SYL 2352 PID operating instructions...help please

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wishingiwasfishing

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Hello all!

I haven't used my E brewery in a few years and have recently sold it. I had a Auber Ins BIAB panel. Like I said, I haven't brewed on it in a couple of years and I remember there was something a little tricky in setting the element to heat on manual mode (for a boil percentage) and then switching to mash mode (where you set it to temperature) and then back again. I have sold the brewing system and can't remember what the sequence was to run and set each mode. If anyone has any help I would really appreciate it!

Thanks!!!
 

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Thanks! It helped.

But now...

I had bought a Brew In a Bag System Kit ( 240V AC, 30 Amp, 7200 Watt) (KIT-BIAB)
Probe Model # - PT100-L601/2NPT back in 08/2016. I got my system running and working in early 2017. The panel has worked well for me for many years. I hadn't been brewing since late in 2019. I have sold the brewing system and we are having some troubles with the panel. Now some of it may be that I don't remember the exact intricacies of the PID, but we may need some help trouble shooting the panel as well.

The PID appears to be set correctly (I think). It shows the A-M PID light on and the OUT (PID) light is on if set to temperature or cycles on and off if set to percentage M mode. But the element light is not lighting AND the heating element is not heating. He has not opened the panel up yet, but when he throws the heater element switch ON you can hear the contactor.

Please, any help you can give is greatly appreciated! This electric brewing panel has always served me well and I would hope it will serve the next owner well into the future.

Thanks,
Dan
 
Can you post a bunch of pics of the insides of the panel, from several different angles? That will help folks reverse engineer the design, and make it easier to offer trouble shooting advice.

Do you have a digital multimeter (voltage and resistance meter)? These are invaluable for troubleshooting electrical equipment.

Brew on :mug:
 
I'm the original owner of the panel, I sold it and the panel is now at the new owners house. I'm trying to help him troubleshoot the panel, but it is not here to take pictures or voltage checks. I'll ask him to get the information you need to help. I have a wiring diagram from Auber instrument, but I'm not sure if it would be okay to post it in the forum or not. I'll see if he can get some pictures of the inside.

Thanks!
 
You are going to have to open the panel up for troubleshooting. First thing to do is make sure the panel is unplugged from the power input. Any disconnected wires are an obvious issue that needs to be remedied before proceeding. Now make sure all screw connections are torqued tight. Then check to make sure you have no loose wires inside the panel. A gentle tug at each wire connection should not cause any slippage of the wire in the screw connection.

To proceed further will require a digital multimeter, and require working with the panel door open and the power on. Wearing heavy rubber gloves while probing inside the enclosure is an extra safety measure you can take if you are not comfortable that you can stay away from any device terminals that have voltage on them (although these are pretty much all recessed, and not easy to get a finger on.)

Brew on :mug:
 

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I'm not suggesting anyone is capable and/or SHOULD be working inside the box with the power on. I'm engaging in the discussion here in the hypothetical as if I were troubleshooting this problem.

If the PID is trying to fire the element but it's not firing, either 12VDC is not being sent to the SSR from the PID (I would check those two signal terminals on the SSR with a multimeter and see if I'm getting 12VDC (set the Manual mode to 100% so it would stay on). If I'm not getting 12VDC on the SSR, I'd move the test leads to the signal terminals on the PID and see if the signal 12VDC is present there. If it is, the wire/connections there are a problem. Note that if the SSR was getting the 12VDC signal, it would be lighting that red LED just to the right of the yellow oval drawn below.

1710815416535.png


If I'm getting 12VDC there, I would set the multimeter to AC volts and see if the 240 is present both on the line side AND load side of the contactor when the element enable switch is in the on position.
 
Bobby_M said:
I'm not suggesting anyone is capable and/or SHOULD be working inside the box with the power on. I'm engaging in the discussion here in the hypothetical as if I were troubleshooting this problem.

If the PID is trying to fire the element but it's not firing, either 12VDC is not being sent to the SSR from the PID (I would check those two signal terminals on the SSR with a multimeter and see if I'm getting 12VDC (set the Manual mode to 100% so it would stay on). If I'm not getting 12VDC on the SSR, I'd move the test leads to the signal terminals on the PID and see if the signal 12VDC is present there. If it is, the wire/connections there are a problem. Note that if the SSR was getting the 12VDC signal, it would be lighting that red LED just to the right of the yellow oval drawn below.

View attachment 844476

If I'm getting 12VDC there, I would set the multimeter to AC volts and see if the 240 is present both on the line side AND load side of the contactor when the element enable switch is in the on position.
Click to expand...
Thanks!

As I mentioned, the control box is at the new owners house. I may have to go pick it up and troubleshoot it for him. After I built the control panel I hadn't had one problem with it working, never even had an element go bad. I was going to have the new owner test the element with an ohm meter. Can I ask, when an element fails can it cause a scenario where you would here the contacted engage but no ELEMENT light and no heating of the element?

Thanks
 
wishingiwasfishing said:
Can I ask, when an element fails can it cause a scenario where you would here the contacted engage but no ELEMENT light and no heating of the element?
Click to expand...
Very unlikely. If the element was shorted, it would draw excess current and trip the circuit breaker (or trip the GFCI if shorted to ground.) If the element went open, the element firing lamp would still come on. With both the element not heating, and the element lamp not coming on, that points to power not getting thru the SSR or element contactor.

Brew on :mug:
 
doug293cz said:
Very unlikely. If the element was shorted, it would draw excess current and trip the circuit breaker (or trip the GFCI if shorted to ground.) If the element went open, the element firing lamp would still come on. With both the element not heating, and the element lamp not coming on, that points to power not getting thru the SSR or element contactor.

Brew on :mug:
Click to expand...
The owner in possession of the panel was asked (by Auber Ins) to unplug the element from the panel and run the PID at a mash temp and look to see if the ELEMENT light came on and to look at the SSR light. The ELEMENT light did not come on and the SSR light was blinking red every two seconds.
 
wishingiwasfishing said:
The owner in possession of the panel was asked (by Auber Ins) to unplug the element from the panel and run the PID at a mash temp and look to see if the ELEMENT light came on and to look at the SSR light. The ELEMENT light did not come on and the SSR light was blinking red every two seconds.
Click to expand...
With the element disconnected, and the element enable switch on, the element firing light should be on no matter what the PID is telling the SSR to do. This is due to leakage current thru the SSR when it is off.

The fact that the SSR LED is blinking says that the SSR is receiving control signals from the PID - this is good. The fact that the element firing light is not lighting says either the SSR or the element contactor is bad.

Brew on :mug:
 
Agree. If one were to put a multimeter across the load side of the contactor, you would likely find 0 volts. I would verify that there is voltage across the coil terminals before replacing the contactor though. If there is no voltage on the coil terminals, the contactor is not being actuated. I'd check for a bad switch contact block or a wire slipped out.
 
Bobby_M said:
Agree. If one were to put a multimeter across the load side of the contactor, you would likely find 0 volts. I would verify that there is voltage across the coil terminals before replacing the contactor though. If there is no voltage on the coil terminals, the contactor is not being actuated. I'd check for a bad switch contact block or a wire slipped out.
Click to expand...
OP stated earlier that they could hear the contactor actuating when they closed the element enable switch, so it's likely that there is switched power to the coil.

Brew on :mug:
 
Bobby_M said:
Agree. If one were to put a multimeter across the load side of the contactor, you would likely find 0 volts. I would verify that there is voltage across the coil terminals before replacing the contactor though. If there is no voltage on the coil terminals, the contactor is not being actuated. I'd check for a bad switch contact block or a wire slipped out.
Click to expand...
Agreed. After I first built my panel I couldn't get the element to fire the first time around and I was not getting power on the load side of my contactor despite hearing a click. I cycled the contactor a couple times and then it was working fine. Because it was touchy I confirmed that there wasn't too much resistance from the supply side to the load side once it was working to avoid a fire.
 
Thanks for all the help everyone. I'll be getting the control panel back here next week. Hopefully get this thing straightened out quick enough. On a holding pattern...
 
Just an update. I really do appreciate all the help everyone gave. Auber Instruments went well above what was required of them, can't say enough good things about them.

The guy who bought the brewing equipment lived a bit over 3 hours away. He was troubleshooting the panel and equipment a good deal without any resolution. He brought the boil kettle and panel to my house where we knew the equipment worked, even if it was three to four years ago. We hooked everything up and all equipment worked fine! We were able to run in mash mode and boil mode both. I really wanted to make sure the new owner got working equipment and had an idea how to get started. He's incredibly enthusiastic about brewing which is what I was hoping in a buyer.

We will now figure out if the problem was operational error or a problem with the wall/supply outlet.

Thanks again for all the help!

Dan
 
That does sound like a power supply issue, doesn't it. Curious - isn't all of France wired 230v/50hz using Type E grounding receptacles?
Doesn't seem like there'd be much opportunity for miswiring unlike here in the USA ;)

Cheers!
 
day_trippr said:
That does sound like a power supply issue, doesn't it. Curious - isn't all of France wired 230v/50hz using Type E grounding receptacles?
Doesn't seem like there'd be much opportunity for miswiring unlike here in the USA ;)

Cheers!
Click to expand...
Panel has contactors with 110/120V coils, and 120V pump outlets. This is not a European panel.

Brew on :mug:
 
Yeah, seem like the buyer's power source might be missing one of the legs. Not trying to run the 240V panel from a 120V circuit?
 
whoaru99 said:
Yeah, seem like the buyer's power source might be missing one of the legs. Not trying to run the 240V panel from a 120V circuit?
Click to expand...
This is exactly what it ended up being. I wanted to make sure he got a working brewing system, but it was a little difficult to troubleshoot someone who lives there hours away.

He fixed the supply and all is working good. He's planning on brewing this weekend. Thanks so much to everyone for the help.

Cheers,
Dan
 

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