. Here's my method:

Fill the MLT with strike water and recirculate through the pump, RIMS tube and return until temperature is stable at the strike temperature. That assures me that the pump is primed and the MLT has been preheated. Stop the pump, close the valve on the pump output, then mash in. After stirring thoroughly, start the pump and barely open the valve. Recirculate a couple of minutes and then gradually open the valve more until there is a good flow. I also use BobbyM's Loc-Line for return, adjusting it to just above the grain bed.

Click to expand...

I do something very similar but I dont have a loc-line setup - but I might be upgrading. I have a copper return manifold which looks like and "H" with elbows on the ends turned up which sits on top of the grain bed - works great and I've only had a few stuck mashes in 40 or 50 batches - BUT, you cant stir the mash with that manifold in place - hence the reason for the future upgrade...

One other thing I forgot to mention - I run 1.35 qt/lb of grain for strike water - I found the 1qt/lb or 1.25 qt/lb wasnt enough. Soupier works easier in a RIMS and I'd guess in a HERMS too but it does have some affect on the enzyme action I hear.

atoughram said:

One other thing I forgot to mention - I run 1.35 qt/lb of grain for strike water - I found the 1qt/lb or 1.25 qt/lb wasnt enough. Soupier works easier in a RIMS and I'd guess in a HERMS too but it does have some affect on the enzyme action I hear.

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Given that I go with around 3qt/lb for BIAB with great results, I wouldn't worry about it.

I went ahead and ordered the loc line and a couple other things from Bobby_M. I'm actually a little excited about the vacuum Guage. It's sitting at the post office, waiting for me. But it's Sunday. Boo

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KramE said:

I went ahead and ordered the loc line and a couple other things from Bobby_M. I'm actually a little excited about the vacuum Guage. It's sitting at the post office, waiting for me. But it's Sunday. Boo

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What parts did you order to work with the vacuum guage? I sent an email to brewhardware with this question and never got a resoponse and would like that set up as well but have no clue what parts it screws into and such. I just have the standard ball valve and cam loc coming out of the MT

I'm surprised that Bobby didn't reply, he usually responds quickly.

The vacuum gauge is 1/4" NPT, so you need a 1/2" T piece with a 1/2" to 1/4" reducing bushing, all of which Bobby sells on his site.

I have a very short length of tubing from my mash tun to pump, so I plan on installing it directly to the inflow of the pump

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KramE said:

I'm surprised that Bobby didn't respond, he's usually responds quickly.

The vacuum gauge is 1/4" NPT, so you need a 1/2" T piece with a 1/2" to 1/4" reducing bushing, all of which Bobby sells on his site.

I have a very short length of tubing from my mash tun to pump, so I plan on installing it directly to the inflow of the pump

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Maybe a busy week no big deal thanks for the parts list

Sorry man, there are some days when the combination of order volume and emails gets the best of me and I'm struggling with staffing too.

As above, you'd need a 1/2 x 1/4" hex reducing bushing and then a 1/2" tee. Location has a few choices as long as it's between the mash tun drain and the pump inlet. You can put it between your tun and ball valve or you can also make an inline assembly where the front of the tee has a camlock B, the backside has a cam F and the top port has the gauge. This lets you temporarily put it inline and then take it out when you're done recirculating.

jeffmeh said:

Given that I go with around 3qt/lb for BIAB with great results, I wouldn't worry about it.

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But the knowledge is always worth sharing!

I finally completely modified my cooler MLT to be a bottom drain. That goes into a 2qt stainless grant and I pump from there, this way I never put pump vacuum on the grain bed.

helibrewer said:

I finally completely modified my cooler MLT to be a bottom drain. That goes into a 2qt stainless grant and I pump from there, this way I never put pump vacuum on the grain bed.

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That sounds like a cool set up. Do you have a picture?

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KramE said:

That sounds like a cool set up. Do you have a picture?

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I need to take some. Today I finalized the prototype for a fluid level control for the grant so I don't have to monitor it. I wrote a simple Arduino sketch that I loaded onto a Teensy 3.1 board. The high and low sensors are just pairs of wires with a pull-up resistor and cap as a filter.

Now I will be able to set my drain rate from the MLT with a ball valve and automatically cycle my pump to maintain a reasonable level in the grant for recirc and fly sparging.

I got my loc line today... hopefully Bobby preassembles the pieces because they are NOT fun to assemble...Of course I'm sure they make a tool or theres some trick I dont know about.
Im excited to try it though.

augiedoggy said:

I got my loc line today... hopefully Bobby preassembles the pieces because they are NOT fun to assemble...Of course I'm sure they make a tool or theres some trick I dont know about.
Im excited to try it though.

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I also ordered one of those yesterday... Hope it will be here before the weekend!

augiedoggy said:

I got my loc line today... hopefully Bobby preassembles the pieces because they are NOT fun to assemble...Of course I'm sure they make a tool or theres some trick I dont know about.
Im excited to try it though.

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They do make a tool for it. I didn't find any tricks when I was putting mine together. I tried for a long time and couldn't manage, had given up and was going to order the tool. Then I learned my wife has more upper body strength than I do apparently...

It comes pre-assembled. I got mine today! And now I have to order more stuff from him. Wonder why he's always so busy....

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KramE said:

Wonder why he's always so busy....

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Quality products at a decent price probably!

Bobby_M said:

Sorry man, there are some days when the combination of order volume and emails gets the best of me and I'm struggling with staffing too.

As above, you'd need a 1/2 x 1/4" hex reducing bushing and then a 1/2" tee. Location has a few choices as long as it's between the mash tun drain and the pump inlet. You can put it between your tun and ball valve or you can also make an inline assembly where the front of the tee has a camlock B, the backside has a cam F and the top port has the gauge. This lets you temporarily put it inline and then take it out when you're done recirculating.

Click to expand...

No problem and as stated I figured you were just busy and thanks for the reply. Before I order which vacuum gauge is the correct one for a RIMS system? 0-30psi I would guess?