Unboxing Colorado Brewing Systems new Single Vessel System

[rappell]

For those worried about having clear wort by using the grain bed as a filter, This is a good read. http://brulosophy.com/2014/06/02/the-great-trub-exbeeriment-results-are-in/

 

[pretzelb]

For those worried about having clear wort by using the grain bed as a filter, This is a good read. http://brulosophy.com/2014/06/02/the-great-trub-exbeeriment-results-are-in/

Interesting read. Ironic how clarity was better with the increase in trub.

I think what many will miss about this study is that the final taste difference is subjective to preference. In general homebrewers look at brewing methods as simple binary decisions like it's either good or bad. Instead many methods depend on your preference. In this case you could decide on your "trub control" based on your desired outcome for the beer, as the author notes, either smooth or crisp.

But even having said that it still sounds like you'd have to really go overboard with the trub (and be brewing something very pale) to have an impact.

 

[rappell]

I agree pretzels. My fave beer is Saison. I've brewed many with both traditional and now eBIAB and I can't perceive a taste or appearance difference in the finished beer between the two methods.

The difference between the two for me revolved around nailing down the step by step procedure for the eBIAB system. The only effects where on my efficiency. Once I got that worked out, I consistently get 80%+ mash efficiency. Having said that I do manage my water chemistry and that also helps a lot. I feel it's very important with BIAB water/grain ratios.

 

[rappell]

Sorry about the auto correct pretzelb

 

[robcj]

yup, augie, you're missing something here. The grain bed (there really isn't a bed) is not the filter, the basket is. The basket top is not under the liquid level or you'd have loose grain free flowing throughout your pot.
In BIABag and/or basket, the wort is never clear. My grain crush is probably 50-70% flour, good luck clearing that. Traditional mashing would equal stuck bad with that crush. Clear wort is probably the most over rated desire of all in home brewing. It might look pretty but serves no purpose.

I get what Augie is saying. I BIAB with an external RIMS setup and I can attest that the grain bed settles and compacts at the bottom of the bag. Depending on how I throttle the valve on the pump outlet, the force of the wort return will keep some grain in suspension but my experience is that most of it settles and compacts. Are you saying that doesn't happen with a basket? That the grain stays in suspension throughout the mash and doesn't compact at the bottom of the basket?

 

[GQT]

Are you saying that doesn't happen with a basket? That the grain stays in suspension throughout the mash and doesn't compact at the bottom of the basket?

Much like this. As I said, like yeast on a stirplate - but I believe it depends on how the recirculated water is reintroduced to the mash. If it just rains on the top, I would see no reason why grain shouldn't compact. If this water comes from a pipe that is stuck right in the middle of the body of mash it is different.

 

[robcj]

Much like this. As I said, like yeast on a stirplate - but I believe it depends on how the recirculated water is reintroduced to the mash. If it just rains on the top, I would see no reason why grain shouldn't compact. If this water comes from a pipe that is stuck right in the middle of the body of mash it is different.

My water returns to the kettle via silicone hose that I drop into the water in the kettle, probably about a third of the way in. I'm reluctant to place the hose any deeper because I think I would end up recirculating the same water from the bottom of the kettle. During my last two brews with this setup, I noticed a lot of compacting, which concerned me. But as I mentioned, I use a bag, not a basket.

Maybe I need to experiment with the depth of the hose and pump flow rate to see if I can get most of the grain into suspension.

 

[GQT]

Maybe I need to experiment with the depth of the hose and pump flow rate to see if I can get most of the grain into suspension.

Or, maybe a basket is the key. Never brewed in a soft bag, and I don't doubt some people can create great beers with its help. But talking specifically about this free floating vs being compressed to walls/bottom, I think the basket just makes it easier. Try once

 

[akthor]

Reading this gets me excited my 40 gallon pot and basket should be coming soon from Tim.

 

[robcj]

Or, maybe a basket is the key. Never brewed in a soft bag, and I don't doubt some people can create great beers with its help. But talking specifically about this free floating vs being compressed to walls/bottom, I think the basket just makes it easier. Try once

Not an easy thing to trial--but I do plan on buying one for my setup anyway.

 

[Bellybuster]

Reading this gets me excited my 40 gallon pot and basket should be coming soon from Tim.

40 gallons!! Brew on Brother!!
You won't be disappointed

 

[JoshuaW]

Dumb question, does this come with a sight glass on the kettle?

 

[trnitz]

What is the time of your average brew day?

 

[rappell]

Dumb question, does this come with a sight glass on the kettle?

No sight glass. He will add one of you ask. Don't know the price. I added one myself with parts I already had. Soldered on a T-clover from brew hardware.com.View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1446402736.042859.jpg

 

[rappell]

Dumb question, does this come with a sight glass on the kettle?

No sight glass. He will add one of you ask. Don't know the price. I added one myself with parts I already had. Soldered on a T-clover from brew hardware.com.View attachment 313247

 

[rappell]

What is the time of your average brew day?

Of course it depends on the mash profile. I do a lot of Belgian style beers with long step mashes. Those run about 4.5 hours. Quickest I've had was 3.

 

[akthor]

For I think it was $20 or $30 they will laser etch the gallon marks on the inside that's what I got with my 40 gallon pot from them

 

[rappell]

For I think it was $20 or $30 they will laser etch the gallon marks on the inside that's what I got with my 40 gallon pot from them

That's a better option cleanup wise. They did not yet have the option when I ordered.

 

[glenm]

Hi all, I've been lurking on the site reading the excellent discussions for a while. Glad to be here.

This thread has been very interesting. Even if I didn't understand before, by now I really understand that brewing in a bag or basket is very different from a traditional mash. I get that. Really.

I guess I'm curious, though, why one wouldn't combine the approaches.

As some have commented, the basket has mesh sides, so some of the recirculating wort will exit the side mesh and flow down without going through the grain.

So why not replace the mesh sides with solid? All the flow goes through the bottom mesh. THEN, you could run a faster recirc at the beginning to get that swirling grain, and slowwww down the flow at mash out, let the bed settle without channeling and become a better filter. Wouldn't that give you the best of both worlds?

Possibly this wouldn't work - some have mentioned using a finer grind for this style of brewing. Maybe that compacts too much and you're stuck. But does the grind have to be finer?

Just thinking out loud. Love to hear your thoughts. This is a cool looking system.

 

[30Bones]

I look at this as soaking the grains rather than using the grains for a filter like on a "traditional" mash tun. It really shouldn't matter where the wort goes as much with BIAB. Maybe I am wrong

 

[JoshuaW]

I look at this as soaking the grains rather than using the grains for a filter like on a "traditional" mash tun. It really shouldn't matter where the wort goes as much with BIAB. Maybe I am wrong

You are correct. In BIAB, the bag or basket serves as the filter, not the grain bed. You really only need the grain to be wet and consistent in temperature to convert, then your focus is on ensuring you capture all of the liquid (not leaving the sugars behind). When you are sparging, you typically want the liquid to flow uniformly so that parts of the grain bed dont go unrinsed. That is a non-issue with BIAB, as you are (normally) already at your full volume.

 

[glenm]

You are correct. In BIAB, the bag or basket serves as the filter, not the grain bed.

I get that. But I also read somewhere above that the basket doesn't filter as well as a traditional grain bed ... that the wort remains cloudier. So, as I asked, why not combine techniques? If at mash-out we slow the recirc right down, wouldn't the grain settle into a traditional grain bed above the basket mesh (similar to the way it creates a bed above a false bottom), and that bed would provide additional filtering?

 

[pretzelb]

I get that. But I also read somewhere above that the basket doesn't filter as well as a traditional grain bed ... that the wort remains cloudier. So, as I asked, why not combine techniques? If at mash-out we slow the recirc right down, wouldn't the grain settle into a traditional grain bed above the basket mesh (similar to the way it creates a bed above a false bottom), and that bed would provide additional filtering?

This is a bit off topic and could probably stand in a thread of it's own. I'm no expert but I think the answer is related to the crush. Because you often crush finer with BIAB it becomes nearly impossible to get perfect clarity. I could be wrong.

Then again, there's the question whether or not you should even concern yourself with the clarity of the wort since many think it doesn't matter in the end.

 

[applescrap]

Another product from my hometown maybe he'll give me a deal lol.... I talked with him on the phone a couple times he is really cool

 

[akthor]

I'm not concerned with wort clarity going into the fermenter. I do 30 day primary and it always comes out crystal clear no matter how it went in.

 

[akthor]

I also won't be crushing finer but I will recirculate using my version of the cofi from brew boss.

I got the 40 gallon pot and the 400 micron basket from Colorado brewing. Piecing the rest of my system together myself.

 

[pretzelb]

I got the 40 gallon pot and the 400 micron basket from Colorado brewing. Piecing the rest of my system together myself.

40g? Wow. Impressive. I'm still on the fence to buying the 20g system from Co Brewing.

 

[akthor]

Yeah going from a 10 gal single tier 3 vessel LP rig. Trying to have less brew days by going to a 1bbl system. By increasing what I put out x 3 I hope to reduce my brewing x 3. Then trying to lessen the strain on my back by doing BIAB and using an overhead hoist to do the lifting.

 

[applescrap]

40g? Wow. Impressive. I'm still on the fence to buying the 20g system from Co Brewing.

If you have the money splash out on it... unfortunately it wasn't an option for me.. but if want to save 4 or 5 benjamins then use the kettle you already have and either mount a good stainless based element with good stainless housing from brewhardware or go hot rod route and you can't beat that little PID I bought you can buy one like it from auber too. I'm sure you know someone who could drill the kettle if you can't ...I just think 900 bucks is a little much but if you have it support my hometown he seems super dialed in. .. they don't have just the baskets for sale yet..... buy a pizza pan and put some stainless steel bolts for your false bottom and use a bag... brew hardware has a quick disconnect kit and with the $20 pump online , I was going to buy the chugger , you're set... I'm personally bailing on pump.... I just wanted everything to work right away and it will as soon as I get 220 dammit

 

[akthor]

I sold my old brew rig which covered the pot and basket. Now every two weeks when I get paid I buy a piece off the list. I'm a few tid bits a controller and something to ferment 1bbl in away from being able to brew again. So months away.

I bought the pot and then the basket a couple weeks later. So they have sold them sperately. Email Tim and ask. I can tell you that getting the basket from Colorado brewing was guy $100 cheaper than Arbor Fab. I figured I'd get the pot from Colorado and the basket from Arbor Fab figuring they would do the basket cheaper. Boy I was wrong.