what's with commercial IPAs?

[beersk]

I don't know what you can get in your area, but have you tried Bell's Two-Hearted? That seems to be one of the go-to IPAs for people who don't like IPAs.

Ha, you make it sound like Two Hearted isn't actually an IPA. IPAs for people who don't like IPAs? That's a ridiculous statement. Two Hearted is as much an IPA as any other IPA out there.

The bitterness in IPA is an acquired taste, just as coffee or spicy foods. You have to torture yourself to get to that next level (if you want to get to that level). One can't just eat a habanero if they've never had anything spicy before. You have to work up to it.

 

[AK7007]

Somebody upthread mentioned it, but it bears repeating: The major style flaw (though, lol at the idea that style is a thing for commercial guys) that I encounter with west-coast IPAs is that there is a focus on IBU from harsh-bittering hops without corresponding emphasis on flavor and aroma. Then there are the IPAs that I much prefer that focus on smooth bittering mainly to keep foaming in the kettle down, and then back up a dump truck full of hops to the kettle at flameout/whirlpool.

 

[Brew_G]

Ha, you make it sound like Two Hearted isn't actually an IPA. IPAs for people who don't like IPAs? That's a ridiculous statement. Two Hearted is as much an IPA as any other IPA out there.

The bitterness in IPA is an acquired taste, just as coffee or spicy foods. You have to torture yourself to get to that next level (if you want to get to that level). One can't just eat a habanero if they've never had anything spicy before. You have to work up to it.

What part of him calling Two Hearted an IPA makes his statement "ridiculous?"

Two Hearted was the first IPA that I could stomach, and now it's easily among my favorite beers, so I can see some real merit in that statement. I'm now into trying a bunch of others (many of which I don't care for, by the way) so I can learn more about my likes and dislikes and apply what I've learned to my own brewing.

 

[bobbrews]

Ha, you make it sound like Two Hearted isn't actually an IPA. IPAs for people who don't like IPAs? That's a ridiculous statement. Two Hearted is as much an IPA as any other IPA out there.

The bitterness in IPA is an acquired taste, just as coffee or spicy foods. You have to torture yourself to get to that next level (if you want to get to that level). One can't just eat a habanero if they've never had anything spicy before. You have to work up to it.

Cherry picking one-off examples which you have found to be not too bitter does not make you an IPA fan; it makes you a Two Hearted fan.

It seems like some of you are making a case for enjoying IPAs "without actually enjoying most IPAs" because they are too bitter for you. Newsflash: Bitterness is one of the most important traits in most American IPAs. If you don't like that then: 1) Drink other styles, 2) Learn to appreciate them by trying more, or 3) Go kick rocks.

Lastly, pleasant and much needed bitterness in an IPA ≠ harsh, acrid, poorly made IPAs... They are not the same thing.

 

[afro_lou]

This thread again?

 

[drainbamage]

Ha, you make it sound like Two Hearted isn't actually an IPA. IPAs for people who don't like IPAs? That's a ridiculous statement. Two Hearted is as much an IPA as any other IPA out there.

The bitterness in IPA is an acquired taste, just as coffee or spicy foods. You have to torture yourself to get to that next level (if you want to get to that level). One can't just eat a habanero if they've never had anything spicy before. You have to work up to it.

Preface...If you consider anecdotal evidence inadmissible, don't bother reading forward...

Of course Two-Hearted is an IPA, but I know quite a few people who took a liking to it long before liking hoppy beers as a whole. My wife was one of them. She didn't touch anything remotely hoppy for a long time. Two-Hearted was the first one she could stomach...not only that, but she loved it. Even then, it took about 2 years before she got a taste for IPAs as a style.

I consider it an "entry-level" IPA. It definitely fits the style, but is balanced as well, and not so abrasively in-your-face bitter as some West Coast IPAs can be.

 

[Brew_G]

Preface...If you consider anecdotal evidence inadmissible, don't bother reading forward...

Of course Two-Hearted is an IPA, but I know quite a few people who took a liking to it long before liking hoppy beers as a whole. My wife was one of them. She didn't touch anything remotely hoppy for a long time. Two-Hearted was the first one she could stomach...not only that, but she loved it. Even then, it took about 2 years before she got a taste for IPAs as a style.

I consider it an "entry-level" IPA. It definitely fits the style, but is balanced as well, and not so abrasively in-your-face bitter as some West Coast IPAs can be.

I'd like to note that I'm not your wife.

 

[cyberbrew]

"entry-level" IPA.

I believe you mean to say "gateway" IPA...

 

[rmyurick]

Minky-no, goose island

 

[drainbamage]

I'd like to note that I'm not your wife.

Really, you're not? You'll probably want to delete those pics I PM'ed you then.

Sorry...I'm don't happen to have any peer-reviewed studies handy on the crossover appeal of Two-Hearted.

OP asked for examples of balanced IPAs, I offered one that I considered to fit that mold. Drink it, don't drink it...doesn't really affect me either way.

 

[chickypad]

Is that what Sigourney Weaver would do? Seriously, is that something that represents you? Why would you have that as your avatar?

Not sure about Sigourney but pretty sure Ripley would tell eveyrone to go to he** and drink what she wants.

I was trying to make a joke about the fact that this theme comes up about every 3rd or 4th day and then deteriorates into a war. OP I didn't see you as bashing either so sorry to stray off topic, but inevitably someone will sugest that those who drink unbalanced IPA's are only doing it because it's trendy, or to be "in with the craft brew scene". I'm a middle aged woman with grey hair, a beer belly, and a closet full of geek T-shirts, I don't think drinking an IPA is enough get me in with the it crowd (I don't have to give up my avatar, do I?!). Pure and simple, I love them and could drink them every day. Sure my tastes have evolved but if I had to torture myself to get there I never would have done it.

 

[chickypad]

anybody got any suggestions of a commercial ipa that's pretty balanced but with basically no pine/earthy flavor from the hops and more citrus/fruit/berry flavor and aroma shining through?

Have you tried Deschutes Fresh Squeezed?

 

[Mismost]

1. I am not huge beer drinker...I brew because I like the process and I'll drink a few. So what do I know.

But I sampled a BIG IPA here local, a real hop bomb everybody was in a swoon over. It was like chewing on pine needles. I seriously suggested they change it's now forgotten name to PineSol because that's what it tasted like to me....over powering nasty stuff.

They told me it was because my pallet had not yet developed and therefore I "could not discern the subtle textures". I think they have burnt out taste buds and I ordered up a nice porter! They said the same thing about Scotch Whiskey, you had to "develop a taste for it". Funny thing, I didn't have to develop a taste for Wild Turkey, it was great on the first sip...so I drink it.

I guess I won't ever get there....taste wise...but it is sometimes fun to try new things if for no other reason than to make you appreciate what you really do like.

 

[joshesmusica]

Have you tried Deschutes Fresh Squeezed?

unfortunately i haven't tried much, as i didn't really get into this craft beer thing until i moved to norway. but i am making a trip to oklahoma in june. so i do want to find some fresh craft stuff while i'm there.

 

[Turkeyshot]

They told me it was because my pallet had not yet developed and therefore I "could not discern the subtle textures". I think they have burnt out taste buds and I ordered up a nice porter! They said the same thing about Scotch Whiskey, you had to "develop a taste for it". Funny thing, I didn't have to develop a taste for Wild Turkey, it was great on the first sip...so I drink it.

Sorry nothing to add here but you wrote about Wild Turkey and I got all excited!!!

 

[JonM]

unfortunately i haven't tried much, as i didn't really get into this craft beer thing until i moved to norway. but i am making a trip to oklahoma in june. so i do want to find some fresh craft stuff while i'm there.

Go to this place in Oklahoma City: Tapwerks. 200 taps will make for an expansive exploration. View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1430254642.424526.jpg

 

[beergolf]

Go to this place in Oklahoma City: Tapwerks. 200 taps will make for an expansive exploration. View attachment 274403

And when you go you have to drink one of each......

 

[Hujo]

If you're in Norway, that explains it. Beer shipped across the Atlantic, even though some ship cold it then sits on warm shelves forever before you buy it. Danish brewery Amager is IMO the best IPA-brewer in scandinavia, I think you'd like Todd the axe man. I'm not too hip on norwegian beer, but swedish breweries All in, Omnipollo and Pang Pang occasionally turn out some good IPAs, look for those.

 

[schematix]

Despite what your wife may tell you, size does matter. and my opinion is much bigger than your opinion.

+1 for dry hop bomb though. I'm not a fan of sweet beer in general though.

 

[slym2none]

 

[Brew_G]

Go to this place in Oklahoma City: Tapwerks. 200 taps will make for an expansive exploration. View attachment 274403

I was there just last week. Cool place, though quite a bit overpriced by Oklahoma City standards. I had Roughtail IPA, F5 IPA, and Anthem IPA there - Roughtail was easily the best, but Anthem was good. I didn't care for F5. And given that I love Two Hearted, it's no surprise that my favorite was Roughtail since it has a good dose of Centennial in it.

 

[Brew_G]

Have you tried Deschutes Fresh Squeezed?

That's a really good example of a juicy, non-piney, not overly bitter IPA with a good malt background. Really good beer.

 

[beersk]

Cherry picking one-off examples which you have found to be not too bitter does not make you an IPA fan; it makes you a Two Hearted fan.

It seems like some of you are making a case for enjoying IPAs "without actually enjoying most IPAs" because they are too bitter for you. Newsflash: Bitterness is one of the most important traits in most American IPAs. If you don't like that then: 1) Drink other styles, 2) Learn to appreciate them by trying more, or 3) Go kick rocks.

Lastly, pleasant and much needed bitterness in an IPA ≠ harsh, acrid, poorly made IPAs... They are not the same thing.

You are forgetting where IPA comes from and we weren't talking about American IPAs, we were talking about commercial IPAs. Have you had a British style IPA recently? Not all that bitter. Bitterness is NOT a requisite. High hop rates are.
But this style has evolved so much since it's inception that this whole discussion is pointless anyway.

And, I LOVE kicking rocks.

And this is why the whole "black IPA" debate (when it was going on) is stupid. IPA these days is almost never pale nor has anything to do with India. But I neither care to debate that nor want to talk about it. People will call it Cross Dressing Amateur, others will call it Black IPA. No stopping that.

So...American IPA... American Indian Pale Ale? Do with that what you want...

 

[aprichman]

unfortunately i haven't tried much, as i didn't really get into this craft beer thing until i moved to norway. but i am making a trip to oklahoma in june. so i do want to find some fresh craft stuff while i'm there.

Where in Oklahoma? There's some good places around Tulsa, OKC, and Norman (University of Oklahoma).

Not a big fan of Tapwerks - last time I visited a lot of the beers tasted old and not in a good way.

 

[slym2none]

*EDIT* possible poor-taste post

 

[bobbrews]

You are forgetting where IPA comes from and we weren't talking about American IPAs, we were talking about commercial IPAs. Have you had a British style IPA recently? Not all that bitter. Bitterness is NOT a requisite. High hop rates are.
But this style has evolved so much since it's inception that this whole discussion is pointless anyway.

And, I LOVE kicking rocks.

And this is why the whole "black IPA" debate (when it was going on) is stupid. IPA these days is almost never pale nor has anything to do with India. But I neither care to debate that nor want to talk about it. People will call it Cross Dressing Amateur, others will call it Black IPA. No stopping that.

So...American IPA... American Indian Pale Ale? Do with that what you want...

This defense will not work for you, sorry. If that is what you were trying to do... not sure. I'm fairly certain our minds go directly to American IPAs when we say the word "IPA". If you didn't, then you're lucky I wrote American IPA in my reply to clear up the distinction. The English IPA is a withering style without many examples, especially good ones.

Also, re-read the first post of this thread.

 

[beersk]

This defense will not work for you, sorry. If that is what you were trying to do... not sure. I'm fairly certain our minds go directly to American IPAs when we say the word "IPA". If you didn't, then you're lucky I wrote American IPA in my reply to clear up the distinction. The English IPA is a withering style without many examples, especially good ones.

Also, re-read the first post of this thread.

Oh fine, be that way :cross:

I guess I was being argumentative for argument's sake. Sorry to be a downer. Drink on!

 

[Sovietnam]

Yeah I was honestly a little unimpressed with DFH 60 minute IPA, But I got it in California too, and it could have been a bit old. It is a good beer but super over-hyped IMO. I like PNW style IPAs ( very bitter, Piney/Citrusy hop flavor) but more isn't necessarily always better as far as hops. It's the type, amount and way it blends with the other flavors that makes it enjoyable or not, not just stuffing as many hops as possible in a batch. In the end a matter of opinion.

 

[superdave12]

Technically yes, because of the high amount of hops, but that doesn't mea it can't have a substantial malt profile too. Look at dogfish head.

Or Heretic's Evil Cousin.

 

[Scriv]

1.