The craft beer bubble is busting.

[Druman07]

We are truly in a renaissance period of locally brewed beer, and I am loving the experience. Being in my late 50's I grew up in a period where breweries were in a steady decline, and where the idea of going to a local brewery was not even remotely possible. Now the choices in my area are going exponentially, and I plan on making the most of both the beer tasting and the brewery experience that comes with it. I am sure over the next couple of years, there will be a shakeout, some will flourish, many will come and go, but I will both support and enjoy the brewers that are driving this renaissance period. And now being a homebrewer, I appreciate the craft of producing a good tasting beer so much more.

 

[myelo]

Sometimes I just let them pour the beer into my cupped hands held under the faucet.

 

[Druman07]

Sometimes I just let them pour the beer into my cupped hands held under the faucet.

That's great!

 

[Rob2010SS]

And now I have a few to try when the wife and I visit my parents for the holidays...
Still need to do tours at New Belgium, Oskar Blues, and Odell (personal favorite). Ironic since I went to CSU, but never found the time to go...

Forget Oskar Blues. They are one of the ones that surprise me. I have not liked any of their beers I've had.

Add TRVE Brewing and Equinox to your list. They're pretty good.

 

[sborz22]

delete

 

[sborz22]

I wont go to a brewery after I find out they serve beer in a stemmed glass of any kind.

I'm hoping to gather a following and spread my inclination

It's called rastal teku, you uncultured swine.

I joke, I joke. I don't mind it unless I order a beer thinking it's a pint and they give it to me in teku as if I cannot handle 16 oz of an 8 percenter!

 

[Mitch S]

Forget Oskar Blues. They are one of the ones that surprise me. I have not liked any of their beers I've had.

Add TRVE Brewing and Equinox to your list. They're pretty good.

Dang was hoping they had some stuff that might be better than Dale's or Mama's Yella Pils. Those are garbage beers, but that's what they ship to Texas.

 

[Mitch S]

In MD it is growing at a rate that I cannot believe to be sustainable. The prices people are paying for beer, as well as the lines outside before opening when there are can releases are unbelievable. $18 for a 16oz can of some sour beer that is sweetened with Icee flavoring seems crazy to me......but anyway.....

I just don't see all of these breweries (or this number of breweries) being here in 5 years even though the number is still climbing.....and even if they all make exceptional beer and maintain great business practices and management. The market is getting pretty crowded IMO.

Didn't Guinness open a brewery in Baltimore that was a joint venture? Brother lives there and gave me a growler to that one with the first fill up on him.

 

[Shwagger]

1. Belgian isn't a language.
2. You should go. The beer (and frites) are delicious.

You'll be okay. The Belgians don't speak "Belgian" either! The official languages are Dutch, French, & German. Wallon is the local version of French which is spoken by about 1/3 of the population.

 

[Shwagger]

It's called rastal teku, you uncultured swine.

I joke, I joke. I don't mind it unless I order a beer thinking it's a pint and they give it to me in teku as if I cannot handle 16 oz of an 8 percenter!

Look at this beauty!!! A real mans pour!

 

[Shwagger]

Neat glass, no stem

 

[TechFanMD]

Didn't Guinness open a brewery in Baltimore that was a joint venture? Brother lives there and gave me a growler to that one with the first fill up on him.

Yes, they did. I (and most familiar with the MD beer scene) wouldn't consider that part of the craft brewing industry here.....and it is yet to be seen how they impact other breweries. The big guys tend to lobby for state laws that benefit themselves and hurt others, but so far they have been playing nice.....and MD has a lot of laws and regulation being kicked around

 

[Kirkwooder]

I'm just afraid that one of these new breweries will start serving a Bock in a frosted goat scrotum.

I prefer no stems but they don't offend me either. No goat scrotum though please.

 

[jturman35]

Forget Oskar Blues. They are one of the ones that surprise me. I have not liked any of their beers I've had.

Add TRVE Brewing and Equinox to your list. They're pretty good.

Old Chub is one of my favorites how dare you! There are a lot of breweries out there that have no business making beer!!

The OP is talking about a brewery that is in fact closing. What he didn’t tell you is there are only about 18 breweries in the entire state of MS. Of those 18 maybe 2-3 make good beer. Just my opinion.

 

[Rob2010SS]

Old Chub is one of my favorites how dare you! There are a lot of breweries out there that have no business making beer!!

The OP is talking about a brewery that is in fact closing. What he didn’t tell you is there are only about 18 breweries in the entire state of MS. Of those 18 maybe 2-3 make good beer. Just my opinion.

Lol sorry. As i said in a previous post in this thread, to each their own! That's the nice part about beer. Oskar blues is just not for me. Ive tried numerous offerings.

 

[jturman35]

Lol sorry. As i said in a previous post in this thread, to each their own! That's the nice part about beer. Oskar blues is just not for me. Ive tried numerous offerings.

I’m busting your balls! I don’t care much for TenFidy. Old Chub is damn good though for $9 a six pack.

 

[Rob2010SS]

I’m busting your balls! I don’t care much for TenFidy. Old Chub is damn good though for $9 a six pack.

Haha! I started to think that at first and then im like, i think i might have offended him! Well played sir lol

 

[Mitch S]

Yes, they did. I (and most familiar with the MD beer scene) wouldn't consider that part of the craft brewing industry here.....and it is yet to be seen how they impact other breweries. The big guys tend to lobby for state laws that benefit themselves and hurt others, but so far they have been playing nice.....and MD has a lot of laws and regulation being kicked around

Got it. I thought (or was told incorrectly) that they partnered with some independents as well.

 

[wepeeler]

I'm drinking beer, n

ot brandy or wine or whatever. I personally think its a beer snob hipster gimmick. And i dont believe tulips or goblets or pinky extending glasses make the beer taste any better than a true pint or nonick or similar, regardless of what many people say.

Stemmed glasses sure do look cute, though

Tulip glasses make a HUGE difference in aroma and flavor for hoppy beers. I was skeptical at first, but drink one side by side with a standard pint glass, and you'll experience a major difference.

"No matter if it's a tulip or an IPA glass, it's better experienced in a glass than in a bottle or standard pint glass."

https://www.thrillist.com/drink/nation/essential-beer-glassware

 

[Shwagger]

I do ok without tulips

 

[Lefou]

why?

Because real mean only drink from liter mugs?
You can't bang a foofy glass on a heavy wooden table when yelling for refills.

So there I was sitting at the bar having a beer in Augsburg in 1999 when a bunch of yahoo customers bang their glass boots and mugs on the table, yelling "Nina" and "More beer!" at the waitress.
What a bunch of mannerless a-holes I thought ... but wait. I KNOW those a-holes!
One was a former barracks roomie and another was a classmate from AIT.
If you can't beat 'em, join 'em I guess. So I did.

 

[beernutz]

Old Chub is one of my favorites how dare you! There are a lot of breweries out there that have no business making beer!!

The OP is talking about a brewery that is in fact closing. What he didn’t tell you is there are only about 18 breweries in the entire state of MS. Of those 18 maybe 2-3 make good beer. Just my opinion.

You've had beers from all these and found that they don't make good beer?
Chandeleur Island
Natchez Brewing
Biloxi Brewing
Southern Prohibition
Lazy Magnolia

I haven't been or had a chance to taste their products yet but I'm assured by people I trust wrt beer quality that both Yalobusha Brewing and Crooked Letter are good breweries.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

The craft beer market is here to stay. It started in the 80's, but really took off in the early 2000's. There's been a massive explosion in the last 8-10 years. There are now a metric crapton of people who prefer beer with a lot of flavor and have developed an appreciation for a myriad of styles. Having women make this discovery has been a huge step in ensuring its longevity.

That being said, there are far too many beers in the grocery store these days. Don't get me wrong, I love the selection and options, but I'm seeing more and more old beers on the shelves. If, as a brewery, your beer is sitting on the shelves for months or, worse yet, is a NEIPA and is sitting warm on the shelves, you're in trouble.

Demand is high, but people are becoming more discerning and, as their palates become more experienced, the mediocre beers are being left to rot in the stores. These breweries will fall by the wayside. It's just natural selection. Seeing breweries close is as natural as seeing restaurants close. The great ones thrive and grow, the good ones hang around with a solid clientele, and the mediocre ones fail.

This is why opening a brewery now is a huge leap. 10-15 years ago, just making craft beer that didn't suck was enough. Now you need very high quality examples of the most popular styles or you need something else (great food, for example) to keep people coming back.

I've been to a number of breweries where I walked out with my wife telling me I brew better beers than they do. I've also watched those placed founder and fail. There's nothing wrong with that and it certainly is not an indication that craft beer is just a fad on its way out. There is a craft beer brewery bubble and that bubble is bursting for the ones who aren't up to snuff.

 

[jturman35]

You've had beers from all these and found that they don't make good beer?
Chandeleur Island
Natchez Brewing
Biloxi Brewing
Southern Prohibition
Lazy Magnolia

I haven't been or had a chance to taste their products yet but I'm assured by people I trust wrt beer quality that both Yalobusha Brewing and Crooked Letter are good breweries.

I should clarify what I meant to say. I didn’t intend to say they make bad beer. I just wouldn’t compare any of the above breweries to a Russian River type brewery where people stand in line for hours for just a 12 pack. I like Southern Prohibition it’s definitely the best brewery in MS.

I agree with the post above I have been to a few breweries and walked out thinking I could eventually make better beer.

 

[TKWoody]

I've just read this whole thread and have a few comments.

One business failing doesn't mean the whole industry is failing. Look at how many banks or airlines have declared bankruptcy over the last decade. People are still saving money, taking out mortgages, flying on vacations.

High prices for pints are also not an indicator. If it were Caribucks, Starboo and all coffee shops would be out of business.

Stemmed glasses. Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated.

I enjoy Oskar Blues's G'Knight. But then again, everyone has different tastes. Wait a minute, maybe that's why many different small brewers instead of just a few large national breweries is a good model.

 

[jturman35]

I have not been able to get me hands on G’Knight yet! I was disappointed in TenFidy though. I thought it was too thick for my preference. I still think Old Chub is damn good!

 

[DiscDuffer]

I agree with the post above I have been to a few breweries and walked out thinking I could eventually make better beer.

It is KNOWING I make better beer, now.

 

[yourlastchance89]

Just finished the whole thread. In my state any beer over a certain ABV is mandated by law to be served in a smaller sized snifter.

 

[NewJersey]

I've just read this whole thread and have a few comments.

One business failing doesn't mean the whole industry is failing. Look at how many banks or airlines have declared bankruptcy over the last decade. People are still saving money, taking out mortgages, flying on vacations.

High prices for pints are also not an indicator. If it were Caribucks, Starboo and all coffee shops would be out of business.

Stemmed glasses. Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated.

I enjoy Oskar Blues's G'Knight. But then again, everyone has different tastes. Wait a minute, maybe that's why many different small brewers instead of just a few large national breweries is a good model.

that guy thinking pints were more "manly" is what got me laughing.
guy must look so tough drinking craft beer outta pints, hahaha

 

[Lefou]

Actually, I prefer German Kolsch stange glasses, but my wife won't allow me to collect them all (too many pretty logos to choose just one), so it's a 12oz'er or liter mugs.
I'm refined enough to resist drinking from bottles, but not THAT refined. Besides, the the Grimfrost 5l drinking horn I really wanted just won't balance right on a table and it's a b*tch to carry one-handed because it has no handle, so there's that.

 

[burntchef]

I'd be surprised if national statistics actually support the proposition.
Around here new craft-centric venues are still popping up.

Restaurants come and go, but nobody is claiming the restaurant business is on the wane...

Cheers!

But many restaurants like many breweries are born on a dream, not business sense or adequate funding. 90% is the industry standard for restaurant failure in the first year. I see many brew pubs doing better than that.
Eric

 

[Shwagger]

that guy thinking pints were more "manly" is what got me laughing.
guy must look so tough drinking craft beer outta pints, hahaha

Guy?

 

[day_trippr]

But many restaurants like many breweries are born on a dream, not business sense or adequate funding. 90% is the industry standard for restaurant failure in the first year. I see many brew pubs doing better than that.
Eric

So you agree?

day_trippr said: I'd be surprised if national statistics actually support the proposition.
Around here new craft-centric venues are still popping up.

Restaurants come and go, but nobody is claiming the restaurant business is on the wane...

Cheers!

 

[jturman35]

Looks like I’m going to eat crow! Damn this beer is good.

 

[beernutz]

But many restaurants like many breweries are born on a dream, not business sense or adequate funding. 90% is the industry standard for restaurant failure in the first year. I see many brew pubs doing better than that.
Eric

That old saw is in fact not true. Forbes reported the results of a research study showing only 17% of first year restaurants closed.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/modele...nts-dont-fail-in-the-first-year/#602ef9164fcc

The results also showed that this 17% closure rate was lower than the 19% closure rate for first year non-restaurant businesses. Smaller restaurant start-ups do close more than larger ones but still nowhere near that 90% rate.

Also the article points out that closure does not necessarily equal failure as another study showed that 29% of businesses that close were financially successful at the time and closed due to other reasons such as owner health issues or as in the case outlined by the OP, because they lost their lease.

 

[TechFanMD]

That old saw is in fact not true. Forbes reported the results of a research study showing only 17% of first year restaurants closed.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/modele...nts-dont-fail-in-the-first-year/#602ef9164fcc

The results also showed that this 17% closure rate was lower than the 19% closure rate for first year non-restaurant businesses. Smaller restaurant start-ups do close more than larger ones but still nowhere near that 90% rate.

Also the article points out that closure does not necessarily equal failure as another study showed that 29% of businesses that close were financially successful at the time and closed due to other reasons such as owner health issues or as in the case outlined by the OP, because they lost their lease.

I think closure rates decreasing has more to do with banks being more critical of business plans and so forth, making it harder to get a loan without a pretty ‘sure thing,’ well thought out and researched business plan.

 

[beernutz]

I think closure rates decreasing has more to do with banks being more critical of business plans and so forth, making it harder to get a loan without a pretty ‘sure thing,’ well thought out and researched business plan.

The research looked at closures from 1992 to 2011.

 

[SoCal-Doug]

Not sure about other people's area's, but in southern California the new fad is renting industrial spaces for breweries. Bone cheap rent and no frills, compared to a retail space or strip mall.

I doubt the industry will decline or die off, but it will eventually become saturated and be self limiting where only the strongest survive. What I think will change [fingers crossed] is the IPA fad. I'm already seeing a slight changeover locally from having 80% of the taps being over-hopped nonsense, and a few more classical styles, than in years past.

My patronage of brew pubs declined rapidly when the IPA craze hit. Most pubs were all IPA's and maybe a stout or wheat and a pilsner or lager, which were actually just a cream or pale ales, because its too expensive to lager a beer and let equipment sit idle. There was simply no reason to hit a pub and taste only two or three "normal" beers when my own kegerator has 5 taps.

 

[burntchef]

I do not think the bubble is busting on brew pubs. I also disagree with the forbes report. Small brew pubs do better due to lower costs for product being sold at higher margins. Banks know this. Also it is harder in many areas to obtain a license to produce beer than to just sell it. Harder to get means better capital upfront and strong likely hood that it will not launder money or run a boom and bust. As always YMMV but that is what the optics look like from the cheap seats.
Eric

 

[madscientist451]

The prices people are paying for beer, as well as the lines outside before opening when there are can releases are unbelievable. $18 for a 16oz can of some sour beer that is sweetened with Icee flavoring seems crazy to me......but anyway.....

Yes, its insane, but as long as people are willing to pay ridiculous prices, that what the going rate will be.
Maybe when we get 50,000 breweries there will be some price competition.