When is it ok to ask people to chip in for ingredients?

[TyTanium]

Do people really do this? I'd probably laugh and think it was a joke if one of my friends pulled out a donation jar....

I've never done the jar, but many of my friends offer to chip in for a batch, especially if there's a style they like.

"Hey Ty, if I bought the ingredients, can we brew an amber together?"

Sure.

EDIT: Be very careful here. Selling homebrew is illegal. Anything resembling selling homebrew is illegal, and discussing it is not allowed on this forum.

 

[Zamial]

Do people really do this? I'd probably laugh and think it was a joke if one of my friends pulled out a donation jar....

I only put out a jar for other people's parties (EXAMPLE: There is a great friend who throws an annual Luau party and has taken a HUGE loss on them. She has tried everything to get people to pitch in and was going to see if last year's was going to be the last one. I put a donation box out and gave it all to her last year. As a result she lost $5 on the event and will continue having the party.)

I personally never have collected money for myself because I have not had to. I am down with giving my brews away. My friends often bring me bombers or offer me one from a special 6er they bought and really that is all I have ever asked. As a matter of fact I am planning a huge St. Pats party and giving away homebrews at the event. (No donation jar) I love to share! I will however take action against people abusing my good nature. I am not a door mat and no one should be treated as one!

 

[Kealia]

I'm a bit speechless after reading this. I have to agree with a few points:
- Let your wife talk to them and explain what happened
- Stash away what you don't want to be imbibed when they are over
- Do NOT ask for money

Just because it's home brew doesn't make it 'special' to anybody else except those of us that brew. But it's no different than anything else. You wouldn't expect to get money back from the case of PBR or Labatt's would you? What about dinner? If they sat around and ate all the leftovers would you ask them to pay for the turkey, etc.?

I won't argue that it was in poor taste to drink it all, BUT:
- You wife did tell them to help themselves
- Asking to be reimbursed is even worse in IMO

Sorry for your loss.

 

[ajbram]

I'm a bit speechless after reading this. I have to agree with a few points:
- Let your wife talk to them and explain what happened
- Stash away what you don't want to be imbibed when they are over
- Do NOT ask for money

Just because it's home brew doesn't make it 'special' to anybody else except those of us that brew. But it's no different than anything else. You wouldn't expect to get money back from the case of PBR or Labatt's would you? What about dinner? If they sat around and ate all the leftovers would you ask them to pay for the turkey, etc.?

I won't argue that it was in poor taste to drink it all, BUT:
- You wife did tell them to help themselves
- Asking to be reimbursed is even worse in IMO

Sorry for your loss.

Like someone else said, the point wasn't merely to complain about what I thought was a bit of a dick move, but to ask what people would do. I should point out or clarify that I would never ask to be reimbursed for what was consumed.... it was more of a thought of "if we know they are coming over for the holidays and we know they are going to drink everything in the house, is it more reasonable to ask them to contribute, or to make less available to them?" By mixing the question with my complaint about the incident, I guess the question wasn't appropriately clear and got obscured in lots of rhetoric.

Let me rephrase more clearly even...

"If they are coming over, and we know we're going to drink enough homebrew to seriously deplete the pipeline, is it wrong to suggest that everyone chip in and we make some big ass batches of the styles everyone wants to drink?"


This is in line with my original thought... not that people should be asked to pay for the ingredient equivalent of what they consumed, but that if we know from past experience that they are going to drink everything I have, is it that bad to get everyone to chip in on some kick ass big batches?

 

[Rowdy]

i always limit the amount i put out for the general public to consume. and i always have a donation jar on top of my kegorator.

 

[BrewMU]

For me, I brew what I want and can afford to, and if I give some away I only expect my bottle back. If it really bugs you, hide your beer next year - if anyone is insistent, maybe you suggest going in on a batch. Or just hoard and wait it out. You don't OWE anybody beer, but good will with your in-laws can't hurt.

 

[pcollins]

To the OP:

Lesson learned. I feel for you but if you want to avoid this in the future I would just get a box to stash away stuff you want to age or keep for yourself. Pipe line, stock up, whatever you want to call it. I'm not going to belabour that point. I've been in your position before and know how it feels.

In general:

We're brewers. If it's one thing I've noticed about brewers in general is that they are some of the kindest and most generous people out there. Asking people to pay for what they consume in whole or in part is not what we're about. I'm pretty sure we have all been recipients of other people's generosity whether it be through gear donations, ingredients or ready-made beer. We should continue to pay it forward.

The overriding feeling that I'm getting from this thread is that we all need a bit of work at being good hosts and hostesses. If I have people over I try pretty hard to make sure I have enough food and drink for them to consume whether it's soft drinks, juice or water for non-drinkers or beer and wine for drinkers. If I run out then that's my fault, not theirs. They're having a great time and enjoying the party and that's fantastic. They drink all my beer AND enjoy it? Double bonus. Just one more excuse to brew!

 

[copyright1997]

Let me rephrase more clearly even...

"If they are coming over, and we know we're going to drink enough homebrew to seriously deplete the pipeline, is it wrong to suggest that everyone chip in and we make some big ass batches of the styles everyone wants to drink?"

Well, you could delicately let them know approximately how much it costs to brew a batch and ask them if they would like to be partners and brew some batches.

Or, your spouse could ask them to bring other stuff and you will supply the beer.

The important thing is gifts should be gifts, not with strings attached, and if you offer something food/drink to someone you need to make the limits clear (if you are trying to save some or keep some), and if they don't respect them you have a larger issue (which I mentioned in my previous post) that your spouse needs to be involved with and handle as IT IS HER FAMILY.

Or, not have them over to your house drinking your stuff and eating your food, the ingrates!

I find these threads amusing, as there is usually an annual combination spring party/birthday party for my son. For this, people are told that there will be things like chicken, burgers, dogs, cake, soda, wine, beer and some salads, but that they are welcome to bring food if they like. The last party I ended up with more beer than I started with and lot's of leftover foods that people brought. (No snide remarks here, the food that is provided is darn good.) Maybe it depends on WHO you invite to your place!

 

[scottland]

Never ask for money. It's no different than her in-laws having you over for a holiday dinner. Wouldn't you be a little offended if they asked you to chip in for the food?

Sharing my beer is one of the parts of the hobby I truly enjoy. If people a drinking too much of it, that just means I need to brew more often

 

[MrManifesto]

not sure why you're feeling like it's your job to provide beer for people? if you don't want people to drink all your beer, don't give it to them. easy solution.

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

Just put out the amount you intend to share then buy some beer for the rest. Like was mentioned above, it is just like snacks. Do you ask them to pay you if they eat all your chips? Probably not.

Now if they specifically ask for something, then maybe say, OK, can you bring some beers to share, or why don't you come over and help brew. Shift the responsibility for the homebrew onto them. Then they will understand the work and effort involved and they can be the ones to say no thanks or whatever and you aren't the guy asking for $5 at the door.

Honestly though, just buy whatever beer you want to serve them if you don't want them to drink your beer.

Personally, I love it when other people drink my beer. It is cheaper than the beer I would end up buying otherwise and I get a great sense of pride out of the whole experience.

 

[brewser7]

I think a lot of people are blowing this out of proportion. Since the original post I think the OP has cleared up his intentions but I like throwing my 2 cents in anyway
The complaint was laid out and then the etiquette question was asked. I don't see a problem with the complaint. I can definitely understand the frustration of finding out all your hard work went down the gullet of the pesky in-laws. I dont think planning was the issue ALTHOUGH once bitten, twice shy.. lesson is definitely learned by now
My personal opinion is to leave out whatever you are comfortable giving away. Lock everything else up.

I also dont see a problem with a strategically placed coffee can with "brew fund" labeled on it disguised as your own. If they want to donate out of the kindness of their heart then the next years sample batch can grow. Maybe they'll understand the more they donate the more brew you can make for them.
I agree that you should never ask for money which seems to be the common response including the OP.

If I was rich my brews would be free to everyone!! But, I'm being held down by the man so I have to drink away my sorrows and ration what I have in the pipeline.

 

[BierMuncher]

If you build it, they will come. But only if you announce that you built it.

If you cannot yet afford to consider the hobby a charitable endeavor, keep it a secret.

 

[tinman1]

I once brewed a batch according to George Washingtons original recipe. Crappiest beer I have ever had. Keep a few of those around for the "Uncle Dorks" to drink....

 

[Firebat138]

Yeah... I think the OP has made his point and got some good tips... Just take it as a lesson learned... We are utilizing the chalkboard and token system and I think people understand... But like this weekend... I had several people over and we went through the Fresh Squeezed keg and part of another... Of course all of them are either home brewers or heavy drinkers, in either case we had a great time, I never ASK for anything and somehow we had 20 bucks in the kitty... Get a good homebrew club together and make some good beer...

 

[neko]

Next time give 'em the smoker's response.

"Sorry man, it's my last one"

Once you start kegging you can't use that excuse anymore.

 

[Chia]

i am lucky in that several of the friends i have that come over help me brew and drink free beer, but they also chip in when they can or bring a bottle of bourbon on occasion.

 

[TrooperThorn]

Kill the in-laws. Behead them and string their skulls around your kegerator as a warning to all the other leaches.

[just kidding]

 

[Gear101]

do you have a cool brother in law.. if you do invite him over on the next brew day and show him the cost and work it takes to make everything, hoping he passes it along.

 

[Chia]

speaking of in-laws, i took a growler to my wife's family christmas. i gave out small tastes and then drank the growler myself. i told them "if had know you were going to like it i would have brought more" HA HA HA!

 

[TrooperThorn]

speaking of in-laws, i took a growler to my wife's family christmas. i gave out small tastes and then drank the growler myself. i told them "if had know you were going to like it i would have brought more" HA HA HA!

Now that's cold!

 

[ajbram]

do you have a cool brother in law.. if you do invite him over on the next brew day and show him the cost and work it takes to make everything, hoping he passes it along.

Cool brother in law yes... he is invited for next brew day. As I had stated, it wasn't the cost... its more the time invested. Also I have no issue with them drinking it all... compliment registered on the good beer.

As I mentioned I had stocked the fridge with home brews... not expecting them to take it upon themselves to restock the fridge when they had killed what was in there.
I think alot of us think of our brewing as art. This would be like a painter giving his painting to someone as a gift, and then having them decide they like it and go steal the rest of the finished pieces in his studio. That's what rubbed me the wrong way.

At the end of the day, lesson learned. Beers will be well hidden from now on. If my cool bro in law takes anything back to his family after brew day though, its that alot of pride and thought goes into this hobby, and maybe he will think a bit before cleaning me out next time.

 

[Kealia]

I see two options:

1) Brew a big batch ahead of time. You mentioned 40 bottles were consumed so that's less than a 5-gallon recipe assuming you're talking about 12oz bottles. The cost for that can't be more than about $25.00 - $30.00 (depending on ingredients, AG, etc.). Bit the bullet and make up a batch specifically for them.

2) As mentioned, stash away what you don't want them to have. No see = no drink.

 

[ajbram]

I see two options:

1) Brew a big batch ahead of time. You mentioned 40 bottles were consumed so that's less than a 5-gallon recipe assuming you're talking about 12oz bottles. The cost for that can't be more than about $25.00 - $30.00 (depending on ingredients, AG, etc.). Bit the bullet and make up a batch specifically for them.

2) As mentioned, stash away what you don't want them to have. No see = no drink.

remains of a 5gal batch... again cost is not the issue.....

Would love to brew a huge batch, or ideally have everyone pick a style they like, everyone chip in $20 and we'll do a 4 batch brew day... then everyone can drink all they want of beer they like...growlers to go even. And nobody is stuck with an empty glass and a dry pipeline after....

 

[mdpolakow]

While already hit on a few time I want to toss in my $.02. When I bottled it was easy to control what went out vs what I made. Having gone to a keg system on casters (it follows the party) it is much harder to control what people consume.

Over the years things have evolved, I have gotten many people into brewing and now they bring their own to share to parties. I also feel no shame in putting a tin on the keezer that says if you like the beer donations are accepted. Over the years almost everyone I know understands that even homebrew costs money. Most (without asking) will bring home brew, tip on the keg with no one watching, or around the holidays give gift cards to the LHBS.

In the end what I am really trying to say is that most people will break even with you. Their parties cost money, and if they like what you are doing they will chip in, in some way. Don't sweat the small stuff, relax, have a homebrew.

 

[kpr121]

Sounds like its time for someone to upgrade to 10 gallon all grain batches and brew up a haus blonde ale with bulk grains hops and harvested yeast. Have the bro in law over to help brew up a double or triple batch and build that pipeline. If you aren't ready for that than get ready for next holidays. I went through 15 gallons this Christmas and didn't even throw a party.

 

[Qhrumphf]

Kill the in-laws. Behead them and string their skulls around your kegerator as a warning to all the other leaches.

[just kidding]

Nothing says "obey me" like a severed head on a post...

I routinely bring over a couple 6ers worth of homebrew to gatherings with the in-laws, and they always mow through it immediately (it's happened more than once that someone shows up late, asks for some homebrew, and its all gone already). They always ask about the cost. And I always make sure to emphasize that it's not only ingredient costs, but it's time intensive as well (both in terms labor and patience during fermentation/conditioning). Whenever folks come over to our place, I stock the regular fridge with homebrew and make perfectly clear that my minifridge is off limits. Only had a problem once, and that was a friend of my wife's friend who is no longer allowed in our house.

 

[lou2row]

A lot of the people posting must be lucky enough to not have deadbeat relative and friends that think you exist to serve them. Did anyone notice the major holidays are all at his house? If it was a rotation, this probably would even out, but in cases like ours, it doesn't. These type people think what is yours is theirs and what is theirs is theirs. I run this same issue; drink my booze and beer, try fancy beers and booze and if they don't like it they just leave the full glass sitting to go down the drain. They then just go grab another. No hair off their ass. I will have half full pops, waters, beers, and mixed drinks left all over my shop and house. When they have a holiday; Hi C fruit punch is the beverage of choice.
I say screw hiding stuff in your own house. Tell your wife if she can't keep them out of the brew room, they don't need to come for holidays. And if she says she told them, just in case, leave out a nice batch of ex-lax chocolate stout in easy grabbing range if they decide to help themselves again.

 

[ajbram]

just in case, leave out a nice batch of ex-lax chocolate stout in easy grabbing range if they decide to help themselves again.

+1 * 10 ^6

With my friends who brew, and most who don't it does even out. With family, if you earn the reputation of a good cook and someone who always has good booze on hand, you're screwed.

And good job on the pirate fish. Nice to see a fellow pastafarian.

 

[teaser452]

Well, new to brewing, but an old hand at throwing parties. When my wife and I first got married and bought a house, we used to throw parties regularly. But after a year or two, we sat down and looked at how much money we spent, and how many parties our friends threw. We got hosed. And mostly because in this day and age, the art of never arriving at someone's home empty handed has been lost. People would show up to our parties empty handed, and we'd feed them and quench their thirst. Of course, those people often got left off the invite list for the next party. But still...

Nowadays, after 2 kids, we just throw small intimate gatherings consisting of 3 or 4 couples. I like it better.

As far as the OP is concerned, I feel your pain, and you have every right to be upset.

But, as so many others have pointed out, if you invite someone to your home for dinner and fun, what's yours is theirs. Anything you didn't want consumed should have been sequestered.

Lesson learned. And an insight into your inlaws has been granted you.

Such is life, and such are the people in the world today.

 

[Roscoe]

Lol, my in-law enjoyed a lot of my HBs with me, then on his own bought me ingredients to brew a batch he thought I would like. He will definately be invited back! AND, I do not need a lock on my brews! It really makes a difference, choose your friends wisely, and as far as those inlaws, just drink Labatt's with them. But lock your stash...

 

[davefleck]

The answer to the OP's question: before their lips touch your fine homebrew. That way A, expectations are set. B, you have already gotten payment from their BMC swilling fine beer blind keesters while you bite your tounge as they reassure you that eventually yours will taste like Bud.

The real answer to the OPs questions is: this is the opportunity to get the full greenlight from the wife to have the brewing and dispensing equipment to be the gracious hosts your family deserve. We all love sharing our hard work. When it is plentiful, there isn't pain in sharing. Keg for mass and normal consumption, bottle the special ones and share and present them as you would a fine wine.

 

[bja]

I think alot of us think of our brewing as art. This would be like a painter giving his painting to someone as a gift, and then having them decide they like it and go steal the rest of the finished pieces in his studio. That's what rubbed me the wrong way.

A lot of cooks think that way too, but how many of them ask their guests for donations, or get pissed off when all of the food is eaten?

And again, your beer wasn't stolen, your wife told them to help themselves. Honestly, if you don't want to spend the money to entertain guests, don't have them over in the first place.

 

[DGibb]

In response to the OP, that is a damn shame that your stash was consumed like that. Personally, I have four batches in my cellar right now, and if you didn't know where to look for them, you wouldn't find them.

I think that the best time to ask people to chip in for ingredients is if you are brewing with them and they will be taking a portion of the beer home when bottled. My brother and I brew together, and we go 50/50, so he gets his case and I get mine. This will become more problematic once I start kegging.

When I have company, I always shop for the consumers. Almost all of my in laws drink Miller Lite or Labatt Blue, so I keep it available for them. I have shared each of my batches with those who would appreciate it, and if they like it, they usually get another bottle or two.

In my case, I didn't have family staying with me, so the situation is slightly different, but it would be difficult for guests to get in to my stash. I have a mini fridge in the basement right now with my good beer, regular beer is in the main fridge, and my reserves are in the closet in my basement, aging. If anyone opened it, they would see a bunch of cases and loose 22s, but everything from bottles of wine to homebrew, mead, some Lindemans, Infinium, DFH 120, KBS, CBS, et cetera that are all hanging out waiting for the right occasion, and I hope the amount of beer there would dissuade people from diving in to my well-organized and documented collection.

 

[Jukas]

"If they are coming over, and we know we're going to drink enough homebrew to seriously deplete the pipeline, is it wrong to suggest that everyone chip in and we make some big ass batches of the styles everyone wants to drink?"

Heres what I would likely do if I had a group coming over that would do this. Brew up a batch of something really decent, but cheap to make like EdWort's Haus Pale Ale and have it on tap.

When they get there let them know that they're welcome to help themselves to a great brew on tap #whatever and either disconnect the other taps, or tell them the beer isn't ready yet and can only be sampled. If they know where you keep your bottles, just tell them it's a fresh batch and isn't ready to drink yet. If you're feeling really nice tell them you'll send them home with a bottle and to wait 2-3 weeks before opening

This is the nature of dinner parties, people will quaff the free booze and if you or the SWMBO gives them free reign they'll take it. Leting them know ahead of time which they can do so with helps eliminate bad feelings afterwards.

Trust me, if you or your wife mentions it, the bad feelings between in laws / family can last much longer than the monetary memory of how much that batch cost you.

 

[ajbram]

.

Trust me, if you or your wife mentions it, the bad feelings between in laws / family can last much longer than the monetary memory of how much that batch cost you.

For the millionth time.... ITS NOT THE MONETARY COST!

 

[Jukas]

For the millionth time.... ITS NOT THE MONETARY COST!

Fair enough.. the "bad feelings of them taking advantage". Whatever you want to call it the end result will be the same. Mentioning their disrespectful behavior will only cause more problems in the long run.

 

[lou2row]

For the millionth time.... ITS NOT THE MONETARY COST!

When we had a holiday, I had cleaned my shop for the inlaws. I keep a bunch of nice cigar ashtrays out as I am doing different things all the time and don't want to hunt for an ashtray. I had them all cleaned and distributed where I smoke (shop is @ 1800 sq ft). Only one of the in laws smokes, wife's brother. At the end of the party I go out to straighten up and see there is one crushed out cigarette in every single ashtray. Even the one at my fishing tackle area (he doesn't fish), and the one on top of the entertainment center. I was pissed. It was quite obviously intentional, because he is a negative, jealous buttmunch that hates that I worked my way up through hard work and now have a nice place. When I said something to my wife, she said don't set them out if I don't want them dirtied. She completely missed the point.

Just like a lot of the posters here. I feel you brother; but don't let it affect your enjoyment of brewing. Next fall, maybe a field corn cream ale?

 

[ajbram]

When we had a holiday, I had cleaned my shop for the inlaws. I keep a bunch of nice cigar ashtrays out as I am doing different things all the time and don't want to hunt for an ashtray. I had them all cleaned and distributed where I smoke (shop is @ 1800 sq ft). Only one of the in laws smokes, wife's brother. At the end of the party I go out to straighten up and see there is one crushed out cigarette in every single ashtray. Even the one at my fishing tackle area (he doesn't fish), and the one on top of the entertainment center. I was pissed. It was quite obviously intentional, because he is a negative, jealous buttmunch that hates that I worked my way up through hard work and now have a nice place. When I said something to my wife, she said don't set them out if I don't want them dirtied. She completely missed the point.

Just like a lot of the posters here. I feel you brother; but don't let it affect your enjoyment of brewing. Next fall, maybe a field corn cream ale?

Lou, I like the way you think...


Maybe a personalized batch of reclaimed swirl and bottoms augmented with some corn syrup and refermented?

 

[dlester]

On a technical issue, asking for help on ingredients after the fact is also considered selling your beer, which is illegal.

In regards to inlaws, or friends; its like loans to family or friends or inviting them to ride on your boat: family loans are never paid back and no one will ever offer to share the cost of gas on your boat.

Lesson learned: if you don't want them to drink all your beer, hide it. If you complain or whine about them drinking all your beer after offering it to them, you look like the bad guy when in fact your not. If you really want to share, either lie and say you only have couple bottles to try, or drag it all out and allow them to "trough" through all your beer.

Just an opinion,
David