Whirlpool chiller vs. diptube: Fight!

[RobbyBeers]

Hi all,

I'm thinking about setting up a system a la Jamil's whirlpool chiller (http://www.mrmalty.com/chiller.php)---basically, it's an immersion chiller with an extra bit that recirculates wort to create a whirlpool while you cool.

I know from reading some other threads that folks (like me) with a spigot & diptube setup in their kettle have concerns about how/whether this will work. If the immersion chiller doesn't sit flush on the bottom of the pot, then how will the whirlpool spin down the sediment?

Anyone have any experience with this? Can you just let the equipment sit cock-eyed and still get a good cone? Or are there other adjustments that you can make to get the chiller to sit up off the bottom?

Any suggestions appreciated,
Robby

 

[Catt22]

Hi all,

I'm thinking about setting up a system a la Jamil's whirlpool chiller (http://www.mrmalty.com/chiller.php)---basically, it's an immersion chiller with an extra bit that recirculates wort to create a whirlpool while you cool.

I know from reading some other threads that folks (like me) with a spigot & diptube setup in their kettle have concerns about how/whether this will work. If the immersion chiller doesn't sit flush on the bottom of the pot, then how will the whirlpool spin down the sediment?

Anyone have any experience with this? Can you just let the equipment sit cock-eyed and still get a good cone? Or are there other adjustments that you can make to get the chiller to sit up off the bottom?

Any suggestions appreciated,
Robby

The whirlpool term can be confusing at times. Jamil's whirlpool technique is primary intended to mix the wort and continuously move it over the immersion chiller coils in order to cool the wort faster. The main objective is to keep the wort circulating. This is more efficient than moving the chiller around or stirring with a spoon etc.

The second whirlpool technique is intended to help form a pile of hop debris and break material in the center of the kettle. You don't need a pump to do this and the IC can be removed from the kettle entirely at this point so that it does not interfere with spinning the wort. All you need is a long handled spoon to get the wort moving or spinning in the kettle. Once you get it moving with a few good stirs, simply let it settle for 15-30 minutes. This will allow the wort movement to slow to a stop and the debris will drop out. The debris should more or less form a cone or pile in the center of the kettle. Having a dip tube positioned in the center is really not a problem. The trick is to drain the kettle slowly to avoid sucking up debris. Some debris will inevitably be drawn out, but IME it's a trivial amount not worth worrying about. It also doesn't seem to be detrimental to the beer. It will drop out soon enough in the fermenter. More than a few brewers have their pickup tubes positioned to drain the wort from the side of the kettle in order to avoid the debris pile and that is supposed to work very well.

 

[RobbyBeers]

Thanks for your input. I take your point that the main thrust of Jamil's whirlpool system is to chill more quickly, but he also cites sedimentation as a side benefit:

"The other huge advantage is leaving the cold break behind...the trub forms a nice cone in the kettle"

I would love to find a way to knock out both these steps at the same time (as he has). If not, well then, I'll have to continue to do it in two stages, as you've suggested.

 

[Catt22]

Thanks for your input. I take your point that the main thrust of Jamil's whirlpool system is to chill more quickly, but he also cites sedimentation as a side benefit:

"The other huge advantage is leaving the cold break behind...the trub forms a nice cone in the kettle"

I would love to find a way to knock out both these steps at the same time (as he has). If not, well then, I'll have to continue to do it in two stages, as you've suggested.

I think that he stops the pump and lets the break material settle out once the wort has sufficiently cooled as I mentioned. Much debris will remain suspended as long as the pump continues to run mixing up the wort. My only point was that it's really two different procedures. Sure, the two procedures can overlap some and much of the cold break obviously forms during the chilling process, but they don't necessarily have to as once the wort is cooled, neither the chiller nor the pump helps form the debris pile. Removing the chiller after the wort has cooled gets it out of the way and facilitates formation of the debris pile. Either way would probably work OK, but I see no reason to keep the chiller in the kettle after the wort has been sufficiently chilled.

 

[RobbyBeers]

Yes, I understand that turning off the pump at some point will be crucial .

You are surely correct that leaving the chiller in doesn't *help* create a cone, but essentially, I'm wondering if anybody has a setup that allows for everything to stay in place for the whole process....set it, forget it, then pop the valve when the wort is cool. (Or, maybe it screws up the whole whirlpool and this idea is bunk anyway...in which case you're right, I should just yank that thing outta there.)

 

[nostalgia]

Many of us use a recirculation port in the side of the kettle. For example, here is my old kettle. Wort goes out the bottom diptube and comes back in the top, creating a nice whirlpool. The immersion chiller stays in until the wort is cooled, then removed while the pump continues to run. I let it go 10 minutes after pulling the IC.

-Joe

 

[Catt22]

Yes, I understand that turning off the pump at some point will be crucial .

You are surely correct that leaving the chiller in doesn't *help* create a cone, but essentially, I'm wondering if anybody has a setup that allows for everything to stay in place for the whole process....set it, forget it, then pop the valve when the wort is cool. (Or, maybe it screws up the whole whirlpool and this idea is bunk anyway...in which case you're right, I should just yank that thing outta there.)

You can certainly do as you suggest and leave the chiller in the kettle the entire time, but I'm thinking that the chiller will slow down the swirling wort faster and this may reduce the pile up effect of the trub. There's and easy way to find out and that would be to try it both ways and see if you can tell any difference. I think the difference would be small if detectable at all.

 

[RobbyBeers]

Many of us use a recirculation port in the side of the kettle.

Thanks, somehow I'd never seen that type of setup before.

There's and easy way to find out and that would be to try it both ways and see if you can tell any difference.

I found a stainless steel hook that will let me hang the chiller off the side of the pot, so there'll be some room underneath for the cone to form, hypothetically. I'll try it both ways and see what happens.

Thanks.