Belgian Dark Strong Ale Rochefort 8 clone (as close as you can get)!

[Tall_Yotie]

I just carbed it with a standard amount of priming sugar, turned out fine.

 

[Hex23]

+1. The original recipe refers to some beers in the contest adding yeast at bottling time, but it's not a part of the written recipe. I think BLAM says that's the way Rochefort is made. That's why I tried to harvest some yeast from a Roch 10. But since I failed at that, I just went ahead and bottled with priming sugar. I actually used 4.2 oz of priming sugar instead of 4.8 and mine is very well carbonated (almost too much). It actually carbed completely within about 3-4 weeks and that was after a 5 week primary. Honestly I doubt adding yeast at bottling time is necessary. I'm not sure it would make it any better. I'm happy with the end product.

 

[MagicLarry]

No yeast needed at bottling! As far as the amount of priming sugar used, It fits the style guidelines in Beersmith for the volume produced. I have made this quite a few times and would say carbonation is right on. I'm glad to see fellow Rochefort fans are happy with their final product.

 

[jmm635]

Any recommendations on when to add the syrup?

 

[Hex23]

I boiled mine 5 minutes. I don't remember exactly what I based that on. I might have gotten it from descriptions of others doing similar recipes. And I probably was thinking that since the syrup already has a caramel taste, I didn't want to over cook it.

 

[Tall_Yotie]

I added mine at the end of the boil, heard it would add more of the fruit tones than caramel flavors. Seemed to work, 2 months later it had just the right flavors!

 

[CSI - CandiSyrup]

I added mine at the end of the boil, heard it would add more of the fruit tones than caramel flavors. Seemed to work, 2 months later it had just the right flavors!

We tried this recipe with 1# of Candi Syrup, Inc's D-90 with 1/2 lb of the D-180. It brings out a rich caramel toffee aroma close to the original. It's very close an actual Rochefort 8. www.candisyrup.com

 

[MagicLarry]

Glad it turned out good for you! I have had nothing but success with this recipe, a must try for the Rochefort fan.

 

[Tall_Yotie]

So this ended up being a bit under carbed, a fiasco I have been fighting on over/under as my DME for priming is unlabeled so I don't know its attenuation. Switched to corn sugar now, so no problems there.

Sitting at 5 months now, and oh is this tasty. Entering it in the local county fair, first competition, hoping to get some good notes. If I did this again I would use a different brand of candi syrup, will see how SUU's syrups work out on another brew.

I did a side-by side, and these were the differences:

-Real had a white head, mine had a slightly tan head
-Real had more deep fruit and cherry nose, mine had more dark sugar / caramel
-Mouth feel same
-Body slightly lighter on the real, but I upped my candi syrup from the recipe as I wanted a bit more towards the R10 than the R8

All in all a great brew, just could use more of those fruit tones than we all love from Belgian dark ales.

 

[MagicLarry]

Did you refrigerate before sampling at 5 Months? Those amazing fruit notes come out when she's at a cool room temperature. Glad you are enjoying the beer it's one of my favorites to brew.

 

[Tall_Yotie]

It has the recipe's time in the fridge for bulk conditioning, the rest of the time it has been sitting in the apartment's room temp. I make sure with any Belgian ale to have it just cooler than room. There are fruit notes, just not exactly like those in the real deal. Still damned tasty though! It is being entered into my first competition.

 

[rtg]

My very humble attempt using Marris otter, etc..Hopeville calculator.. Got the TG way down.. May have mashed it a bit on the cool side and that I ground this fairly fine. The final product has thus far been tasted after 7 weeks of bottle conditioning. Not quite as smooth tasting as the original, a bit more bitter than I had hope for thus far...



malt & fermentables
# OZ
72% 11 0 Pale Malt (Maris Otter) info 37 3 ~
11% 1 12 Caramunich Malt 40 info 33 40 ~
10% 1 8 Belgian Dark Candi Sugar D2 info 32 160 ~
3% 0 8 Special B Malt info 30 150 ~
3% 0 8 Corn, Flaked info 37 1 ~
1% 0 2 Carafa II info 32 412 ~
Total 15 6

Batch size: 5.0 gallons
Original Gravity 1.074 measured (1.086 estimated)
Final Gravity 1.010 measured (1.021 estimated)
Color 34° SRM / 66° EBC (Black) not measured


Mash Efficiency 69% measured (really??)
(75% used for O.G. estimate)

mash
Given initial grain temp of 68 °F
And initial water to grist ratio of: 1½ quarts per pound
Protein Rest infusion of 5.77 gal at 141 °F to reach 133 °F for 20 mins
Conversion / Saccharification Rest infusion of 2.54 gal at boil to reach 154 °F for 60 mins
Mash-out infusion of 2.66 gal at boil to reach 167 °F for 15 mins



hops
use time oz variety form aa
boil 60 mins 1.75 Styrian Goldings info pellet 5.4
boil 30 mins 0.75 Hallertauer info pellet 4.8
boil 5 mins 0.25 Hallertauer info pellet 4.8

Boil: 6.0 avg gallons for 60 minutes Bitterness
38.3 IBU / 9 HBU
yeast
Wyeast Belgian Abby Ale II (1762) info

Alcohol
8.5% ABV / 7% ABW

(8.7% est. ABV / 7% est. ABW)
Calories
283 per 12 oz.

 

[DannPM]

I think you mashed correctly IMO. BLAM has 90% apparent attenuation with an OG of 1.078 for Rochefort 8 so that would be a FG of 1.0078 or roughly, 1.008. You're closer to the actual FG than the original recipe! How did it taste? It looks great in the side by side...

 

[Sparky]

So, two questions, after reading this thread:
(1) Is post #1 recipe close to it (Rochefort 8)? How did it turn out? Has anyone actually brewed it WITHOUT substitutions?
(2) or, does someone have a (AG) recipe that is close to Rochefort 8?

 

[MagicLarry]

My original posting (recipe) has been brewed many times by me as is. This is the recipe as it stands with no substitutions. As far as the end result, I've been home brewing for about 6 years now and I would have to say this is one of the best recipes I have on hand. It took first in a comp as well. It's a must brew if you like the style. ENJOY!

 

[Tall_Yotie]

I don't recall if I did substitutions, but I know I did it incredibly close and any modifications were meant to be the same for what it was swapping for.

That being said, it came out incredibly close, just a bit more caramelly and a little less fruity. Tasty tasty!

 

[Sparky]

MagicLarry and Tall Yotie. Thanks for the feedback.
I will try this next month when White Labs has their WLP 540 out (only available July/August).
I will also do it with the Candi Syrup mix of 1 lb of D-90 and 1/2 lb of D-180.
I hope to report back in 6 months!

 

[rtg]

I think you mashed correctly IMO. BLAM has 90% apparent attenuation with an OG of 1.078 for Rochefort 8 so that would be a FG of 1.0078 or roughly, 1.008. You're closer to the actual FG than the original recipe! How did it taste? It looks great in the side by side...

Thanks for the compliment. This remains a work in progress. I just opened a bottle now after 11 weeks in the bottle and it is starting to soften up a bit. More like the real thing. As mentioned in this tread, it may take 5 months to fully develop.

 

[rtg]

My original posting (recipe) has been brewed many times by me as is. This is the recipe as it stands with no substitutions. As far as the end result, I've been home brewing for about 6 years now and I would have to say this is one of the best recipes I have on hand. It took first in a comp as well. It's a must brew if you like the style. ENJOY!

I have also tried a PM version along with an AG version and they both are incredible. I was able to tweek the TG of the AG with my mashing schedule down to 1.010 and the PM down to 1.012. Here is one possible 5 gal PM version. I just happened to have a 40 pound bag of Maris Otter otherwise I would have gone Belgian. Everything else, the hops and yeast , of course are the same.

LB OZ MALT OR FERMENTABLE PPG °L
62% 6 15 Briess Pilsen Light DME 44 2
18% 2 0 Pale Malt (Maris Otter) 37 3
9% 1 0 Belgian Candy Sugar Light info 36 0
7% 0 12 Caramunich Malt 40 33 40
3% 0 5 Special B Malt 30 180
1% 0 2 carafa special I 42 320

The AG version is much more refined in flavor (closer to the real thing), but the PM version has the same appearance and also is a great belgian style beer.

 

[jmm635]

How long did everyone's attempt at this beer take to carbonate? I bottled about 3 months ago and popped a bottle tonight for the first time. The aroma and flavor are quite nice but it is very flat.

Am I jumping the gun here or is this batch ruined. Count me nervous....

 

[DannPM]

How long did everyone's attempt at this beer take to carbonate? I bottled about 3 months ago and popped a bottle tonight for the first time. The aroma and flavor are quite nice but it is very flat.

Am I jumping the gun here or is this batch ruined. Count me nervous....

Mine was two weeks. What temp are you storing them at to carb?

 

[jmm635]

Mine was two weeks. What temp are you storing them at to carb?

About 70-75 degrees in my basement. Same as all my other beers.

I had a blow-off the first day in the primary. Did I possibly lose too much yeast? My FG was still pretty close.

 

[Hex23]

Mine started showing signs of reasonable carbonation at 3 weeks which was a surprise given the strength of this beer. It was probably 6 weeks before mine showed full carbonation.

If it was just one bottle, then I'd say you need another one or two more data points from other bottles in the batch. Even if they are not well carbed I wouldn't say it's ruined. There are ways to recover.

 

[MagicLarry]

Hex23 your right on. 5-6 weeks is pretty much when this beer starts to show proper carbonation.

 

[berck]

So, mine's been sitting in bottles for 6 months, now, and I'm still not at all pleased. At this point it's carbonated enough to drink, but not enough to form a real head. It took about 3 months to get to that point.

This was actually my first all-grain beer, which was probably a bit of a reach for me. At the time I brewed it, there was no D2 syrup available anywhere, so I used the soft brown candi sugar. Looks like the D2 is available again, now.

Mine wound up around 1.090 (I think I used slightly more sugar and slightly more grain on purpose as I was actually hoping for something closer to a Rochefort 10).

I fermented it in my apartment which I don't really heat during the winter, ambient temps around 60. The fermentation was the most explosive I've ever seen. I had a blow-off tube fitted, but even that kept getting clogged with yeast. The lid blew off the bucket once. Fermentation temps got until the 73 degree range, despite the cold apartment. Almost right off the bat, the banana odors were so strong, my wife asked if I were baking banana nut bread!

I'd read about this yeast giving off banana notes. These were not notes, but entire banana symphonies.

About a month after bottling it, it tasted like banana-flavored rocket fuel, and was still flat.

Now, 6 months later, it takes like mellow banana-flavored rocket fuel. It's still too harsh, and out of about 25 batches of beer I've brewed, it's the only one I won't serve to guests.

Rochefort is my favorite beer in the world, and since others have had luck with this, I'm going to keep trying.

Since I've been brewing all summer in my un-air conditioned apartment, I've had good luck cooling fermentation temps by keeping the fermenter in a large cooler filled with water, and I add ice as necessary to keep the fermenter temp where I want it. Next time I brew the Rochefort, I plan to do the following:

1) Maintain the temperature at or below 65F.
2) Add more yeast when bottling. I know some of you guys have had luck without doing so, but I haven't.

 

[Hex23]

Sorry to hear of your disappointment. This recipe can really make a great beer. It's good to hear you want to try again.

Couple of thoughts/questions:

I would definitely expect a higher OG like 1.090 to take longer to carb. Not sure about 6 months though.

The amount of banana ester makes me wonder about your starter. Is it possible you underpitched? How big of a starter did you make? I would say given that gravity I would expect it to be around 3L (assuming one activator pack). The temp played a role for sure, but I accidentally let mine get to 78F during the first 48 hours and I have very minimal banana flavor.

 

[BrewThruYou]

I brewed this recipe this past weekend. Used Carafa I instead, but reduced the amount. Made a 2L starter earlier in the week and this thing took off in like 4 hours max.

Bought a corker and Belgian bottles. Gonna try to carb high.

 

[MagicLarry]

Make some labels if you have time, would be a nice touch for the holiday season!

 

[BrewThruYou]

Make some labels if you have time, would be a nice touch for the holiday season!

That's the plan! Trying to learn a label program right now. After primary, I'm going to bottle condition this until the holidays and give them as gifts.

Did a test run with a Black IPA:

 

[MagicLarry]

Gimp is great, and free. Give it a try, you can produce some really nice labels with it.