The [Horribly Unpopular] Soccer Thread

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Twellman is like that one person on the ESPN articles still crying about Donovan not being picked the WCQ. And he's just so wrong about so many things. Like blaming Klinsmann for playing Cameron out of position when Klinsmann did the same thing that Stoke did which was utilized Cameron in 3 positions, CB, CDM, and RB. Before recently Stoke didn't use him often at CB and Twellman makes it sound like Klinsmann was the one playing him out of position.

First half thoughts. Deandre screwed up the first goal, then redeemed himself with a great cross.

The Jozy goal was great.

My general impressions, Bobby Wood has been really strong, Michael Bradley has looked really good 99% of the time. Cameron has been awesome. Besler hasn't really done anything, but considering what's been going on I consider that good. He's basically been there to allow Cameron to range forward. Ream has been really good defensively, not much as far as offensive player though but I think that's expected. What Ream adds to the USA is basically a 3rd CB which means Yedlin can really range forward, Cameron has more freedom, etc. Johnson has been really good. I think Twellman is massively overhyping his impact on the game. Jones has been hot and cold. Been incredibly awesome then given up simle turnovers. Jozy has been a mixed bag. I think he's done better in the second part of the first half. He started drifting back more and getting involved with the midfield in the buildup. And his goal was the ultimate poacher goal, bit of trickery left him alone on the back post which is great.

Hopefully the second half brings more US goals. We need guys to have more confidence.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

My thoughts on the game as a whole.

Bradley looked in control of the midfield. He really did extremely well.

Jozy was out of it for the first 15-20 minutes and a bit in the second half as well, but when he got in the game he was very very very strong. He looked confident and really didn't put a touch wrong. For him the realization was basically with St. Vincent sitting back with 2 rows of 4 waiting to be broken down he wasn't gonna get his normal service through the middle and he moved out wide and then dominated the back line.

WOod was really good today, drifted in and out got in a lot of dangerous positions and his goal was truly brilliant.

Johnson was really good today. He cut inside to add teeth to the support that often is just Bradley which was nice to see. Some meh touches, and I really do like Bradley more on free kicks, but he is pretty awesome.

Zardes was a tale of 2 halfs. His first half he got into some quality positions but couldn't shoot worth a damn, and the second he rectified it.

Jones was hot and cold. Pulled up with a hammy injury seemingly but not too bad could be available possibly.

Yedlin is still inconsistent. He needs to dial it in before Russia. His touch let him down at times and he was beat one on one by a talented young player but one as a premier league RB he should be able to handle.

Cameron is a beast. I don't know what else to say about him. I'm still mad Stoke didn't release him for the GOld Cup.

Besler didn't have much to do, he did well when he was called upon including almost getting a headed goal.

I have been extremely critical of Tim Ream on the USMNT. It wasn't baseless, he sucked for the USMNT as a CB. He moved out wide and has been a welcome addition. I think Chandler or Shea will beat him out long term. But in games like today when we're playing a team who's gonna sit back, the advantage to Ream is he basically lets us move into a much more aggressive attacking formation because he can sit back if we need him to. kudos on a great game infront of his home fans

Guzan didn't have anything to do today. The goal he didn't have a prayer on making that save. No other real chances.

Bench players didn't get too much play. Morris made dangerous runs and looked good but still is raw. Nagbe looks like he could start in the middle with Bradley if he hones his defensive play. Miazga wasn't called in to do much of anything.

 

[Talgrath]

My takeaways are pretty similar to hoppyhoppyhippo. As always, I think it's hard to really take too much from a game against this level of talent, realistically this was roughly equivalent to a USL Pro team. That first goal was unacceptable, but pretty much everyone involved on the defensive side of things (particularly Yedlin) made up for it later on. Nagbe didn't impress me too much...but he was only given thirty minutes to work; Jones' hamstring injury could force Bradley to the CDM position, so we may see Nagbe deployed as a starter against T&T. T&T away should be a harder challenge for the USMNT.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

I agree. One thing I'll say, everyone on the field for the US faced the same team, so the guys who didn't shine should feel the heat.

I really hope Nagbe isn't starting as an attacking mid with Bradley as a CDM. Bradley is too important to the team. If Jones can't go and nabge can't play box to box (honestly haven't watched him enough to know his defensive game) then go with Bradley and Mix. Beckerman is too slow (my one gripe with Klinsmann is him continuing to pick Beckerman when he's lost a step and can't hang anymore)

What I hope happens if Jones can't go is Cameron or Besler moves to CDM and then Miazga or Alvarado plays at CB. They would be true CDMs as well, as they'd basically just sit in front of the CBs for cover.

 

[Talgrath]

That is very possible. Nagbe isn't very good on defense, so it's very possible that will be the case.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Without Jones, play a 4-3-3. Ream acts as a second CB when Yedlin and Cameron go on attack, pushing forward Nagbe on the wing in front of Yedlin. All the while, other wing (probably Fabian) hovers and allows Bradley room to push on attack.

EDIT: Bradley and Johnson can alternate who pushes based on what's going on at the time. If they have more consistent control of the midfield, Bradley goes.

 

[Talgrath]

I like that idea, offensively oriented for a T&T team that will probably try to bunker and counter.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

I like that idea, offensively oriented for a T&T team that will probably try to bunker and counter.

This is true. In that case, I'd have Cameron not push as high, maybe hang at the beginning of the attacking 3rd. That shores up defense in the event of a counter but allows both Johnson and Bradley room to roam.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Without Jones, play a 4-3-3. Ream acts as a second CB when Yedlin and Cameron go on attack, pushing forward Nagbe on the wing in front of Yedlin. All the while, other wing (probably Fabian) hovers and allows Bradley room to push on attack.

EDIT: Bradley and Johnson can alternate who pushes based on what's going on at the time. If they have more consistent control of the midfield, Bradley goes.

My concern with that is T&T is fast. I may want Shea out there at LB for that reason. He'd be more dangerous at chasing the game and he'd keep their mids more honest with his attacking ability. He is more inclined to make a mistake than Ream though.

Assuming Jones is out this is what I do

GK - Howard
LB - Shea
CB - Cameron
CB - Miazga (going with speed here over Besler's intelligence though he should be more than fine)
RB - Yedlin
LM - Johnson
CM - Bradley
CM - Mix
RM - Nagbe
ST - Jozy
ST - Wood

Zardes would be first off the bench for me. I just think Nagbe will be more dangerous and I think holding our attacking formation will be very important to hold against the counter. In the last match we basically played a 4-3-3 with Zardes often being as high as the strikers and Fabian and Bradley adn lesser Jones all basically joining right up in the attack.

 

[Talgrath]

I like that line up, for the most part, though I do think Nagbe is stronger in the center. Personally I think we've got enough defensive talent to cover T&T though, so a 4-3-3 could be a great way to pin them back...of course despite playing defense back in the day I lean towards the idea that the best defense is a good offense.

 

[Talgrath]

More of a footnote than anything, but for the first time in 44 years Hungary has qualified for the Euros off of a 3-1 aggregate win. The side includes MLS player Krisztian Nemeth, though he's mostly a bench player right now. It's the first major tournament Hungary has reached in thirty years.

http://www.espnfc.us/european-championship-qualifying/match/436799/hungary-norway/report

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

I like that line up, for the most part, though I do think Nagbe is stronger in the center. Personally I think we've got enough defensive talent to cover T&T though, so a 4-3-3 could be a great way to pin them back...of course despite playing defense back in the day I lean towards the idea that the best defense is a good offense.

I think Nagbe is stronger in a loose role. Not being forced to be one thing or another. Reason I think he works so well centrally for Portland is he touches the ball more. Guy is really good at working distribution. Concern though is his defense. I cannot see a way Nagbe can play centrally and Bradley is on the same pitch, unless we only have one striker or go with 3 central players. So if you would and we go with a 4-3-3 it would have to be Bradley, Mix/Jones, and Nagbe in the middle with Fabian, Zardes, and Jozy/Wood up top.

 

[Talgrath]

Actually, I'd be pretty happy with that idea, personally. I have a lot of love for the 4-3-3 and find width to be overrated. It would be a bold choice from Klinsmann, but I'm not entirely sure I could see that being the actual line up. I guess we'll see.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Klinsmann has proven one thing to be true with him, you don't know what he'll do. It depends on how he's seeing his players, how they're feeling, etc.

I think it's safe to bet Jones doesn't play. If he does play he'll probably be the first one subbed off. He didn't train yesterday but is set to dress. US may opt to play him in a hope that he will frustrate T&T then replace him with Nagbe or Mix.

Personally i hope for the same lineup as last time with Mix in for Jones. Nagbe can come on for Mix, Fabian, or Zardes, Miazga is cap tied we don't need to see him again unless the situation arises where we need another defender or one of our defenders is gassed.

I would want a 3-5-2 personally. I love that formation for the USMNT as it is formed right now.

You'd have Jozy and Wood up top, Bradley, Johnson and nagbe as your attacking mids, Shea and Yedlin as wingbacks and Besler, Cameron and Ream/Miazga (depending on if you want speed or experience) holding down the back. It's 7 in attack at all times you have guys who can cut in, guys who can play wide, guys who get in great positions. It's all kinds of havoc. But I don't think we'll see it for a number of reasons. First being 3 man back lines aren't very American. We may go with a 5 man back to try to close out a result. BUt 3 at the back requires certain players. FWIW I think Besler, Cameron and Ream are all 3 guys who can handle it.

 

[Qhrumphf]

Dele Alli is incredible. I can only imagine how he'll be with a few more years under his belt

 

[Talgrath]

Unable to watch the game, but a 0-0 draw in T&T isn't terrible. Going on the road in CONCACAF is never fun and from all I've seen the USMNT pushed for a winner but didn't get it. The only "tough" game left in the USMNT qualifying group is away to Guatemala, I fully expect the USMNT to win the group at this point (currently they're on top).

In other news related to the USMNT, Jordan Morris has reportedly been offered the biggest MLS Homegrown Player contract in history by the Sounders (who currently hold his rights), if he is smart, he'll take the money and switch to the pros now.

https://twitter.com/mattpentz/status/667057008508473344

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

We were the better side through 90 minutes. THey started out better probably for the first 30 minutes, and we dominated the last 60. If Gyasi didn't miss a few howlers we win.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Morris being the highest paid homegrown doesn't mean too much. Right now Gyasi is the highest paid and still is under 200K.

Morris has been getting a lot of hype. JAB makes over a million, Morris may have enough hype to generate that much money.

 

[Talgrath]

For those that might be interested, here is the list of US sites for the Copa America:

http://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2015/11/19/copa-america-centenario-host-cities-stadiums

A lot of the places you'd expect, none of them soccer specific though.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Not shocking, Soccer specific stadiums in the US are all pretty small. IN the US the biggest is Stubhub, at 27,000.The smallest stadium listed is soldier field at 61,500. Gold cup was in soccer specific stadiums as well as non.

I'm debating on if I want to go to whatever game is in Philly, should be awesome.

 

[Talgrath]

I'm curious to know what the prices will be for tickets. If it's affordable enough, I'd like to go to one of the Seattle games.

 

[Talgrath]

Reminder: MLS playoffs resume Sunday afternoon! I predicted Dallas and NYRB to triumph in the finals, the first leg begins to see if I was right at 5 pm EST on ESPN, then 7:30 pm EST on Fox Sports 1.

 

[Qhrumphf]

West Brom took down the Arse, Liverpool took down City, and we're decisively beating the Irons at the half both in play and scoreline. If only Man U and Leicester could lose...

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Playoffs resume today! Finally!

 

[Talgrath]

Wow, that didn't go according to plan for either Dallas or New York. Both teams are facing a 2 goal deficit heading home. That said, neither of the top seeds are out of it yet, a 2-0 result at home is enough to keep either team in it. For Dallas, a 2-0 win at home would win the series on away goals, while RBNY getting a 2-0 result at home gets them to extra time. That said, neither of the "underdog" teams will feel daunted, Columbus Crew have beaten RBNY twice in the playoffs, including 2008 to go on to win MLS Cup, while Portland walked into Vancouver and blanked the home team to easily win a place in the western conference final. If both of the "underdog" teams win, then Portland will face Columbus at home for the MLS Cup Final.

 

[Talgrath]

An interesting piece here from Grant Wahl, he got a hold of an MLS player's contract for someone making roughly league minimum and put out just the bonus structure, aka the stuff the player's union doesn't get to show us. I think the most shocking thing about the bonus structure is the bonuses per goal or assist: $1,000. If a league minimum making player can get some goals and assists in a starting spot on a winning team they could easily make more in bonuses than their entire salary. Definitely worth a look if you want to see a bit of how the sausage is made in MLS.

http://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2015/11/23/mls-player-contract-bonuses

 

[HoppyDaze]

Dairon Asprilla's goal was incredible. Seems like Portland is playing with all the confidence in the world. I don't know much about the sport, but I know momentum when I see it.

 

[HoppyDaze]

Watching Frankfurt v Leverkusen on a local sports channel. They're fast and don't miss a pass.

 

[Talgrath]

Reminder: MLS finals are Sunday! The MLS Cup Championship game will be heading to either New York (okay, Harrison, NJ), Dallas or Columbus depending on the results.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Reminder: MLS finals are Sunday! The MLS Cup Championship game will be heading to either New York (okay, Harrison, NJ), Dallas (okay, Frisco) or Columbus depending on the results.

ftfy

Man, Sundays have been awesome ever since Decision Day! Those 8 hour blocks of soccer last round were addicting.

I can't wait for more action tomorrow!

Columbus and Portland have the advantage in their respective series, but NYRB and Dallas are both more than able to mount a comeback (especially FCD with an away goal)