'Sour cherry' off-taste in porter

[grrickar]

I attempted to do a toasted coconut porter with some oak, and I'm not sure if I overdid the oak or what. I used just 4-5 tiny oak cubes along with a pound of toasted coconut in the secondary.

I had high hopes for this, but I get no smell nor taste of coconut, but there is an off-smell I cannot describe, and a tang when you sip it - not unlike sour cherry. The roast comes on just after this. It is drinkable, but totally not what I was going for.

So what produces a sour cherry off taste in beer, and what would cause it? BTW, I did a RIS using the same oak cubes and got a very similar taste. Maybe it is the oak?

 

[jbunton]

Not that it's of any help to you but I just found something similar with a brown ale. Just did a direct comparison between glass and plastic bottles and wham what I difference. glass was a million times better. Well looks like no more plastic for me!

 

[grrickar]

This brew was bottled in glass, it has been in the bottles found about 1.5 weeks now. I think it is the oak. This is the second beer I have tasted this in, and both were oaked...

 

[jbunton]

Was the oak wood you used seasoned wood or green/wet wood. That could have a huge effect

 

[trav77]

Bret infection? That can certainly produced cherry pie flavours.

 

[grrickar]

I don't think it was Brett - I have had beers made specifically with it and the flavor is not quite the same.

The oak are 'Hungarian' oak cubes, bought from a online HBS, which are supposed to naturally impart a vanilla flavor. I did not get them from Amazon, but it is basically these https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004NXSK20/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

[Beernik]

Sour cherry sounds like an infection to me too.

Oak shouldn't impart sour. It could cause bitter/tannin, but not sour.

 

[helibrewer]

4-5 cubes in 5 gallons is not that much, I doubt this is coming from the oak. Anything else in your process common to both beers?

High esters maybe? what was your fermentation temp and what yeast? Same yeast strain in both beers?

 

[grrickar]

Been too long to recall the yeast strain on the RIS, but I added oak, chocolate and vanilla to that one. Honestly I thought it was the cacao nibs the first time around.

Similar grain bills, but with varying amounts as one was a porter and the other a RIS. Sour cherry is about the only way I can describe it - but again I don't think it is a Brett infection.

Ever had Three Philosophers? Is it less pronounced that than, and more 'sharp' tasting.

 

[Beernik]

I have not had it. But it's blended with an Old Bruin Kriek. And that kind me of keeps me at "infected."

The other likely thing that lends fruitiness is fermentation temp / yeast strain. Like London III can get fruit punchy at its upper temp range. But it wouldn't be sour.

 

[SGTSparty]

So just from reading this thread i'd wonder if the the oak chips are imparting some type of infection or something. I think I'd start by replacing those. Any batches using the same equipment process in between the two batches in question? If so then you'd have to think its something from the oak chips right?

 

[grrickar]

All my equipment is cleaned and reused, so with numerous batched in between I would have expected other ill results.

Fermentation temps have been 65-70 in my basement, so I don't think the yeast were stressed.

I agree about the oak cubes. First batch with the RIS I soaked in vodka, and figured that would kill the bugs. This batch I just tossed them in, with much the same result.

I think I am going to stick with getting the coconut flavor out of the porter and skip the oak, and then maybe do some 1gal experiments to see if I can isolate the cause.

 

[helibrewer]

You can try making a tea from the oak cubes and tasting it for off flavors.