Speidel Braumeister (brewmaster)

[wasp]

Standard Electric entry and panels in North America are 120/240v. Most houses have a 200A entrance and panel. 240v is used for everything that needs it, and 120v plugs and wiring are far less cumbersome than those used in most of Europe - not to mention the relative safety of 120v.

It's nice NOT to have the potential overloading issues I often experienced with an inadequate entrance/panel capacity when I lived in several European countries.

"Bigger is Better" remains true for many things.

 

[Jette]

Standard Electric entry and panels in North America are 120/240v. Most houses have a 200A entrance and panel. 240v is used for everything that needs it, and 120v plugs and wiring are far less cumbersome than those used in most of Europe - not to mention the relative safety of 120v.

It's nice NOT to have the potential overloading issues I often experienced with an inadequate entrance/panel capacity when I lived in several European countries.

Doesn't a higher voltage make more sense? Lower voltage means you need higher current which means thicker cords and plugs. With 220v or 250v, you can have a thinner wire and lower amperage to get the same watts of power. You also have the option of running higher power items without using such heavy and thick cords as a standard US dryer uses.

I must say, however, that the hodgepodge of outlets and cords around the world is a hassle if you travel to other countries. Thankfully, most appliances can run on either system now.

 

[ColdJazz]

Is anyone having trouble with the flow rate through the malt pipe?

The flow rate might be a bit on the low side if you use the maximum amount of malt (6 kg in the 20L BM). But that's nothing I worry about too much - as long as it flows.

I have also noted that it's sometimes hard to see the flow rate (especially before the wort clears up). It might be easier to check the sides of the malt pipe to check the flow rate.

 

[Jette]

I'm glad to say that I got my new BM20L via FedEx! The corners were banged up on the box, so I wanted to open it and make sure it was okay - based on experience from some others here with damage. I started to open the box before signing for it, and she yanked the box back and rudely informed me she would say I refused deliver unless I signed BEFORE opening it. In my experience with shipping, once you sign the bill of lading you are saying it was received in GOOD condition and it is your problem. Apparently FedEx has a policy about not peaking into the box before signing. Apparently this would slow down their drivers. However, there is some other damage form you can claim if it turns out damaged. I guess another options would be to look at the beat up package, call it damaged, and then they will HAVE to look inside to verify. I had to pay a lot of shipping to Alaska, so I certainly did not want to send it back without checking for damage.

Despite the box, the item was in good condition upon opening. I see they have done a better job with packing and everything was secured so it would not dent and rub! I just have to find a way to rig the cord now so I can use it!

 

[Nesto]

I'm glad to say that I got my new BM20L via FedEx! The corners were banged up on the box, so I wanted to open it and make sure it was okay - based on experience from some others here with damage. I started to open the box before signing for it, and she yanked the box back and rudely informed me she would say I refused deliver unless I signed BEFORE opening it. In my experience with shipping, once you sign the bill of lading you are saying it was received in GOOD condition and it is your problem. Apparently FedEx has a policy about not peaking into the box before signing. Apparently this would slow down their drivers. However, there is some other damage form you can claim if it turns out damaged. I guess another options would be to look at the beat up package, call it damaged, and then they will HAVE to look inside to verify. I had to pay a lot of shipping to Alaska, so I certainly did not want to send it back without checking for damage.

Despite the box, the item was in good condition upon opening. I see they have done a better job with packing and everything was secured so it would not dent and rub! I just have to find a way to rig the cord now so I can use it!

Welcome Braumeister Jette! Did you figure out the cord ok? Note the first one you asked about was the C19 and the BM20 needs C13. (See my post #2186 for a summary of this and other mods.) It is a little annoying they don't ship with a proper US plug, but after I talked to my electrician friend, I realized even in the US there are a few different style 220V plugs!

 

[Jette]

Thanks Nesto. I considered the L6-20P Locking, but my house is already wired with the 4-prong dryer plugs, as it was recently built. I bought a plug for this, but hate to have an electrician come out just to give a blessing on my cord - however, I hate to plug it in without being sure. The new 4 prong plugs have a ground and a neutral, whereas the German CEE 7/7 has 2 grounds one hot 220v, and one neutral. I think your 3-prong just has 2 hot/neutral in alternation and one ground. The cord you listed is a good idea, and looks very nice. I do wish they shipped with a cord or at least a paper list of acceptable options in 3 and 4 prong NEMA standard.

 

[Nesto]

The flow rate might be a bit on the low side if you use the maximum amount of malt (6 kg in the 20L BM). But that's nothing I worry about too much - as long as it flows.

I have also noted that it's sometimes hard to see the flow rate (especially before the wort clears up). It might be easier to check the sides of the malt pipe to check the flow rate.

Something I had once... I didn't tighten down the bow and wing nut very well (it was because of the extra gasket I used). What happens is the gasket at the bottom of the malt pipe doesn't seal well and you get poor flow.

 

[DeGarre]

The risk is the grain escapes and your wort will be all grainy.

 

[ColdJazz]

What happens is the gasket at the bottom of the malt pipe doesn't seal well and you get poor flow.

I assume you mean that the gasket at the bottom of the malt pipe raised up (moved upwards from its position)?

 

[ColdJazz]

Does anyone have any data (or experience) of how the temperature of the wort behaves as it pass through the malt in the malt pipe?

On my 20 litre BM I have noticed a difference of about 3-5 degree celsius from the set temperature (when measuring the wort at the top of the malt pipe). So if the mash temperature is 66 degree celsius the temperature of the wort might be 61-63 degree celsius as it flows out of the top of the malt pipe.

These measurements are obviously quite different from when having the lid on and making a measurement directly after lifting the lid off – and when making a measurement when the lid has been off for a while. It would be interesting to measure the temperature of the malt about one inch below the surface of the grain bed.

I believe, at least have a feeling, that the 50 litres BM might hold the temperature better through the malt pipe – since it both has a heating coil outside the malt pipe as well as one inside the malt pipe.

I am of course very much aware of the fact that the temperature of the wort will decrease as it pass through a medium – especially since the grain bed is quite thick in a BM.

Any sharing of thoughts or experience about the above is very much welcome.

 

[Nesto]

I assume you mean that the gasket at the bottom of the malt pipe raised up (moved upwards from its position)?

Yes. The gasket on the bottom of the malt pipe. If the bow and wing nut are loose, it won't seal well and you will lose flow.

As for temp, I haven't measured often, but the one time I did, the temp was only 1C lower at top of pipe vs display indication. I did do it right after taking lid off; about near the end of the mash.

 

[nifty9000]

Yeah, I got that part. Actually, the "malt tube" was a "grain bucket" in my mind...
My point is that, once you got the malt tube hanging over the MLT (the Mash Lauter Tun, the big pot), the sparge water has to be sprinkled slowly over the grain bed. I don't see how you can do that manually, with just a pot of 170*F water.

I just spare with a Phil's sparge arm over the raised grain vessel with water at 172 F. You will need the hot water kettle up high enough. Otherwise it is easy and IMHO better than flood sparging

 

[ColdJazz]

As for temp, I haven't measured often, but the one time I did, the temp was only 1C lower at top of pipe vs display indication. I did do it right after taking lid off; about near the end of the mash.

That is pretty accurate!
Do you have the 20L or the 50L?
Do you mash with the insulation around the BM?

 

[Nesto]

That is pretty accurate!

Do you have the 20L or the 50L?

Do you mash with the insulation around the BM?

20L and I do have the insulation jacket. I was surprised there was that little difference. I expect if I took more measurements there would be a greater differential.

 

[cpa4ny]

There is a temp drop - agree with CJ. I am also not too happy with the intensity of the boil.

Will be getting a jacket for my 20L.

 

[Nesto]

There is a temp drop - agree with CJ. I am also not too happy with the intensity of the boil.

Will be getting a jacket for my 20L.

I'm glad I got the jacket. With it, I get a pretty respectable boil off of 3.8 liters per hour. Haven't tried it without though, don't know how much difference there would be.

 

[SteveOR]

Greetings Braumeisters. I am Glad to join these ranks as a 20l member..I have not read all the posts yet. I will before asking any questions. I went with the electric convenience to be able to brew indoors. I have not tasted anything brewed on it yet as it was a recent gift. I do have 2 batches in secondary and 2 more in primary. I cannot wait to taste what this very cool 20l machine creates. ( Don't worry I do have good homebrew I am drinking good beer from my Blichmann rims system. )

Cheers

 

[ColdJazz]

I have also noted an upwards difference in temperature from the target. This phenomenon mostly occurs when mashing in (and when mashing in directly at the saccharification rest).

For example, if adding the grains to water which is 66 degrees Celsius, the temperature will rapidly rise 3-4 degrees Celsius above the target temperature.

So if adding grains to a water temperature of 66 degrees Celsius, the temperature would rise to about 69 degrees – then going back to 66 in steps of about 1 degree per minute.

So the wrong mash temperature will be kept for about 3-4 minutes.

I think the above is more likely to happen with bigger grain bills (6 kg). I think this could be caused by the fact that the grains itself is isolating the heat and the temperature probe and that the heat coil is located outside the malt pipe.

When adding the grains the water temperature is lowered which the temperature probe reacts to and starts to heat the water (outside the malt pipe) to meet the correct temperature. But since the water isn't recirculated at this point no "real" adjusment is made to the total water temperature.

When the circulation starts – the heated water (now 3-4 degrees above the target temperature) rises the total water temperature.

But when typing this I'm not sure if the BM keeps the temperature while adding the grains (but I'm sure it does!).

Does anyone else have similar experiences?

 

[nielsr]

Question for you owners.
I noticed today while looking inside the pump that the brown coating seems to be flaking off? It is hard to see in the picture but have any of you experienced this? Is it bad?

I have the same issue on a 50L. I noticed it after my first brewing session...

I can't see it on your photo, but on mine it looks like one of the tips of the impeller waves have been scraping the housing. I have the problem on both my pumps.

Niels

EDIT: Oops... It looks like I should read ahaed when browsing my backlog. The question has been answered a few replies down from the original post.

 

[cpa4ny]

I have also noted an upwards difference in temperature from the target. This phenomenon mostly occurs when mashing in (and when mashing in directly at the saccharification rest).

For example, if adding the grains to water which is 66 degrees Celsius, the temperature will rapidly rise 3-4 degrees Celsius above the target temperature.

So if adding grains to a water temperature of 66 degrees Celsius, the temperature would rise to about 69 degrees – then going back to 66 in steps of about 1 degree per minute.

So the wrong mash temperature will be kept for about 3-4 minutes.

I think the above is more likely to happen with bigger grain bills (6 kg). I think this could be caused by the fact that the grains itself is isolating the heat and the temperature probe and that the heat coil is located outside the malt pipe.

When adding the grains the water temperature is lowered which the temperature probe reacts to and starts to heat the water (outside the malt pipe) to meet the correct temperature. But since the water isn't recirculated at this point no "real" adjusment is made to the total water temperature.

When the circulation starts – the heated water (now 3-4 degrees above the target temperature) rises the total water temperature.

But when typing this I'm not sure if the BM keeps the temperature while adding the grains (but I'm sure it does!).

Does anyone else have similar experiences?

My guess is that there is an algorithm built into the Braumeister to heat the water more to compensate for the loss of heat due to the "cold" grains (probably activates when you confirm "Malt added").

I am more concerned with the loss of heat during the main mashing. When the internal thermostat is showing, say, 66C - my reading with the Thermopen off the top of the grain bed can give me 2-3 degrees lower. I tend to max out the grain bill to just south of 6 kg - that certainly may have an impact on the circulation of the heated water, which leads to the temp drop.

I think the insulating jacket should help - about to order one.

 

[ColdJazz]

My guess is that there is an algorithm built into the Braumeister to heat the water more to compensate for the loss of heat due to the "cold" grains...

That's also my theory. But I think the heat compensation (the algorithm) is activated at the "fill in malt" stage (i.e. when you start pouring the malt in the malt pipe - between the two stages "fill in malt" and "malt filled in?"). When pressing "Start" in the "malt filled in?" stage the unit enters the different phase stages.

I am more concerned with the loss of heat during the main mashing. When the internal thermostat is showing, say, 66C - my reading with the Thermopen off the top of the grain bed can give me 2-3 degrees lower.

Interesting how accurate your data is compared to mine. But like I said, the temperature drop is happening gradually through the whole malt bed - which is pretty thick (6kg)! So maybe 2-3 degrees Celsius isn't that bad after all. But still an issue you should be aware of (and find a solution to if possible).

I tend to max out the grain bill to just south of 6 kg - that certainly may have an impact on the circulation of the heated water, which leads to the temp drop.

A maxed out grain bill would certainly affect the circulation. And that would work counteractive to the heat compensation (the algorithm). The heat compensation probably works better at a grain bill of 4-5 kg.

I have the insulating jacket - but I often take it off during mashing due to the fact that the temperature often starts to drift upwards when using it.

I will give it a try next time (Sunday).

And a solution to the problem where the temperature rise during mash in could be to set the initial temperature (mash in/dough in) about 3 degrees Celsius lower than the first phase.

 

[nielsr]

I just wanted to let you know that I created a forum dedicated to the Speidel Braumeister. It is in no way my intention to try and replace forums like HBT, but I've found that BM information is a bit scattered.

Besides a forum there are plans for a Braumeister wiki and some more BM dedicated tools.

Please feel free to join us at http://braumeisters.net

As with all forum launches, content is thin, but I hope this changes rapidly...

Prost!

Niels

 

[cpa4ny]

Thanks CJ - would be delighted to hear your observations regarding jacket-on temp drops data.

 

[dinnerstick]

I just wanted to let you know that I created a forum dedicated to the Speidel Braumeister. It is in no way my intention to try and replace forums like HBT, but I've found that BM information is a bit scattered.

Besides a forum there are plans for a Braumeister wiki and some more BM dedicated tools.

Please feel free to join us at http://braumeisters.net

As with all forum launches, content is thin, but I hope this changes rapidly...

Prost!

Niels

thanks! i'm registered!! i hope everyone from here posts mods and suggestions there as indeed it will be easier to find than searching back through this enormous thread

 

[Jette]

I registered there a couple days ago! good work!

 

[ColdJazz]

I now have some data from using the insulation jacket during the mashing.

I put the jacket on after I noticed that the temperature had even out (the dough in/mash in was set to 3 degrees Celsius below the temperature I had set for the scarification phase).
Of course the temperature of the mash rised quickly (10-15 seconds) to 68 degrees Celsius. When the temperature had stabilized I dressed the BM in the insulation jacket.

As the wort circulates through the malt bed during the first phase (first scarification phase) the temperaure of the liquid fall as the temperature of the malt is still too cold – that's why we get a difference of 2-3 degrees Celsius from the temperature we have chosen for that phase.

The first minutes of the first phase, the wort coming up from the top of the malt pipe was only 53-54 degrees Celsius, which is 14 degrees Celsius lower than the set temperature!

After 15-20 minutes the temperature had reached an equilibrium throughout the malt bed, and now the difference was only 1 degree Celsius from the actual temperature (which I consider spot on in this system).

I got pretty much the same result during the second phase. But the huge difference of 14 degrees was only an issue during the first phase – when the wort was circulted through the malt the first time. And I felt that the equilibrium throughout the malt bed happened faster during the second phase.

The above data was with a BM 20 litres, 6 kilo malt and the use of the insulation jacket.


My lesson from the above is that I will probably start to use a dough in/mash in phase (as phase 1). I will probably mash in at either 40 degrees or 52 degrees (I will see...). I don't really think this is necessary for well modified malt, but I think it might be important to prepare/heat up the malt bed for the first scarification phase.

Another solution could be to add 10-15 minutes to the first phase.

...I will look into this further.

If someone with a 50L BM has any experience to share in regard of the above I would be very happy.

 

[cpa4ny]

I now have some data from using the insulation jacket during the mashing.

I put the jacket on after I noticed that the temperature had even out (the dough in/mash in was set to 3 degrees Celsius below the temperature I had set for the scarification phase).
Of course the temperature of the mash rised quickly (10-15 seconds) to 68 degrees Celsius. When the temperature had stabilized I dressed the BM in the insulation jacket.

As the wort circulates through the malt bed during the first phase (first scarification phase) the temperaure of the liquid fall as the temperature of the malt is still too cold – that's why we get a difference of 2-3 degrees Celsius from the temperature we have chosen for that phase.

The first minutes of the first phase, the wort coming up from the top of the malt pipe was only 53-54 degrees Celsius, which is 14 degrees Celsius lower than the set temperature!

After 15-20 minutes the temperature had reached an equilibrium throughout the malt bed, and now the difference was only 1 degree Celsius from the actual temperature (which I consider spot on in this system).

I got pretty much the same result during the second phase. But the huge difference of 14 degrees was only an issue during the first phase – when the wort was circulted through the malt the first time. And I felt that the equilibrium throughout the malt bed happened faster during the second phase.

The above data was with a BM 20 litres, 6 kilo malt and the use of the insulation jacket.


My lesson from the above is that I will probably start to use a dough in/mash in phase (as phase 1). I will probably mash in at either 40 degrees or 52 degrees (I will see...). I don't really think this is necessary for well modified malt, but I think it might be important to prepare/heat up the malt bed for the first scarification phase.

Another solution could be to add 10-15 minutes to the first phase.

...I will look into this further.

If someone with a 50L BM has any experience to share in regard of the above I would be very happy.

Very nice write-up CJ - thank you.

This past Sunday, I wrapped my BM with a towel (attached photo) - I had a MUCH boil than I ever had.

The take-away that you mentioned regarding doughing-in at 40C is fully in line with George Fix's famous 40C-60C-70C mash (half an hour for each rest) and 50C-60C-70C for the lesser-modified Pils malts. John Palmer highlights this as well in his How To Brew book:

http://www.howtobrew.com/section3/chapter16-2.html

Proper liquefaction of the mash is very important and I also try to incorporate it in all my step-mashing.

 

[ColdJazz]

In the past I always doughed in at 40 degrees Celsius for 20 minutes (and yes, I blame John Palmer among others for that). The reason for me to mash in at that regime wasn't just to liquefie the mash, but I also felt that it were more gentle to the mash/enzymes and I also believed that the enzymes were distributed more efficiently before the first scarification rest.

Back then I doughed in at 40 degrees Celsius even if I was going to use only one scarification step (and mash out).

...but after discussing the above with my friend (as he's got a degree in brewing engineering) and getting inputs from a quite famous brewmaster here in Sweden, I skipped the above step (and I did not notice a huge difference in the yield).

But I still believe in the reasons I listed above (even if they might not be of as much importance as I first thought). And I do believe that the dough in might be even more important when using a BrewMeister.

So like I said in my previous post – I will probably go back to the dough in step and see how that affects the stabilisation and evenness of the temperature throughout the malt bed (of the first scarification step). Spontaneously I think that the issue with the huge difference of 14 degrees Celsius in the beginning of the mash will be gone. And I also believe that the 15-20 minutes for the temperature to even out throughout the malt bed will be shorter (at least that's what I hope).

And I do recommend you to buy the insulation jacket – even if it wouldn't help you during the mash, it WILL help a lot during the boil. I can also recomend you to buy the hood for the BM. It helps the boil even more (without covering the BM).

 

[cpa4ny]

The jacket is on the to-buy list (however - currently sold out at MoreBeer, my go-to online brew store).

I do have the hood - you can see it peeping out from under the towel

 

[ColdJazz]

I do have the hood - you can see it peeping out from under the towel

Oh yeah - there it is!

I have the hood connected to a ventilation system (which is a bit too effective - it also affects the rate of the boil in a negative way if set too high).