Wheat/Weisse/Hefeweizen recipe help

[Boodlemania]

Don't mean to threadjack, but I'm sort of in the same boat. I'm looking for a good extract recipe for an authentic wheat beer. The ingredients I have readily available are :

Wheat DME
Pils DME
Hallertau Hops
WLP300 yeast
Carapils
irish moss

I'd appreciate it if someone could point me to a recipe using the above ingredients that will get me something "close" to an Ayinger or Erdinger.

 

[Kaiser]

I'd appreciate it if someone could point me to a recipe using the above ingredients that will get me something "close" to an Ayinger or Erdinger.

Is the wheat DME 100% wheat or a 60/40 blend of wheat and pils?

If it is the 60/40 blend use that and the hops w/ one addition to get to about 10 IBU. For true Weissbier character, which Ayiner has, ferment with WLP300/WY3068 below 66-67F. To get an Erdinger type Weissbier ferment with WY1007 or anothe clean low flocculating yeast. Erdinger Weissbier hell, doesn't have any of the typical Weissbier aroma and taste characteristics. It's almost like an American Wheat hence the suggestion to use a non Weissbier yeast.

Kai

 

[Boodlemania]

Is the wheat DME 100% wheat or a 60/40 blend of wheat and pils?

If it is the 60/40 blend use that and the hops w/ one addition to get to about 10 IBU. For true Weissbier character, which Ayiner has, ferment with WLP300/WY3068 below 66-67F. To get an Erdinger type Weissbier ferment with WY1007 or anothe clean low flocculating yeast. Erdinger Weissbier hell, doesn't have any of the typical Weissbier aroma and taste characteristics. It's almost like an American Wheat hence the suggestion to use a non Weissbier yeast.

Kai

It's 100% wheat, I assume. It's Briess Bavarian Wheat DME. I also got Briess Pilsen DME.

So a 60/40 blend of Wheat/Pils is what I'd need? For a 5 gal batch, would that then be 4 lbs wheat and 2.67 lbs Pils? Also, no need for the Carapils?

As for the Hallertau bittering addition, assuming a nominal AA%, how many oz would I need? Note that I do 3 gallon boils.

Sorry for the laundry list of questions. I would greatly appreciate any help you can offer.

 

[Kaiser]

Briess wheat DME is a blend of wheat and barley malt (here is the spec). Most of the wheat malt extracts are blends of wheat and barley b/c it’s difficult to lauter 100% wheat. So use that extract to 100%. Add 60% at the beginning of the boil along with an ounce of Hallertauer. Add the remaining 40% malt extract 15 min before the end of the boil. Boil for 60 min. The late addition of malt extract aids the hop utilization as the wort will not be as high gravity for most of the boil. Chill to 64F, aerate and pitch the yeast.

Kai

 

[Piotr]

The ferulic acid rest (45C/113F) helps in bringing out the clove, but to do it properly the mash pH needs to be above 5.7

Interesting, I didn't know that.

Sometimes I see recipes, where ferulic rest is done only with wheat malts, rest of the grist is added later; does it have any sense?

 

[Kaiser]

Sometimes I see recipes, where ferulic rest is done only with wheat malts, rest of the grist is added later; does it have any sense?

It is a widespread misconception that wheat malt is the source of ferulic acid for Weissbiers. Even Jamil has that wrong on his show. But that is not true. In fact barley malt contains more ferulic acid than wheat malt, but not by much. The reason why German wheat beers exhibit the clove character is not the wheat but the use of a yeast that can convert ferulic acid into 4VG (the substance that gives it the clove/spiciness). Such yeasts are classified as POF+ (phenolic off flavor positive) and many Belgian yeasts belong to that group as well. Common ale and lager yeasts are not and hence no clove note in these beers. Just ferment an all barley beer with a Weissbier yeast. The resulting beer is called a Dampfbier in Germany (rather hard to find though) and you will get the clove note despite the lack of wheat in the grist.

Subjecting only a part of the grist to the ferulic acid rests may be beneficial if you want to reach the saccrification rest through hot water infusions as there will be a smaller mash volume that you start out with.

Edit: another reason to have only the wheat malt in the mash at low temps might be that it needs more enzymatic work done (glucanase, protein rest) at these temperatures, but I don't think that this is actually necessary.

Kai

 

[Piotr]

Thank you Kaiser, you are a real treasury of great information.

Maybe you have some tips about hefeweizen hoping, to achieve this delicate, smooth flavour? What do you think about mash hoping, first wort hoping, or using old, stale hops?

 

[dstar26t]

I'm still creating this recipe...
Any opinions on using some carapils for head retention? Or does the wheat do that by itself? I'm also going to use a C-hop towards the end of the boil to get a little something extra. I've had good results in using carapils in IPAs to help bring out the hop flavor.

 

[dstar26t]

This turned out very tasty. Had some people over on saturday and it was gone in 2 hours.

Good Adweisse

5.5 gallon batch
Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
0.50 lb Rice Hulls (0.0 SRM) Adjunct 4.55 %
5.50 lb Wheat Malt, Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 50.00 %
4.25 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 38.64 %
0.75 lb Rye Malt (4.7 SRM) Grain 6.82 %
0.25 oz Centennial [9.50 %] (90 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 9.8 IBU
0.75 oz Centennial [9.50 %] (10 min) Hops 9.0 IBU
0.25 oz Lemon Zest (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
0.25 oz Orange Zest (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
0.50 oz Coriander Seed (Indian) (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs Hefeweizen IV Ale (White Labs #WLP380) [Starter 1 gal] Yeast-Wheat

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.054 SG (1.044-1.052 SG)
Measured Original Gravity: 1.054 SG
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.013 SG (1.010-1.014 SG)
Measured Final Gravity: 1.015 SG
Estimated Color: 4.0 SRM (2.0-8.0 SRM)
Bitterness: 18.8 IBU (8.0-15.0 IBU)
Alpha Acid Units: 2.4 AAU
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 5.44 % (4.30-5.60 %)
Actual Alcohol by Volume: 5.08 %
Actual Calories: 242 cal/pint


Mash Profile Name: SIMS, Medium Body, Split Batch Sparge
Mash Grain Weight: 11.00 lb Mash PH: 5.4 PH
Grain Temperature: 75.0 F Sparge Temperature: 168.0 F
Sparge Water: 6.10 gal Adjust Temp for Equipment: FALSE

Name Description Step Temp Step Time
Mash In Add 3.41 gal of water at 109.4 F 105.0 F 20 min
Steam Heat to 122.0 F 20 min
Steam Heat to 150.0 F 90 min
Steam Heat to 168.0 F 10 min



Carbonation and Storage Carbonation Type: Kegged (Forced CO2)
Carbonation Volumes: 2.9 (2.5-2.9 vols)
Estimated Pressure: 16.0 PSI Kegging Temperature: 39.0 F
Pressure Used: Age for: 1.0 Weeks
Storage Temperature: 39.0 F


Notes:
76% efficiency. Steam/drain manifold stuck while sparging. Had to use a paint strainer bag in a bucket to finish sparging.
Fermented at 62F for 3 weeks.

 

[dstar26t]

This recipe scored a 35 at the recent War of the Worts
Lost points to being on the "lighter side of this style". If I were to enter it again, I'd mash higher. If I were to make it for myself again, it would stay the same.

Thanks for suggestions!