something every noob should know

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cheschire

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After a couple years of making extract brew after extrsct brew, I finally made an all grain and had an epiphany.
Whenever I made an extract brew that I wanted to have a little more ABV, I would add more extract syrup. Sounds simple enough right? Well I would always add the same amount of steeping grains (around 1/2 pound no matter what recipe). I guess it was because someone told me that too much steeping grains is bad. Well wrong! I have a new rule (the epiphany)
Always stick with about 5-6 pounds of extract. If you want a higher ABV, add corn sugar. And ALWAYS use steeping grains! its what makes the extract brews taste like real beer! Always use atleast 1 1/2 pounds or more! Thats what I learned from my experience. I dont know why it took an all grain batch to teach me that but now I know.
 
+1 Adding corn sugar to up the ABV without regard to what else it's doing to your beer is not a good idea.
 
Well my beers have come out tasting more like an all grain with corn sugar rather than more extract. More extract is what gives the "homebrew" taste. Use honey then if your worried about what looks good on paper.
Im just saying whats worked well for me.
 
I thought the corn sugar causing cider flavors claim has been debunked. I can see negative consequences if it is a large portion of your grain bill, but adding a cup of corn sugar to boost ABV isn't going to do much more than dry out the beer a tiny bit. With the addition of extra steeping grains you should be able to balance out the mouthfeel.

That being said, I think adding more malt extract is a better way to go if you want to boost ABV because it won't dry the beer out and will lend better mouthfeel and malt flavor. The steeping grains are lending the flavors that mask the common extract flavor or "twang" as I've seen it called, not the corn sugar. Corn sugar ferments out completely with very little flavor contribution.
 
NorCalAngler your right about the sugar fermenting out completely but i dont think it will cover up anything either. Its just a good way to boost the ABV if you want to keep the beer light without adding a thicker flavour from more extract.

More extract is a good way to boost ABV as well but if you dont want a heavy beer, stick to the corn sugar.
 
If I converted a BIG beer from all grain to extract I might deduct a small amount of extract and add corn sugar instead because the extract isn't going to be as fermentable and with big beers this means you don't get down to your final gravity and your end product is sweet. ie instead of 12 lbs of extract I might do 11 lbs extract, 1 lb corn sugar........or MAYBE 10.5 lbs extract and 1.5 lbs corn sugar. But other then that I disagree with the OP.....randomlly throwing in corn sugar to increase ABV instead of adding extract (and increasing the hops appropriately) is going to lead to a lower quality beer.
 
I'd guess the beer tastes better because that is what you like your beer to taste like. I would add more Extract, and a comparable amount of steeping grains and avoid corn sugar altogether (unless the recipe calls for it). I'm not sure corn sugar would give much flavor, but the grains would add mouthfeel and complexity, things that most people are looking for in their beer.
 
Yeah but why the corn sugar? That's what makes extract brews taste like cider.

Corn sugar doesn't make beer taste like cider. Corn sugar ferments completely and contributes nothing but alchohol.


What the OP seems to have figured out is that LME is less fermentable, so when you make big beers, you end up with high FGs. He's using more steeping grains and sugar to offset that.
 
That being said, I think adding more malt extract is a better way to go if you want to boost ABV because it won't dry the beer out and will lend better mouthfeel and malt flavor.

No, it won't dry the beer out, it'll do the opposite, make the beer sweeter, especially if you're using LME.
 
No, it won't dry the beer out, it'll do the opposite, make the beer sweeter, especially if you're using LME.

That's why you have to balance it out. If you up the extract you need to adjust your hop schedule. You can't just throw a bunch more of ANY ONE THING into a beer and expect it to come out the same. Even changing the amount of yeast you use can change the character of the beer.
 
About how much will a half cup of corn sugar increase your OG with a 5 gal batch?

You're trying to convert a volume measurement to a weight measurement. If 3/4 cup is a rule of thumb for 5oz and it adds roughly 0.25% ABV then 1/2 cup will add roughly 0.17%.

Dextrose is 42ppg: 1lb x 42ppg / 5 gallons = 1.0084 gravity for each pound of dextrose in a five gallon batch.
 
That's why you have to balance it out. If you up the extract you need to adjust your hop schedule. You can't just throw a bunch more of ANY ONE THING into a beer and expect it to come out the same. Even changing the amount of yeast you use can change the character of the beer.

Thats exactly what I was saying. Just adding DME leads to a higher FG. Adding a mix of sugar and specialty grains (at the right proportion) could lead to the same FG.

WHich is exactly what the OP was saying before a bunch of people jumped in with OMG!SUGAR!
 
Thats exactly what I was saying. Just adding DME leads to a higher FG. Adding a mix of sugar and specialty grains (at the right proportion) could lead to the same FG.

WHich is exactly what the OP was saying before a bunch of people jumped in with OMG!SUGAR!

You aren't saying the same thing. Cheshire was talking about the balance of malt and hops, which is directly tied to taste (the OP's main point). You're talking about final gravity and how DME will have more unfermentable sugar than pure dextrose. Cheshire's point stands that adding dextrose will make your beer thinner in mouthfeel and taste, period. If that's what you're going for that's fine, but the OP was talking about how to mask extract twang. Dextrose doesn't mask anything, it's the specialty grains that are masking the twang.

Edit: I don't think my example explained it well enough.

Take two recipes, one is made with 6lb LME and the other is made with 5lb LME and 1lb dextrose. These two beers will have much different flavor and mouthfeel because the beer made with dextrose will be thinner and have less malt character. The extract twang will still be there (arguably less noticeable with 1lb less LME, but I doubt it) because dextrose doesn't contribute any flavor.

So what is the missing piece? The specialty grains. The specialty grains are responsible for the perceived improved flavor profile because they mask the underlying extract twang.
 
You're trying to convert a volume measurement to a weight measurement. If 3/4 cup is a rule of thumb for 5oz and it adds roughly 0.25% ABV then 1/2 cup will add roughly 0.17%.

Dextrose is 42ppg: 1lb x 42ppg / 5 gallons = 1.0084 gravity for each pound of dextrose in a five gallon batch.

So, if I wanted to increase my ABV by 1% I would add 3 cups corn sugar to the recipe?
 
Thats exactly what I was saying. Just adding DME leads to a higher FG. Adding a mix of sugar and specialty grains (at the right proportion) could lead to the same FG.

WHich is exactly what the OP was saying before a bunch of people jumped in with OMG!SUGAR!

No, that's totally different from what I was saying. Even adding specialty grains won't fix dumping a bunch of sugar in willy nilly. Extract and hops aren't the same thing as sugar and steeping grains. If it were, I could brew a hell of a lot cheaper than I do now! :D
 
After a couple years of making extract brew after extrsct brew, I finally made an all grain and had an epiphany.
Whenever I made an extract brew that I wanted to have a little more ABV, I would add more extract syrup. Sounds simple enough right? Well I would always add the same amount of steeping grains (around 1/2 pound no matter what recipe). I guess it was because someone told me that too much steeping grains is bad. Well wrong! I have a new rule (the epiphany)
Always stick with about 5-6 pounds of extract. If you want a higher ABV, add corn sugar. And ALWAYS use steeping grains! its what makes the extract brews taste like real beer! Always use atleast 1 1/2 pounds or more! Thats what I learned from my experience. I dont know why it took an all grain batch to teach me that but now I know.

Hey there BC Canada guy, what city are you in?
 
Thats exactly what I was saying. Just adding DME leads to a higher FG. Adding a mix of sugar and specialty grains (at the right proportion) could lead to the same FG.

WHich is exactly what the OP was saying before a bunch of people jumped in with OMG!SUGAR!

Yes you are correct on the point I was getting to. And NorCalAngler that is also what I was saying, by adding more steeping grains it covers up the twang flavour. So if you dont want such a heavy beer, add corn sugar and more steeping grains.

Do whatever you want with hops, I wasnt origionally talking about those.

So IMHO I think that (for example) 5lbs of extract with 1lb of corn sugar and more steeping grains, tastes better than 6lbs extract and no corn sugar with steeping grains. I seem to find that more extract gives the beer a "homebrew" taste. The way to combat this is with corn sugar and steeping grains. I hope this clears thing up.

hopdawg, Im in Victoria:rockin:
 
Using extract does not cause "homebrew" flavor if it's good, fresh extract. What every noob should know is that improving their process will do much more for the flavor of their beer than dumping sugar in it.

Everyone has the right to do whatever they want when brewing their beer, but telling every noob "Throwing sugar in it always makes it better!" is bad advice and I hope new brewers will see that.
 
Geez man every post I get from you is saying I'm wrong. Read it again and maybe you'll notice that Ive said this is what Ive learned in my experience and opinion an I didn't say it always makes it better. I said if you don't want a heavy beer, use corn sugar. Learn to read whats posted before criticizing
 
I think it depends on what you define as good beer. My first brew came up short on OG so I added corn surgar in small amounts to up it a bit. Nothing drastic though. It gave a good clean beer flavor with a light body. I imagine the OP likes a more light bodied but higher alcohol beer. It would probably be even better if other adjunct gains such as rice and corn were used instead of pure sugar, or at least instead of so much pure sugar.
The most important thing of course is what you like. If you enjoy making it and enjoy drinking it then RDWHAHB.
 
Learn to read whats posted before criticizing

I did read your post and responded to it. Learn to accept critcism before posting.

It's not that you said "Here's something I've noticed with my brews"... you said "Here's something every noob should know" and go on to say "Always stick with about 5-6 pounds of extract. If you want a higher ABV, add corn sugar."

That's just bad advice. I didn't attack you, just your words because I feel they were wrong. People who are new to brewing need to work on their process more than they need to just add more sugar to up their ABV. If they want higher ABV beers, they should work on brewing higer ABV beers and not just dump in corn sugar so they can get a better buzz. That's the sort of thing that gives homebrewing the reputation it has in some circles.
 
youve read one post, theres step one. Now read all my other posts. turn off the tunnel vision. Im not telling anyone to do anything. Im sharing my experiences that others should read and aknowledge. If you're really against corn sugar that much then go read somewhere else. Just because you have bad experiences with corn sugar doesnt mean everyone does. If people dont want to try what Ive written they dont have to.
 
If you want fine details, when I said "Ihave a new rule", "Always stick with about 5-6 pounds of extract. If you want a higher ABV, add corn sugar."

I meant thats a rule for myself. Im no brewing police I cant set rules.
 
Yes you are correct on the point I was getting to. And NorCalAngler that is also what I was saying, by adding more steeping grains it covers up the twang flavour. So if you dont want such a heavy beer, add corn sugar and more steeping grains.

Do whatever you want with hops, I wasnt origionally talking about those.

So IMHO I think that (for example) 5lbs of extract with 1lb of corn sugar and more steeping grains, tastes better than 6lbs extract and no corn sugar with steeping grains. I seem to find that more extract gives the beer a "homebrew" taste. The way to combat this is with corn sugar and steeping grains. I hope this clears thing up.

hopdawg, Im in Victoria:rockin:

Nice! I am in Nanaimo! WHere do you get your supplies?
 
theres a place near mayfair mall on fairfield called hobby beer and wine and they have absolutely everything.

Although if you do plan on going there to buy large quantities of grains, you might want to call in advance and if they're short they'll order some for you.
 
If you want fine details, when I said "Ihave a new rule", "Always stick with about 5-6 pounds of extract. If you want a higher ABV, add corn sugar."

I meant thats a rule for myself. Im no brewing police I cant set rules.

I understand where you are coming from. To me what you are doing is simply bumping the ABV without impacting the overall flavor/feel of the original beer too much. That is pretty much what the macro's do and they are still in business.

Of course it is all up to one's taste and my hat goes off to you for finding a system that works for you, and for sharing your experience.

I am wondering about the "home brew" taste you mentioned. Can you be more specific as to what that means?
 
theres a place near mayfair mall on fairfield called hobby beer and wine and they have absolutely everything.

Although if you do plan on going there to buy large quantities of grains, you might want to call in advance and if they're short they'll order some for you.

Do they carry grains? Or bulk grains even? This is VERY exciting, hoping to finally get a local hookup!
 
Kevin, when I have an AG beer I find that I can really tell that its been made by mashing grains in the taste, but with extract, I can always seem to taste the (in my case) syrup thats been used to make it. Its kind of a sinthetic flavour. But using the method I described earlier, I am able to cover that up and make it taste more like an AG batch.

jjones, the steeping grains they sell are all stored in 10 gallon buckets that are always full and they sell in bulk so I dont see why they wouldnt have bulk base grains aswell. They're closed today but i'll call them for you tomorrow and see what they have.
 
OP:

I've been away for a while (like a few months).

I house beer my friend makes. He loves the cervesas that are out there, and says that additional malt completely ruins it. I can't taste the difference that 500g makes in a 54L batch -- but he can. Now this thread has explained to me why (body).

Thanks for the info, posters.
 
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