Wyeast 3724 Dropped 15° day 9.

[AquaticHarpy]

Recently I started my first all grain BIAB brew, I intended to brew a saison and all went well for the first 9 days, temp stayed around 90-100 and I keep the carboy in a small tote with a heater to maintain temperature. Today I came home from work and found the carboy had dropped to 72 degrees, I turned the heater up a hair and it kicked back on, how will this affect my brew? Is there anything I can do to help it? I plan on letting 1oz of hibiscus and .75oz dry lemon peel sit on vodka overnight and day 10, (tommorrow) was when I had planned to rack to secondary and add the vodka/hibiscus lemon mixture, after that I planned to let it sit for 7 more days before bottling. Airlock activity was moderate, a bubble every 10 seconds last night, now around every 20 seconds. I'm assuming the yeast started to run out of food today causing the temp to drop perhaps. Im very excited for this beer and I'm hoping she still turns out. Any tips for this brew and future brews, Id love!

Cheers,
Bailey

 

[hotbeer]

I've not used that yeast, but the ideal temp range is stated to be 70 - 95°F (21-35°C). So you are still good. And probably that was expected by what ever recipe you are going by unless there were instructions to keep a specific fermentation temp the entire time.

With all my brews, the beer temp only climbs during the active part of the fermentation which is only for 18 - 24 hours maybe 36 or more if a really big beer.

After the krausen is over they always go back down to pretty much ambient air temps for the majority of the time in the FV.

You can probably also assume that your brew is very close if not already at FG, but wouldn't rush the beer to the bottle or keg. Be patient till it's been in the FV for 2 to 3 weeks or more. All my bad beers were the beers that I took out of the FV in less than 10 days.

 

[AquaticHarpy]

I brought it back up to 90 and the bubbles got goin again, going to keep her goin

 

[hotbeer]

Bubbles are misleading at times. So don't put much into whether you have them or not.

 

[AquaticHarpy]

I'll be adding the hibiscus as well as the lemon today and transferring to secondary. I plan on sanitizing everything, boiling the lemon and hibiscus together, adding them to the secondary, then pumping the contents of the primary into the secondary, likely with just a bottling pump as I feel lifting the primary to create a siphon would result in unnecessary agitation.

 

[hotbeer]

......and transferring to secondary.

Have you brewed much and used secondary fermenters often?

I don't recommend them at all for those recently started out in beer brewing. Nor do most of us with a fair number of brews behind us. Too much risk for the very little if any benefit there is.

Even the guy that wrote one of the very popular books on brewing beer sort of indicated he regretted recommending their use in the first edition of his book.

 

[AquaticHarpy]

Have you brewed much and used secondary fermenters often?

I don't recommend them at all for those recently started out in beer brewing. Nor do most of us with a fair number of brews behind us. Too much risk for the very little if any benefit there is.

Even the guy that wrote one of the very popular books on brewing beer sort of indicated he regretted recommending their use in the first edition of his book.

Would you recommend adding the boiled hibiscus and lemon directly to primary and letting it sit the rest of the 7 days?

 

[hotbeer]

Would you recommend adding the boiled hibiscus and lemon directly to primary and letting it sit the rest of the 7 days?

I don't do any additions after the boil any more. Mostly because the beer I've been brewing doesn't call for those additions.

If I was to start, then I'd just follow the same schedule that is called for in the recipe. Except that I wouldn't transfer the beer to a secondary.

If you are suppose to add something on day 2 of the secondary, then that would be the days they told you to transfer to the secondary plus 2 days.

I've left beers in the primary for 6 weeks and they were all very good beers.

 

[AquaticHarpy]

I wrote this recipe by hand, I'd like to be able to add my ingredients today but if you dont reccomend using a secondary would it be safe to boil them and add them to the primary for the rest of fermentation?

 

[Rish]

I wrote this recipe by hand, I'd like to be able to add my ingredients today but if you dont reccomend using a secondary would it be safe to boil them and add them to the primary for the rest of fermentation?

It would be safe,however, when I've boiled hibiscus it resulted in a "woody" taste. I prefer to do a hot steep for 15 minutes or so to extract flavor and pasteurize.

 

[IslandLizard]

I plan on letting 1oz of hibiscus and .75oz dry lemon peel sit on vodka overnight and day 10, (tommorrow) was when I had planned to rack to secondary and add the vodka/hibiscus lemon mixture, after that I planned to let it sit for 7 more days before bottling.

As @hotbeer said, forget about the secondary.
Just add the whole contents of the steeping jar, the tincture plus the steeped hibiscus and lemon to the finished beer in your primary, 3-5 days before bottling. <== That's the time we count back from.

If she's still bubbling in the airlock now, she's probably not done fermenting yet.
WY3724 is the Dupont yeast, she can be a bit finicky, taking her time with finishing out. So let her finish out first, give her another 2 weeks.

Once she's done bubbling for 5 days and the beer is nicely clearing, take a gravity reading and report back with that number.

 

[AquaticHarpy]

Took gravity 2 days ago and it came in around 1.034, definitely needs a little more time. Tasted sweet but good, the tangerine came through nicely just hoping I can avoid overpowering it with the lemon and hibiscus. Planning on adding the hibiscus and lemon soon, keeping temperature around 90-92, about a bubble every 18 seconds now

 

[IslandLizard]

Took gravity 2 days ago and it came in around 1.034

How did you measure that? Hydrometer? Refractometer? Otherwise?
1.034 does not indicate you're at final gravity, neither does continuous fermentation activity (bubbling).
What was your original gravity?

Planning on adding the hibiscus and lemon soon, keeping temperature around 90-92, about a bubble every 18 seconds now

Have you read my post in #11 ^?

 

[AquaticHarpy]

Original gravity was 1.076 so Id say good progress so far, I did read your post, the lemon and hibiscus is currently staying fresh in the freezer. I measured with a hydrometer Im just midly impatient and heard this yeast was capable of finishing in as little as 2 weeks at around 90. Still being patient for it though and figuring out some new recipes in the meantime!

Edit: Krausen just fell. I'll take a gravity reading when I'm home from work tomorrow and depending on the number I'll likely add the hibiscus n lemon

 

[IslandLizard]

I measured with a hydrometer

Ah, good, that's rather accurate then.
I asked, because mid 1.030s is a typical FG read from a refractometer, without correcting for alcohol being present.

If it took almost 2 weeks to get from 1.076 to 1.034 I doubt she'll be at 1.010 or lower, now.

WY3724 (Dupont) has a reputation to "stall" around 1.030, only to resume several weeks later, slowly creeping down to single digits over the next month or 2 (or even longer). She's a beautiful yeast, just needs time, and seems to hate back pressure (even from an airlock or blow-off) or temp drops.

Did you make a yeast starter beforehand?

 

[AquaticHarpy]

Ah, good, that's rather accurate then.
I asked, because mid 1.030s is a typical gravity read from a refractometer, without correcting for alcohol being present.

If it took almost 2 weeks to get from 1.076 to 1.034 I doubt she'll be at 1.010 or lower, now.

WY3724 (Dupont) has a reputation to "stall" around 1.030, only to resume several weeks later, slowly creeping down to single digits over the next month or 2 (or even longer). She's a beautiful yeast, just needs time, and seems to hate back pressure (even from an airlock or blow-off) or temp drops.

Did you make a yeast starter beforehand?

No starter just a fresh smack pack, it took 9 days to hit 1.034 which is a Lil over halfway, today is day 15 and the top has cleared nicely

 

[IslandLizard]

Planning on adding the hibiscus and lemon soon

Be easy on the lemon... Just the outer (colored) zest, right, about 1/16" thick? Not much (white) pith or any juice.

today is day 15 and the top has cleared nicely

I hope she's indeed done...

 

[hotbeer]

today is day 15 and the top has cleared nicely

Top is everything above the trub on the bottom?

If you aren't at your expected FG, you might wait longer and see if it does anything else. Several times I've had a beer clear up completely and then a few days later when I thought I'd be bottling, I found it had started bubbling away again and everything was murky.

On a few batches this happened two or three times. These were also batches that stayed in the primary for up to six weeks.

Those instances were with kits and a unknown yeast. I haven't had that issue with US-05 or S-04. However a recent batch I did with S-33 didn't quite get down to expected OG but cleared up nicely. I'm now thinking maybe I should have waited longer too.
I've noticed that a little over a month later the carbonation seems more than expected.

 

[IslandLizard]

If you aren't at your expected FG, you might wait longer

That^

today is day 15 and the top has cleared nicely

There's probably nothing worse than bottling beer that's not totally done fermenting. 1.034, 1.020, or even 1.012 are not final gravities for Saison yeasts, especially Dupont after 15 days or even 30 days.
[EDIT] 2-3 months 1-2 months is more the norm, can be even as long as 3 months, especially after a temp drop where she could have retreated or even stalled. IOW, you need to make sure she reached terminal gravity or you'll risk bottle bombs!

Besides, after active fermentation has completed, the yeast is still conditioning the beer, so, extra time spent can be beneficial.

 

[AquaticHarpy]

I added the lemon and hibiscus at a sg of 1.023, airlock activity was minimal and the beer was relatively clear with no krausen. Since the beer is slowly developing a rusty color, a thick layer of krausen has reformed and the airlock is bubbling twice every second, apparently the yeast enjoyed the snack. Smells like ice cream

 

[AquaticHarpy]

Well due to my inability to afford and source a large amount of either belgian bottles, Champagne bottles or flip tops, the saison is still chilling at 90. I'm hoping to bottle soon, I'll likely be turning heat off sometime today, hoping she turns out!

 

[IslandLizard]

Well due to my inability to afford and source a large amount of either belgian bottles, Champagne bottles or flip tops, the saison is still chilling at 90. I'm hoping to bottle soon, I'll likely be turning heat off sometime today, hoping she turns out!

You can bottle in plastic soda bottles, or 1 liter heavy duty duty water bottles (like Aquafina's). Perhaps even in those heavy duty bottles that contained specialty tea or Kombucha.
Since they're not brown, keep the bottles stored in a dark place, such as inside a closed box.

But do not use the small flimsy water bottles, the lids aren't gas tight or even secure, they won't hold pressure (from carbonation).

 

[AquaticHarpy]

5 Days ago at 90f the fermentation was pretty much at a stand still. A bubble once every few minutes maybe, I turned the heater off, hoping to conserve any yeast still alive for bottling when the time came. Today I took a look at the beer the the yeast cake has grown exponentially, it's bubbling about once every 6 seconds and I can see many little bubbles floating up through the beer. Unfortunately my hydrometer is currently shattered so I can't take gravity but it's interesting how it has seemed to start again at much lower Temps
Cheers

 

[505-Brewer]

you should read up on that yeast. It can take a month at 90 to reach terminal for some folks. Do not bottle unless you know you have reached terminal. I woulda waited until then to add the extra ingredients. They might be in there awhile. You can always rack to secondary. Not typically needed but if you cant make a starter or rack to a secondary without ruining your beer you shouldn’t probably be brewing. In the end its beer. It’ll be tasty. But make sure you have reached terminal before bottling. Buy another hydrometer.
Cheers!