Belgian Dark Strong Ale Rochefort 8 clone (as close as you can get)!

[berck]

The amount of banana ester makes me wonder about your starter. Is it possible you underpitched? How big of a starter did you make? I would say given that gravity I would expect it to be around 3L (assuming one activator pack). The temp played a role for sure, but I accidentally let mine get to 78F during the first 48 hours and I have very minimal banana flavor.

I made a 1.5L starter from an activator pack. It took off pretty quickly, but I suppose it's possible it wasn't enough. I can definitely try a bigger starter next time, seems like I'm certainly unlikely to overpitch.

 

[BrewThruYou]

I missed low on OG and got 1.072. Entered as a Dubbel in a local homebrew comp and got a 35.5, but didn't place (20 entries in Belgian Strong Ales).

Might try entering it again as it ages. It was only bottled for 24 days at competition time and I think it's really good right now.

I bottled into 17 750ml Belgian bottles with corks and cages, 2 375ml Belgians, and the rest into regular long necks. All bottle conditioned. The Belgians will be aged until Christmas and given out as gifts.

 

[MagicLarry]

BrewThruYou, don't be discouraged by the competition results. Although your OG was a little low I'm sure the end result was still good. Bottle conditioning the brew is a must, and with patients you will be rewarded with an outstanding ale. Re-enter a comp in six months from now with a couple of those bottles and I'm sure the result will be different. Good luck!

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

ok, after my visit to Rochefort in October, i HAVE to tackle this clone of 8!!!!

Gomer (the brewer with glasses on, second from left), Pere Jacques our tour guide of the abbey & host (with which we ate cookies and drank beer with!) and me sitting on the right. Awesome day....

 

[markcurling]

Everyone is talking about bottling this beer - do you think that the priming and bottle conditioning process adds anything to the flavour profile?

I brewed this a couple of months ago and it's sitting in a cool garage, I was going to keg it but do you think I'll be missing a trick by not bottling?

 

[Hex23]

I think this style is supposed to be bottle conditioned - the real one definitely is. And I think bottle conditioning adds to the character. This beer is high enough gravity that it certainly needs some conditioning time. If it's been sitting in your cool garage for a couple of months that should have helped. Has it been on a yeast cake that whole time? If you keg, you'll probably still get a good tasting beer, but probably not like a bottle. The ones I brewed over a year ago now seem to just keep getting better. Certainly a beer worthy of cellaring.

 

[markcurling]

Hm, maybe I will make the effort to bottle it then.
If I've counted correctly, I think it had about 3 weeks in primary (rising from 66 to 73 degrees) then 6 weeks in the garage (varying from 32 to 55), still on the yeast cake. I guess it's ready to put in the bottle?

 

[Hex23]

That should be plenty of time bulk conditioning, especially if it was on the primary cake that whole time. For mine I planned on a 4 week primary, but got the flu and waited till 5 weeks.

 

[ultravista]

A few questions ...

Has anyone done a single infusion mash instead of the step? If so, what mash temp?

Has anyone kegged this vs. bottling? If so, what were the results?

 

[ultravista]

Has anyone made their own dark candi syrup? How many pounds of sugar will I need to make 3 pounds of candi? Am I better off buying the stuff or making it?

 

[Brewskii]

Has anyone made their own dark candi syrup? How many pounds of sugar will I need to make 3 pounds of candi? Am I better off buying the stuff or making it?

The opinions I have read make it seems like Belgin Syrup is exponentially better if purchased vs homemade.
As for how to do it, from what I know you boil any simple sugar with some acid like lemon juice or the like until you get a color you like.

Never did it myself though.

 

[fredthecat]

i tried searching for an answer, and i know for sure a ton of belgians have that tiny percent of corn/maize, but... why?

just curious what <4% flaked corn would contribute that couldnt simply be replaced with basemalt or sugar

 

[jgroesbeck]

Silly question here, but are you all botteling with normal caps or corking? I don't see why carbing to less than 3 volumes would require corks? Thanks.

JG

 

[MagicLarry]

I use normal caps. They work just fine.

 

[jgroesbeck]

To the OP: Is your grain bill for a 70% effeciency? Thanks man.

Joe

 

[MagicLarry]

Yes 70% is what it's based on, enjoy!

 

[Matteo57]

Going to try this out soon! Love Rochefort! I thought there was around 5% wheat in the Rochefort recipes... I was listening to a podcast by the homebrewchef and and I swore he said there was 5% wheat in the recipes... you know, good for the monks and all. I can't find the podcast atm but anyone hear this?

 

[Matteo57]

http://www.homebrewchef.com/Inside_Rochefort.pdf
Page 30 - 5% wheat starch. I'm guessing you could sub out the flaked corn for the wheat?
Any ideas?

 

[Brewskii]

http://www.homebrewchef.com/Inside_Rochefort.pdf
Page 30 - 5% wheat starch. I'm guessing you could sub out the flaked corn for the wheat?
Any ideas?

I would guess that your on the right track. The use of wheat starch is mentioned in Brew Like A Monk as a Rochfort ingredient that is used in the mash in place of sugar as an adjunct.
Pg 64 in BLaM says they use a small percentage of wheat starch where they used to use corn because they feared GMO's. That indicates its been a very recent change in their recipe.

 

[joetownhound]

10.92 lb Pilsner (2 row) Belgian (2.0 SRM) 70.24%
1.73 lb Caramunich Malt (46.0 SRM) 11.13%
0.58 lb Corn, Flaked (1.3 SRM) 3.75%
0.58 lb Special B Malt (114.0 SRM) 3.75%
0.23 lb Carafa special dehusked (302.0 SRM) 1.47%
1.50 lb Dark Belgian candy sugar (100 SRM) 9.65 %
1.73 oz Styrian Goldings [4.20%] Boil 60 min
0.75 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker [3.50%] Boil 30 min
0.39 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker [3.50%] Boil 5 min
0.38 oz coriander seed Boil 5 min (Crush first)

MASH PROFILE

Protein rest Add 12.64 qt water at 156.2F to get 142F for 30min
Saccrification Add 11.23 qt water at 170.2F to get 154F for 60 min
Mash out Add 9.83 qt water at 205.6 to get 168F for 5 min
Begin Vorlauf then drain Mash Tun
Sparge with 0.73 gallons of water at 168F

Carb with 4.83 oz corn sugar

This is the award winning recipe by Hermann Holtrop from a Rochefort 8 clone comp that was held in the Netherlands. I think it's very close to the original Rochefort 8. A little darker then the original, but just as tasty... enjoy! If you can't find Carafa Special, Carafa l (337.0 SRM) will work well but will be a bit darker so scale back a bit.

Are you batch sparging or fly sparging this?

 

[MagicLarry]

I batch sparge.

 

[joetownhound]

I batch sparge.

the reason that I ask is that 0.73 gallons of water seems like a small amount. Do you get all the sugars out with this amount and do you do a small beer with more running of this?

 

[MagicLarry]

No, I follow the recipe to a T. I have always had great results!

 

[ultravista]

Subscribing ... will do this after a Westvleteren 12 clone.

 

[Synergy012]

Anyone try this recipe in a 10 gallon mash tun? I don't think it can hold all that grain and water at the same time. Any recommendations for a less space intensive mash schedule?

 

[Matteo57]

I might try and do 10g of this sometime soon. That way I can maybe bottle half and keg half. Might be fun that way! just have to recalculate the measurements for the mash schedule which I haven't done before but sure I can figure it out. Looks delicious!

 

[Hex23]

Anyone try this recipe in a 10 gallon mash tun? I don't think it can hold all that grain and water at the same time. Any recommendations for a less space intensive mash schedule?

I've only done this with a 10 gallon mash tun and obviously no problem. 5 gallon MT would be pushing things, even at 1.25 qt/lb, especially if your efficiency is much less than 80%. I think you could pull this off, but it will be pretty tight.

The only simple way to be less space intensive would be a thicker mash and going any less than 1.25 qt/lb would probably affect efficiency. Or you could split into two mashes, but that will take alot more time. Another alternative would be to take some of the pilsner out of the mash and make it up with extra light DME in the boil, but leave enough pils for conversion (shouldn't be too hard).

 

[MagicLarry]

I also use a 10 Gallon MT with no problems.

 

[Synergy012]

Awesome. Thanks. Will give it a try.

 

[Matteo57]

Anyone keg this ever? Or even better, anyone keg and bottle and notice how different they are? I would rather keg this but if it's going to taste a whole lot better then maybe I'll bottle instead. I don't mind letting it bulk age on yeast or whatever for a longer time then the month+ it calls for.