Selling beer in New Jersey

[Elshauno]

The price is high in Ohio 3906 dollars per year to hold the license to make beer beer for resale in Ohio. Yowsers!

 

[mtnjam7]

I have about 8.5 acres zoned farm, I wonder if I could brew on my property? I bet it is easy to get it changed from farm to commercial, just change the use.

depending on the local definition on 'farm' in your town's zoning it commercial is sometimes allowed, though not normally. you would have to get a use variance from your town, or get the town to change the zoning for your parcel (much harder).
From what the OP said, that you can't be zoned 'residential' which probably means you have to be in commercial zone, so just getting a use variance on lot zoned for farm or residential will not be enough.

If anyone has any other questions regarding zoning/planning and permitting for things along these lines in NJ, just ask, I'm a civil engineer and that's what I do.

 

[magnj]

If anyone has any other questions regarding zoning/planning and permitting for things along these lines in NJ, just ask, I'm a civil engineer and that's what I do.

What is your bribery rate, I want my rented apartment basement zoned commercial

 

[Lunarpancake]

NJ only has 3 major wholesalers for wine and liquor. i worked for one them. they didnt deal with any beer. but even brewpubs would have to get their liquor and wine from the wholesaler.

i believe, but im not positive, even wholesalers like costco and BJs, have to buy from 1 of the 3 major wholesalers and resell to consumers. they cant buy directly from absolut or any of the other suppliers

For a large company like Absolut it would be insanity to deal with every single bar / store in the world. So instead they deal solely with the wholesalers. It makes everything easier and they probably make the same amount of money if they had sold direct to the bar/store.

For someone that owns a micro or nano brewery who really isnt putting out a large amount of beer a year it is wise to sell direct to the local bars/stores. Once you are big enough you would eventually move onto selling to a wholesale company I would imagine. But there is no need in the beginning.

 

[Lunarpancake]

depending on the local definition on 'farm' in your town's zoning it commercial is sometimes allowed, though not normally. you would have to get a use variance from your town, or get the town to change the zoning for your parcel (much harder).
From what the OP said, that you can't be zoned 'residential' which probably means you have to be in commercial zone, so just getting a use variance on lot zoned for farm or residential will not be enough.

If anyone has any other questions regarding zoning/planning and permitting for things along these lines in NJ, just ask, I'm a civil engineer and that's what I do.

Also it may be easy to change your land to be commercial but hard to re-zone back to residential. Are you entirely sure you would want to be stuck with acres of commercially zoned land if your brewery fails? (or you leave it)

 

[nostalgia]

From what the OP said, that you can't be zoned 'residential' which probably means you have to be in commercial zone, so just getting a use variance on lot zoned for farm or residential will not be enough.

Well, she said "commercial property" if I remember correctly, not commercial zone. So getting a use variance might be enough.

Aren't they a pretty big pain to get, too?

-Joe

 

[jessup]

some properties - along a main st. for instance - can be mixed zoning. i think if you're in a mixed residential/commercial area you may possibly be able to brew at your residence. i'm probably wrong, though...

the gov't wants economic stability, but they make impossible to succeed as a small brewer. what gives? they need to make it possible for things to be and stay LOCAL!! i'm all about community

 

[jgln]

depending on the local definition on 'farm' in your town's zoning it commercial is sometimes allowed, though not normally. you would have to get a use variance from your town, or get the town to change the zoning for your parcel (much harder).
From what the OP said, that you can't be zoned 'residential' which probably means you have to be in commercial zone, so just getting a use variance on lot zoned for farm or residential will not be enough.

If anyone has any other questions regarding zoning/planning and permitting for things along these lines in NJ, just ask, I'm a civil engineer and that's what I do.

Maybe I am getting farm assessment confused with commercial zoned. Some of the farmland that I see up for sale says commercial. I guess something I could easily find out but I am not planning on opening a brewery at least any time soon.

 

[jgln]

Well, she said "commercial property" if I remember correctly, not commercial zone. So getting a use variance might be enough.

Aren't they a pretty big pain to get, too?

-Joe

Yeah, maybe she meant the building you brew in can not be a residential home. I have heard of that before where people who bake cakes in their home and then decide to sell to the public can no longer do it in their kitchen.

 

[Pivzavod]

nothing is easy in new jersey...

except the girls?

 

[Teromous]

Yeah Virginia is worse. You might as well make alcohol or wine.

Brewery:
- 10,000 barrels or less annually - $2,150.00
- over 10,000 barrels annually - $4,300.00

Winery:
- 5,000 gallons or less annually - $189.00
- over 5,000 gallons annually -$3,725.00

Distillery:
- 5,000 gallons or less annually - $450.00
- over 5,000 gallons annually - $3,725.00

Fruit Distillers:
- Flat Rate - $3,725.00

This doesn't cover the sale either...

 

[magnj]

I don't think ours is that high, below $2,000 gets you up to 50k barrels last time I looked.

 

[Goatey]

Interesting... it makes sense though. Not to get too political, but our government does need to collect tax money somehow. I think luxuries like tobacco and alcohol are fair game to tax. I'd rather pay lower taxes on my income and higher taxes on my luxuries like beer and cable TV. In the end, if times get bad, I can live without that stuff.

But I'm glad to read it doesn't sound too terribly difficult to open your own brewpub.

 

[mtnjam7]

Well, she said "commercial property" if I remember correctly, not commercial zone. So getting a use variance might be enough.

Aren't they a pretty big pain to get, too?

-Joe

Commercial property and commercial zone is probably just semantics. If this is something you want to do, there's definitely some research with the township, and liquor laws that need to be done.

 

[defenestrate]

does anyone know for sure if you are able to sell growlers for off premise consumption in jersey? Im going to call the ttb tomorrow but i'm being impatient. i was under the assumption that you could not, but at flying fish they are allowed to sell you 2 6 packs when visiting/touring the brewery... which would be consistent with some other states being able to sell 2 growlers to each person.

 

[sirsloop]

rent a storage garage and brew your beer there!! HAHA!

 

[skiwithg]

does anyone know for sure if you are able to sell growlers for off premise consumption in jersey? Im going to call the ttb tomorrow but i'm being impatient. i was under the assumption that you could not, but at flying fish they are allowed to sell you 2 6 packs when visiting/touring the brewery... which would be consistent with some other states being able to sell 2 growlers to each person.

Both Iron Hill & Tun Tavern sell growlers to go, so I'm guessing the answer is yes.

 

[PanzerBanana]

JERSEY HAS A BEER MAFIA!

 

[defenestrate]

Both Iron Hill & Tun Tavern sell growlers to go, so I'm guessing the answer is yes.

i didnt know if this was something specific to brew pubs.

 

[magnj]

Climax sells growlers, I think you would need a permit to fill them and sell them out of the brewery though.

 

[Kruuuger]

does anyone have any updated info on this since the last post?

I know Cricket Hill Brewery in NJ can fill your growler for you during tours/tastings....but i dont know if a special permit is needed. And yes, the owner has mentioned that they are limited to selling you 2 six packs.

Also, i wonder if there is such an environment where i can rent an apt, live upstairs where it's zoned residential, but also rent out the first floor which could be my brewery (commercial).

does anyone know exactly what constitutes a brewpub in NJ. yes i know theres food on premise...but could you get a brewpub license and literally just cook hotdogs/burgers? cant be that simple...

 

[Magnatron]

We looked into opening a brew pub two years ago, but decided that New Jersey wasn't the place to build. There's a reason there aren't many brew pubs in New Jersey as compared to other states

The largest impediment was the liquor license. In New Jersey, there can only be one liquor license per category per 3000 residents in a community. Because of this, liquor licenses can go for upwards of $1 million - IF you know when they come up for bid. Most times, liquor licenses are sold quietly through intermediaries, and as such, a lot of them end up in the big chains hands (who can afford the process and the price).

Add to that the other license requirements such as a brewing license, a health certificate, and a restaurant license (even if you're not serving food as beer is classified as food in NJ), along with crazy zoning issues and taxation requirements, we decided to forgo the brew pub and work at our regular jobs for a living.

 

[magnj]

Yea I had this dream of opening a small beer bar / brewpub and then after carefully reading the laws realized it's never going to happen in NJ because you need a full liquor license. If you really want to make beer in NJ you're probably better off trying to run a commercial operation and self distributing but I'm sure there's a whole set of messed up rules about that too.

 

[magnj]

Any updates? Any nano operations in NJ? What does the law say about selling bottles or growlers out of the brewery? From what I've read I don't see why I couldn't set up a micro operation in a mainstreet area, self distribute locally and sell bottles and growlers out of the shop. Even if that's only allowed during tour hours by permit I think it's still an attractive option.

 

[irishgond]

Its a lot easier in NJ than it is here in FL at least . Here's a couple links. I didn't look thru this whole thread so sorry if they have been posted.

http://www.njbeer.org/
http://www.brewersassociation.org/pages/government-affairs/self-distribution-laws

 

[Kruuuger]

Magnj....im in total agreement with what you stated. Ilm almost positive you would have to go the full operational license route and become a full manufacturing brewery. I hope to be headed down that road in the next few years and am in the process of researching anything and everything that it takes to open up shop in NJ. If you're serious about the inquiry for your own reasons, maybe we should team up and research all laws for nj...i could always use the help. I'm considering locating my operation in hoboken, nj. With warehouse space in the $3k-$5k/month range, plus equipment, I can't see it being possible to turn a profit with anything less than a 15bbl system. Even with that, ud have to be running close to capacity to have any shot of making it. Due to this, I'm considering contract brewing for the first 1-3 yrs. Hopefully gain a following, grow the brand and gauge the future, in order to gain investment interest. Knowing this, I also have to research nj laws on contract brewing. ANYWAYS, if ur at all interested, PM me w ur private email and we'll put together a game plan. If we find enough info, maybe we can put together a wiki for future interest.

 

[infection]

if this bill passes, buy a farm and grow "some" of the ingredients:

http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/2010/Bills/A3500/3063_I1.HTM

http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/2010/Bills/A4000/3520_I1.HTM

"Farm brewery license. 1d. The holder of this license shall be entitled, subject to rules and regulations, to brew any malt alcoholic beverages in a quantity to be expressed in the license not in excess of 2,000 barrels of 31 fluid gallons per year and to maintain a warehouse and to sell products to consumers for consumption off the licensed premises and to offer samples for sampling purposes only. The license shall be issued only when the brewery at which such malt alcoholic beverages are brewed is located and constructed upon a tract of land exclusively under the control of the licensee, provided the licensee is actively engaged in farming on or adjacent to the brewery premises and is growing and cultivating hops or another product which is used in the production of the malt alcoholic beverages. The fee for this license shall be graduated as follows: to manufacture between 1,200 and 2,000 barrels per year, $300; to manufacture between 100 and 1,l99 barrels per year, $200; to manufacture fewer than 100 barrels per year, $100. For purposes of this subsection, "sampling" means the selling at a nominal charge or the gratuitous offering of an open container not exceeding one and one-half ounces of a malt alcoholic beverage. No individual or entity shall hold more than one farm brewery license."

on facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=151744564842009

 

[Mischief_Brewing]

if this bill passes, buy a farm and grow "some" of the ingredients:

http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/2010/Bills/A3500/3063_I1.HTM

http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/2010/Bills/A4000/3520_I1.HTM

"Farm brewery license. 1d. The holder of this license shall be entitled, subject to rules and regulations, to brew any malt alcoholic beverages in a quantity to be expressed in the license not in excess of 2,000 barrels of 31 fluid gallons per year and to maintain a warehouse and to sell products to consumers for consumption off the licensed premises and to offer samples for sampling purposes only. The license shall be issued only when the brewery at which such malt alcoholic beverages are brewed is located and constructed upon a tract of land exclusively under the control of the licensee, provided the licensee is actively engaged in farming on or adjacent to the brewery premises and is growing and cultivating hops or another product which is used in the production of the malt alcoholic beverages. The fee for this license shall be graduated as follows: to manufacture between 1,200 and 2,000 barrels per year, $300; to manufacture between 100 and 1,l99 barrels per year, $200; to manufacture fewer than 100 barrels per year, $100. For purposes of this subsection, "sampling" means the selling at a nominal charge or the gratuitous offering of an open container not exceeding one and one-half ounces of a malt alcoholic beverage. No individual or entity shall hold more than one farm brewery license."

on facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=151744564842009

I wonder if the Bellview winery in landisville are the driving force behind that legislation. A friend of mine is in tight with them and knows that they're trying to get set up to brew beer now too.

 

[magnj]

That's interesting. Not really the business model I see myself getting involved in but cool none the less. To me I feel a nano op would have to be physically visible to gain local popularity. Although growning local is awesome and something a nano op would benefit from.

 

[Kruuuger]

Yeah i completely agree. If the company is local and attempting to grow, people are more inclined to purchase. Going the contract route is not ideal for such a belief, but really the only option for someone that is trying to gain a sizable market share, without $500-$1m in available funds. And they feel taking on that much in loans without a sale under the belt is too risky.

I take on the same perspective, in that if i find a "craft" beer that i know is made by one of the big 3, i refuse to buy it. and also, if i find a product that i like and find out it's contracted, i wonder what the motive is behind it. If it's a biz man who has no passion for beer and just see's an investment opportunity, than i will stay away, and spread word to others to stay away.... but if it's contract brewed by a passionate beer lover/brewer who doesn't have the funds and is trying to build up a following, so he/she/they can one day afford a small operation, than i'm all about it and will promote them.

so i see what your saying, but i think it's deeper than that. what are the intentions of the bottom line brewer.

for the area that i live in, i need a commercial location, which will create a large overhead. It isn't possible for me to throw together a 1/5 barrel system out of SS 55gal drums and expect to make it. i know the bottom line I need to even have a chance at being profitable and the cost is just too much for me to take on and too risky for me to get investors involved in. I trulybelieve the hybrid solution of contract brewing for a short period of time (1-3 yrs) is the best option.

but that's just me...