Too much Honey Malt

[plainbrad]

How much Honey Malt is too much? Why?

I know, I know, try it and find out yourself. I was hoping someone had some experience with too much. I often see 4-8oz of it in recipes and was wondering what people would suggest being too much.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

I never go higher than 1.5# for honey malt... and I only go that high if I'm not using any crystal.

Use too much and you'll impart an unbearably sweet flavor.

My typical amount is 0.5 - 1.0#

 

[rodwha]

I used 8 oz in a ~4 gal batch of wheat and could barely perceive the honey taste. I shall soon try 1 lb and see how that goes. I also had used 6 oz of honey at flameout, and will up that to 1 lb as well.
I'm also lost as to where to draw the line.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

I used 8 oz in a ~4 gal batch of wheat and could barely perceive the honey taste. I shall soon try 1 lb and see how that goes. I also had used 6 oz of honey at flameout, and will up that to 1 lb as well.
I'm also lost as to where to draw the line.

Actual honey usually loses most of its flavor since it's mostly fermentable.

What temp are you mashing at?

 

[rodwha]

Not mashing...steeping for 25-30 mins. Starts at 160* and stays around 150-155*

 

[rodwha]

"Actual honey usually loses most of its flavor since it's mostly fermentable."
That's why I didn't bother with much honey. It was more an afterthought. Kinda like, "Well, it is a 'honey' wheat."

 

[Toecutter]

I use honey malt all the time in my Pale ale. 1 lb of Honey malt and 1 lb of crystal in a 10 gallon batch along with some Vienna. yes, too much will make it sweet, all depends on your taste.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Not mashing...steeping for 25-30 mins. Starts at 160* and stays around 150-155*

There's your issue. Honey malt requires mashing. Add 1# of 2- or 6-row to that and you'll get more honey flavor.

 

[rodwha]

Is that much honey malt and crystal on the sweet side? I have been considering trying honey malt with a blonde and a pale, but wasn't sure it would work well in a pale.
For the blonde I'm going to use 12 oz of crystal 10 and 20 (50/50), and for a pale I had been using 1 lb of 20 and 40 (50/50).

 

[rodwha]

Hmmm.... I had been told that I could steep it for the flavor, but wouldn't get the sugars.
Guess I need to step up to a partial mash. I've been eyeballing my neglected 2 gal Igloo water jug...

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Is that much honey malt and crystal on the sweet side? I have been considering trying honey malt with a blonde and a pale, but wasn't sure it would work well in a pale.
For the blonde I'm going to use 12 oz of crystal 10 and 20 (50/50), and for a pale I had been using 1 lb of 20 and 40 (50/50).

Ah nice. Hmmm... honey malt is also slightly dark, like 25L or so I believe. If you add honey malt to your blonde I'd go with 12oz of just Crystal 10L and then 8-12oz of honey malt. If you're doing the pale ale, 8oz of honey malt with no other additions will do you well.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Hmmm.... I had been told that I could steep it for the flavor, but wouldn't get the sugars.
Guess I need to step up to a partial mash. I've been eyeballing my neglected 2 gal Igloo water jug...

Do some searching for Brew In A Bag (BIAB.) Very simple will minimal additional equipment needed. You can even do full mashes with BIAB.

If I hadn't found a 12 gallon cooler at Savers for $5 I would have done BIAB when starting all-grain brewing.

 

[rodwha]

So honey flavors won't develop from a steep?
Is there really much difference in steeping for that hour vs an actual mash?

 

[rodwha]

I have been wanting to wear some big brewer's pants
Guess it's time

 

[Reno_eNVy]

So honey flavors won't develop from a steep?
Is there really much difference in steeping for that hour vs an actual mash?

Huge difference. You seem like you can hold temperatures within 5*F so that's a good sign.

Steeping is possible with crystal malts because they have been malted and kilned to a point that their sugars are caramelized and are thus water soluble and available to the yeast (the sugars that are fermentable, that is.... of which there is not much.)

Mashing is a living process, in a way. Base grains are malted so that their amylase enzymes are active and available for use. These amylase enzymes are responsible for breaking down starch from the grain into sugars. Honey malt requires mashing because some of it is unfermentable sugar like in crystal malts, but there is also grain starch that needs to be broken down by mash enzymes.

 

[rodwha]

My 19 liter aluminum pot doesn't hold temp well if I take it off the heat. Any reason why I couldn't keep it set on low as I do when steeping and frequently stir it? Or should I look into converting my 2 gal water jug?

 

[Reno_eNVy]

My 19 liter aluminum pot doesn't hold temp well if I take it off the heat. Any reason why I couldn't keep it set on low as I do when steeping and frequently stir it? Or should I look into converting my 2 gal water jug?

You can always wrap it in a blanket or sleeping bag when you take it off the heat

 

[rodwha]

I'm considering that as well. It all seems simple enough.

 

[rodwha]

Can I leave it on the heat and frequently stir it?

 

[Reno_eNVy]

I'm considering that as well. It all seems simple enough.

It really is a lot easier than it seems

And sure you can keep heat on it. You just need to keep a close watch on the temperature.

 

[rodwha]

I think I may have to give this a go so as to increase my initial volume since my pot can't handle much on its own.

 

[drives_a_bike]

Let's see if I can revive this thread!

I have as follows:
4lbs 2 row
1lbs honey malt
1lbs crystal 10L
1lbs flaked oats

6lbs Pilsen lme
1lbs Pilsen dme

1oz summit (at 60)
3oz mosaic (2oz at 10, dry hop with 1oz)

Using WLP001 California Ale

Also, I have 3oz fresh basil to throw in at 10. I'm trying for a BIG honey/basil double pale.

With that much on the fermentables, the honey and crystal only account for around something like 6%.

Is a pound of each too much? Or with a malt bill that big, would I be okay?

I know it's all personal opinion, but what are you thoughts?

 

[brewguyver]

I once did 5# of honey malt in a 10 gal "honey wheat" recipe. Wasn't too bad. However I didn't use any crystal - just 10# 2 row, 10% wheat, and 5# honey malt.

Edit - that should be 10# 2 row and 10# wheat, not 10% wheat (would be a really weak beer otherwise!)

 

[rodwha]

My honey blonde doesn't go into the fridge until the 17th, and I'll give them ~a week, but I used 1.5 lbs of honey malt and 1 lb of honey at flameout for a 4.5 gal batch.

I was told to use about 2 lbs of honey malt for a 5 gal batch.

I'm after a lot of honey flavor. Something like Blue Moon's honey wheat.