Simple Saison

[cardinalsfan]

So I'm planning out my next few brews. Redoing my Cascade Pale and my Amarillo Pale, both will be all grain. I want to do a saison so I came up with this, all on my own!! I still have a couple questions about it though.

Style: Saison
Batch: 2.75 gal All Grain

Characteristics
---------------
Recipe Gravity: 1.064 OG
Recipe Bitterness: 38 IBU
Recipe Color: 12° SRM
Estimated FG: 1.016
Alcohol by Volume: 6.2%
Alcohol by Weight: 4.9%

Ingredients
-----------
Acid Malt 0.75 lb, Grain, Mashed
Chocolate Malt (US) 0.03 lb, Grain, Mashed
Crystal 80L 0.25 lb, Grain, Mashed
Pilsener (Belgian) 4.00 lb, Grain, Mashed
Vienna (US) 0.50 lb, Grain, Mashed
Wheat (Belgian) 1.50 lb, Grain, Mashed

Amarillo 0.50 oz, Pellet, 20 minutes
Amarillo 0.25 oz, Pellet, 7 minutes
Styrian Golding (Slovenia) 1.00 oz, Pellet, 60 minutes

French Saison Yeast 1.00 unit, Other, Wyeast 3711

The chocolate and crystal 80 are for color. The acid is for acidity. I've read you need around 10% acid malt to get any sour flavor in the beer. Also, I plan to dry hop the last 0.25 oz of amarillo. I'll make a starter for the yeast.

Now, the questions. Should I use coriander? If so, how much and when? I feel like I want more IBU. Could I go with a clean bittering hop @ 60 and use the styrian and amarillo late? Is the amarillo ok in a Saison? I plan to use spring water and add gypsum to make it harder. How much should I add and when?

Anything else you wanna comment on, go ahead. Thanks!! :rockin:

 

[cardinalsfan]

Also, yes, 2.75 gal recipe, with 2.5 gal going into the fermenter. 0.25 left behind as break material.

 

[BigRob]

Scrub the crystal, no reason to put it in a saison. You'll get tartness from 3711, not quite the same as a pound of acid malt though.Your estimated FG is WAY high, 3711 is going to put you around 1.002-1.004, so your 38IBUs are going to feel quite a lot more bitter than you're expecting. The attenuation for 3711 is not right in the default Beersmith setup, it's exceptionally high, above 90%.

Amarillo is nice in a saison, but it's not traditional. Goldings are one of the traditional saison hops. What you might consider is first wort hopping with your amarillo, and doing a flameout with goldings. Only concern is the Amarillo overpowering the goldings.

As far as spices, if you want simple, skip them.

 

[cardinalsfan]

Estimated FG was from the program, just a default value. Completely forgot about it drying out that much and how that will affect bitterness.

I know amarillo isn't traditional, I just thought it would fit well.

Could it be too tart between the 3711 and acid malt? I do really like sour beers.

I may brew this without spices and do it again with if I feel it needs it.

Thanks for the advice!!

 

[kingwood-kid]

Your gravity will read about 1.002, but will feel higher. Saison yeasts produce a lot of glycerol, which increases mouthfeel. But acid malt and 38 IBU will both make it seem devoid of sweetness, aside from probably not combining well with each other.

I'd leave out the crystal, coriander and most of the acid malt. Saison yeast is so flavorful on its own that you can make a nice beer with no flavor hops whatsoever, but BigRob's suggestion sounds excellent as well.

 

[bellsbrat]

If you want a little color 2oz of carafa special 2 will do the trick

 

[cardinalsfan]

Thanks guys!! Based on some feedback, I like the following recipe now:

Characteristics
---------------
Recipe Gravity: 1.063 OG
Recipe Bitterness: 34 IBU
Recipe Color: 10° SRM
Estimated FG: 1.008
Alcohol by Volume: 7.1%
Alcohol by Weight: 5.6%

Ingredients
-----------
Candi Sugar, Clear (Belgian) 0.50 lb, Sugar, Other
Carafa II malt 0.03 lb, Grain, Mashed
Pilsener (Belgian) 4.00 lb, Grain, Mashed
Vienna (US) 0.50 lb, Grain, Mashed
Wheat (Belgian) 1.50 lb, Grain, Mashed

Styrian Golding (Slovenia) 1.00 oz, Pellet, 60 minutes
Tettnanger (U.S.) 0.50 oz, Pellet, 7 minutes
Tettnanger (U.S.) 0.50 oz, Pellet, 20 minutes

French Saison Yeast 1.00 unit, Other, Wyeast 3711

I'll save amarillo, acid malt and any spices for when/if I brew it again.