Thickness of pot for Kettle mount elements?

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JPicasso

JPicasso

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Hey all, I"m in the process of preparing to go electric. I currently use a 7.5 gallon AL pot that came with my propane burner and it has worked well. However, I'd kind of like to keep that pot w/o any holes for it's intended purpose of frying turkeys and burning my garage down.

I had picked up a large, 15 gallon AL pot a while back for when I went to 10 gallon batches, but never did. So it holds grain right now. I want to use this indoors when my basement is set up for Electric. The issue is, the pot is 6 mm thickness, and I'm wondering if there will be problems mounting an element to the pot. Are the threads long enough on a 2000KW element to accomodate this thickness? Or should I start shopping around for a thinner-walled pot?

Thanks
 
Mine is the same thickness and I followed what Kal was doing in his build. (http://www.theelectricbrewery.com) My problem wasn't with the thickness of the pot as much as it was the curvature. My 10 gal pot has more of a curve to it than the 15 and 20 gallon pots. I had to basically grind down the sides of the pot where the nut would be fitting on the inside.

But to answer your question about the thickness...you should be fine.
 
I don't know guys, 6mm is pretty thick. Doing Kal's method, I barely had enough room to thread the element on my keggle - if I gave up another 5mm or whatever I don't think I would have made it.

Now I'm not saying it's not usable, but what I would do is pick up some aluminum flux and silver solder and read the solder stainless thread and try to solder the locknut (get the aluminum locknut at bagain fittings) to the outside of the pot. In fact, if I had to do it over again (and I will if these ever leak) - that what I would have done in the first place.
 
Yeah I agree with bruin. The element I bought - I think it was the same as bruin's looks like it will be tight as is, in a thin walled pot.

Bruin, what type of pot did you install yours in?

I have a 60 qt megapot I am considering or maybe buying a 82quart bayou classic for my boil kettle and using the mega pot for the hlt.
 
bruin_ale said:
pick up some aluminum flux and silver solder and read the solder stainless thread and try to solder the locknut (get the aluminum locknut at bagain fittings) to the outside of the pot. In fact, if I had to do it over again (and I will if these ever leak) - that what I would have done in the first place.
Click to expand...

awesome idea!!
 
I have a sorta mish-mash going on. My HLT is a keggle, my boil kettle is a 15 gallon stainless pot - they don't sell them anymore but they used to be called "italian kettle" and available at midwest and northernbrewer.
 
To fix the curvature problem drill a hole big enough for a 3/4" bolt, put the bolt through with some plate washers (thick steel) and tighten it down. This will flatten out a spot where the element can get a good seal .
 
Awesome ideas people. I think I'll look into the cost of getting the holes for the elements tapped. That saves me a lot of work in the long run.


Hopefully we helped out anyone else looking to go electric with an over-thick pot!

THANKS!
 
too bad you aren't near me.. I have a 1" NPT tap, bought it to re-tap some damaged threads on one of my welded couplings
 
Did you guys step drill your holes?

I saw this other tool on electric brewery, but it was $$. If anybody has that hole cutter and would be willing to share it, I would pay for shipping each way.

I am referring to the GreenLee hole punches
 
CidahMastah said:
Did you guys step drill your holes?

I saw this other tool on electric brewery, but it was $$. If anybody has that hole cutter and would be willing to share it, I would pay for shipping each way.

I am referring to the GreenLee hole punches
Click to expand...

I'm lucky enough to have a friend\co-worker that used to be an electrical contractor. I borrowed the punch bits from him. The aluminum was so soft I probably could have used a hole saw to cut through just fine. Put down a little cutting oil and you're good to go...
 
I used the harbor freight step bits. It works fine as long as you use cutting oil and take your time. Also, if you're doing more than 1 hole at a time I wouldn't recommend a cordless drill (I attempted two holes back to back and it started overheating so I switched to a corded drill). The punches are super easy, but not really necessary. My step bit holes came out perfect after a little deburring on the inside with a dremel. I think the downside is that it takes alot longer and metal shavings go all over the place.
 
Cool - I am going through stainless not aluminum, it isn't overly thick walled, but it is a megapot.

I gave up on my cordless a long time ago (good for little things, but nothing else). I have been super happy with my 1/2 inch corded Milwaukee - that thing is a beast.

Looks like I might be hitting harbor freight or hole saws then, there is one pretty close to me. And cutting oil for sure. Those punches look great, but are spendy for a couple uses.
 
Good to know. I am sure it isn't a big deal, just cutting that 1 inch hole in there is a little nerve racking. the hole punches are a little more user friendly I imagine.
 
not sure if you're drilling more than one hole or not, but I had to drill a ton of holes for what I was doing - added two Bobby_M sightglasses, added a HERMS to my HLT, and a heating element in Boil and HLT. I started with the sightglasses and after seeing how clean those came out I wasn't worried at all about the rest of them. What I'm saying is, once you get through the first hole - you'll realize it's easy and it stops being much worry.
 
bruin_ale said:
not sure if you're drilling more than one hole or not, but I had to drill a ton of holes for what I was doing - added two Bobby_M sightglasses, added a HERMS to my HLT, and a heating element in Boil and HLT. I started with the sightglasses and after seeing how clean those came out I wasn't worried at all about the rest of them. What I'm saying is, once you get through the first hole - you'll realize it's easy and it stops being much worry.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I expect. Cringing at the first attempt. Then, bang bang bang.

Right now I am just working on installing the camco element (the one from electric brewery) in my BK. I actually haven't measured the hole I need. Might be 1 inch or 1 and 1/4. I will also need to get a 1/4inch hole for the temperature probe.

I haven't decided if I am going to put a sight glass on the the boil kettle yet either.
 
Do not buy the Harbor Freight step bits if you are doing stainless steel! Buy a decent hole saw made for cutting metal instead, or buy a quality step bit. The HF bits are not up to the task of drilling through stainless. I've tried them, I know they won't go through a keggle. I ended up using a Greenlee punch.
 
Pick - any chance you are willing to share your greenlee's?

Edit: Of course I would be happy to pay a renter's fee... I only have one 1 1/4 inch hole and one 1/4 inch hole to cut in my boil kettle, the same for the HLT -> (which isn't purchased yet)
 
I went right through a keggle, took maybe 10-15 minute per hole. I agree they aren't the best bits, but saying they won't do it is flat out false.
 
Well - I would love the greenlees, but buying a couple $70 tools is out of the question when i know they have VERY limited replay value. I will probably end up with a cheap arse step drill if I can "rent" a greenlee out from someone.
 
Cidah, wish I could, they belong to my employer.

bruin, you must have gotten a good set, mine were not worth a crap, only got halfway with the small one for the sight tube and only to about 1/4" on the large before they crapped out on me.
 
Thanks anyway! When I am ready to cut the hole I think I will post up to see if someone can lend one out. Right now I am still collecting parts for my electric system anyway :)
 
bruin_ale said:
I don't know guys, 6mm is pretty thick. Doing Kal's method, I barely had enough room to thread the element on my keggle - if I gave up another 5mm or whatever I don't think I would have made it.

Now I'm not saying it's not usable, but what I would do is pick up some aluminum flux and silver solder and read the solder stainless thread and try to solder the locknut (get the aluminum locknut at bagain fittings) to the outside of the pot. In fact, if I had to do it over again (and I will if these ever leak) - that what I would have done in the first place.
Click to expand...

Would it have to be the Aluminum? Could a person solder a stainless locknut to an Aluminum kettle? I much prefer the groove in the Stainless and as a bonus, it's a bit cheaper.
 
I haven't tried it, just thought that'd be more likely to work. You could try asking in the "solder stainless" DIY thread. It gets asked about periodically, I have to think at one point someone has tried it.
 
Pick said:
Cidah, wish I could, they belong to my employer.

bruin, you must have gotten a good set, mine were not worth a crap, only got halfway with the small one for the sight tube and only to about 1/4" on the large before they crapped out on me.
Click to expand...

Sorry to say this but it's more likely about technique. High pressure, slow speed which requires a geared down drill motor to be really effective. If you spin it too fast, you work harden your stainless and burn the bit out in 30 seconds. A $50 Greenlee will hold up a little longer under those conditions but....

The first HF bit I bought some two years ago is still in my toolbox and it's put a total of 12 holes in kegs ranging from 9/16 up to 7/8". The key is using a low speed but high-torque drill as I said. If the bit spins once without scraping a ribbon of metal, it's basically just heating up.

I currently sell what looks to be the identical bits that HF has if not for the different packaging (doesn't matter really, all China import).
 
Bobby_M said:
Sorry to say this but it's more likely about technique. High pressure, slow speed which requires a geared down drill motor to be really effective. If you spin it too fast, you work harden your stainless and burn the bit out in 30 seconds. A $50 Greenlee will hold up a little longer under those conditions but....

The first HF bit I bought some two years ago is still in my toolbox and it's put a total of 12 holes in kegs ranging from 9/16 up to 7/8". The key is using a low speed but high-torque drill as I said. If the bit spins once without scraping a ribbon of metal, it's basically just heating up.

I currently sell what looks to be the identical bits that HF has if not for the different packaging (doesn't matter really, all China import).
Click to expand...

I am thinking since I don't have a drill press, using the hole saw is useless. So I am either going step drill or greenlee.

My drill is adequate for the task (http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...splay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053), but that hole saw will fail a clean cut the minute that the pilot drill loses its bite. From the sounds of things, it looks like slow and steady will win the race - not exactly the role of a pilot drill on a hole saw.
 
and I know I mentioned this earlier, but you must use cutting oil or some type of lubricant. I was just drilling pilot holes with no oil on my steel stand and the bit basically heat up and did nothing. Applied a bit of cutting oil to a new bit and it went through like butter.. Keeps the bit cool, keeps the stainless cooler, keeps your bit sharp.
 
Awesome - thanks for that thread. - good to restate the oil bit - I was aware of this and have done lots of metal cuts with lube. However - never cut 1 1/4 hole in stainless :)

Jumped on the lend list, will see if I am patient enought to wait!
 
More notes on step bits.... Drill a 1/4" pilot hole with a regular spiral bit. Then switch to the step. I usually cut the bottom 2" off a water bottle and fill it with some generic motor oil. Dip the bit, cut the first two steps. Dip it in the oil an swish it around a bit (cooling). Drill the next two steps, repeat.

Hole saws work really quickly but they do wander a small amount making a rough hole about 1/16" larger than the bit is rated at. I still use an undersized one to make the first pass of a much larger hole and I'll go to the step bit for the last step or so.

I've also successfully jammed a piece of scrap 4x4 wood inside the kettle under where I'm cutting, using wedge shims to lock it in, and the hole saw's pilot just keeps having something to hold it centered.
 
Great tips Bobby - much appreciated!

1/16 isn't bad..., unless you are a perfectionist like me :rolleyes:
Looks like a two pronged approach might be in order.
 
My friend of a friend is not actually able to get my pot done, and the cost of a shop doing it is more than I paid for a pot. So DIY here I go.

I'm ordering this 1 inch tap from amazon and am going to try and thread this myself. Worse comes to worst, I drill out the hole and use the soldered locknut idea.

So if I'm attempting to thread at 1 inch (11- 1/2) NPS, what size hole do I need? 7/8 inch? 15/16 inch? Something like that? I need to pick up a step bit or hole saw also, not sure what size I'd need. I would think the step bit opackaging would tell me, but I might just order these at the same time.

Thanks
 
Last edited by a moderator:
JPicasso said:
My friend of a friend is not actually able to get my pot done, and the cost of a shop doing it is more than I paid for a pot. So DIY here I go.

I'm ordering this 1 inch tap from amazon and am going to try and thread this myself. Worse comes to worst, I drill out the hole and use the soldered locknut idea.

So if I'm attempting to thread at 1 inch (11- 1/2) NPS, what size hole do I need? 7/8 inch? 15/16 inch? Something like that? I need to pick up a step bit or hole saw also, not sure what size I'd need. I would think the step bit opackaging would tell me, but I might just order these at the same time.

Thanks
Click to expand...

Is your pot aluminum?

Honestly I don't think you will be able to get enough thread out of the thickness in your pot to make it worth it. I know with my pot there was definitely not enough side wall thickness to thread it (if you want to tighten the thread to any degree).

I think you should skip that tap and just go with your hole and soldering idea.

I would do it the same for any tap - you cut the hole 1/8-1/16 smaller than your desired hole. So start with a 7/8 or 15/16 sized hole (go with the smaller hole first).
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Yes, AL, 6mm (...)

I think I'm going to go ahead and try to thread it. NPS threads seem pretty coarse, so I think 7/8 is what I want then. Thanks for the info on that, last time I used a tap was in High School(!!)

My neighbor is a contractor and has a press, he said he'd help if I picked up the parts and ruined my own bits. :p
 
JPicasso said:
Yes, AL, 6mm (...)

I think I'm going to go ahead and try to thread it. NPS threads seem pretty coarse, so I think 7/8 is what I want then. Thanks for the info on that, last time I used a tap was in High School(!!)

My neighbor is a contractor and has a press, he said he'd help if I picked up the parts and ruined my own bits. :p
Click to expand...

Aluminum is soft - I think you shouldn't have a problem threading it. Just get a long handled ratchet or similar and go slow steady and keep your die true at 90 degrees to the pot.

The drilling should be pretty easy - just do the dip in oil thing as per Bobby's comment above. It worked really well for me.

Also - since you only get one shot at this - you can try drilling a hole through scrap wood or sheet metal first - to check the fit of the die before you do your pot. Since you are getting a step drill, you should be able to jsut check as you go. Just make your you leave it undersized enough and you have the right threading for your element.

Good luck!
 

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