WTS Beer

[bmantzey]

I know there are laws regarding the sale of home brew. I'm getting better and better at the craft and I'm really enjoying it. Some of my friends and others whom I've given samples to have said they'd be willing to pay for some of it.

I'm wondering, what would one have to do to get licensed to sell home brews?

 

[JetSmooth]

Well, you probably won't get licensed to sell home brews.

There's not a jurisdication that I'm aware of that will allow alcohol (or many other foodstuffs) produced in a home to be sold to the public on license.

So, you'll have to have an outbuilding or separate premisis on which to to produce.

Then you should contact the feds. That's easy. They pretty much want your money.

For your local jurisdiction . . . . . who can say? You should likely get a lawyer.

 

[Revvy]

Here you go..

You start by wading through this site http://ttb.gov/beer/index.shtml

And you start writing checks.....I think the first one is a bond for 30 grand IIRC.

And you won't be selling homebrew, it's illegal to sell homebrew. You have to go pro to sell your beer.

 

[the_bird]

It's going to vary significantly state by state, so odds are pretty good that even if someone around here HAS gone through the process, their experiences will be totally irrelevant to your own.

 

[bmantzey]

Lame. Thanks for the responses.

 

[JetSmooth]

Lame. Thanks for the responses.

Yeah, the law can be pretty lame.


Don't drive like an a**hole. Lame.
Don't kill people. Lame.
Make sure to tip Uncle Sam whenever you make money since they provide for the common services we all rely on. Lame.

 

[NorthRiverS]

I would just suggest that they pony up some cash to buy you more brew supplies. Don't think that's against the law. Or is it?

NRS

 

[Revvy]

I would just suggest that they pony up some cash to buy you more brew supplies. Don't think that's against the law. Or is it?

NRS

Yes, that's against the law...there are no loopholes to this. Any form of EXCHANGE for homebrew is considered illegal under the 1978 repeal of the ban on homebrewing, H.R. 1337...unless of course you become licensed to do so, and pay taxes.

That's the bottom line, folks.

In fact Bartering of alcohol of any type is illegal, period, even for licensed retailers.

Trading or Bartering

The trading or bartering of alcoholic beverages for cash or in exchange for different alcoholic beverages by and between retail liquor dealers, in order that they may take advantage of special deals involving quantity discounts or free goods offered by wholesale liquor dealers, is not a bona fide loan of liquors described in Revenue Ruling 54-509 which outlines transactions constituting bona fide loans. Such trading or bartering constitutes sales for purpose of resale and engaging in this practice would subject the retail dealers to liability for special tax as wholesale liquor dealers and would necessitate the acquiring of basic permits as wholesale liquor dealers. This ruling relates only to the trading or bartering of merchandise between retailers after purchase thereof by one or more retailers individually, and not to the cooperative purchasing of alcoholic beverages by several retailers, dealt with in Revenue Ruling 56-204.

26 U.S.C. 5111; 27 CFR 194.28

And if you are planning to do so, I wouldn't be discussing it on the largest homebrewing site on the web......

Whenever a thread like this, or someone trying to make money off homebrew for whatever reason, charity or otherwise, all these "armchair lawyers," come up with all the ways they think could be "get arounds" the law. Sorry kids, you can hypothesize all you want, but do you notice ever any actually attorneys with knowledge of the law ever coming up with some of this stuff? No.

Whether we agree with the laws or not. You can't loophole your way through this. The laws are pretty specific in regards to homebrewing- any medium of exchange, be it money or barter involving homebrew is illegal.

Remember homebrewing wasn't re-legalized after the Volstead act was repealed in 1933, it wasn't legalized until 1978, and it took a lot of work in those 45 years to get it to happen....and despite it's federal legalization, it is STILL on a State by State basis.

It was legalized in Utah JUST last year?

Do a little reading on the history of prohibition and the legalizing of homebrewing, and maybe you'll quit the idiotic hypothisizing about trying to get around the law, and realize what a fine razors edge this hobby sits on to many folks.

Some folks still think you can go blind drinking homebrew.
Other's can't distinguish what we're doing with making meth.

Hell even some cops look on what we're doing with suspicion.

Don't believe me? Check out this Cops episode if you haven't already....look at what "John Law" has to say about our little hobby. "The concotion he was making could be deadly..."



Hell, if MADD gets ever gets their way the oldschool version of prohibition may be like a picnic, compared to what it would be like in modern times. You think they'd let us make anything? (HomeWine making was sort of legal during prohibition as long as you didn't sell)

Look what may be happening in Canada; DUI legislation may expand to allow random breathalyzer tests

No probable cause would be necessary to be forced to breath into a tube.

Quit thinking you can run around the law....if you really want to help, then try to change the laws....Write your congress people, better yet become a congressperson. But quit thinking you can scheme your way through this.

That's what doesn't help give us a good name.

Read this for some enlightenment...It was one of our members https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f19/ohio-university-homebrew-festival-shut-down-140105/#post1590903

And this from just a couple weeks ago https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/alabama-homebrewer-arrested-194144/?highlight=alabama

This thread has all of the links covering the bill that legalized Homebrewing...it is a good resource and a very good read.
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/history-home-brewing-legalization-u-s-seeking-info-194974/


If you want to do this, contact the local liquor control commission, find out the laws, and follow the legal process and do it. Plenty of people have. All it It takes time and money.....

It never ceases to amazing me, how this is idea that it could be illegal is so foreign to people. I mean technically you can't bake bread or cookies in your kitchen and legally sell them without jumping through a huge amount of state, federal and municipal hurdles, including just basic laws about health inspections and sanitization issue, why the HELL would you think selling alcohol would be easier?

I wonder if they have these same inane discussions on homebreadmaker.com, or do they at least have common sense and a basic grasp of laws?????

Not to mention there's a huge lobby made up of BOTH micro and macrobrewers that wouldn't want us to easily be able to sell our beer without going through the same hurdles they do....

 

[ArtVandelay]

People have bake sales all the time and no one bats an eye at it so I'm not sure that's a great analogy.

 

[Bishop916]

People have bake sales all the time and no one bats an eye at it so I'm not sure that's a great analogy.

+1

...but offer up a nice growler of homebrew as a nice for sale product or raffle price, even for charity, and you risk having ATF at your door.

 

[Revvy]

People have bake sales all the time and no one bats an eye at it so I'm not sure that's a great analogy.

That's not the same thing as someone selling goods regularly out of their home, for profit. It's usually a charity, and more than likely some form of limited liabilty or surety is taken out by the organizers, or not if there is some leeway given for not for profits, so I'm not sure if your disputing of my analogy is a great analogy

 

[Revvy]

Uh Huh....Google is your friend.

Bake sales and Spaghetti Dinners, is your non profit legal?

Also...

Can a nonprofit organization be liable for damages if someone is harmed due to consuming goods at a bake sale?

Answer

Yes, the organization, officers, directors, food preparers and food handlers may be held liable for negligence. Similar issues arise if a non-profit holds a car-wash and damages a car, or someone is injured at a "charity function" of any kind.

Some states put a statutory limit on liability, but an organization serving food, performing other services, or selling consumables or household products, or anything else than can hurt people, needs to have liability insurance and also indemnify the officers and directors against personal liability if they negligently fail to train or supervise employees or volunteers performing potentially hazardous tasks.

Tell me again how my analogy is wrong? In this litigious society, there's very little you can do without some sort of government involvement..... And for alcohol just multiply the involvement by about 10,000....I just do get how this is so hard for all of you to fathom?

 

[ArtVandelay]

Thanks revy. I'm going to start calling the police on all the kids in my neighborhood selling lemonade and cookies in their driveway.

 

[Revvy]

Thanks revy. I'm going to start calling the police on all the kids in my neighborhood selling lemonade and cookies in their driveway.

It's already being done in some places...some neighborhood associations ban it, not to mention crap like this...

Nanny State Bullies Shut Down Girl’s Lemonade Stand

I'm sorry this is so hard for you to grasp, but it's alcohol we're talking about for chriminy sakes. Read Ambitious Brew or any history of prohibition to understand why laws are so prohibitive and in some places downright idiotic where booze sales and such are concerned.......Not only do you have the guvment not wanting us to sell homebrew without paying taxes, but you have the micro/macro lobby also not wanting us to legally sell homebrew, plus you have Madd, and Sadd, and many religuous organizations not wanting alcohol easily available....