Revolutionary EPA

[ChillWill]

All-Grain - Revolutionary EPA

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Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: S-04
Yeast Starter: No
Batch Size (Gallons): 5
Original Gravity: 1.043
Final Gravity: 1.012
IBU: 39
Boiling Time (Minutes): 60
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 7 @ 65
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 @ 65
Tasting Notes: Sweet, hoppy


Wanted a English pale ale with an American influence (such as different malts and a few sneaky chinook hops); hence the name... i'm not creative so don't judge me on that. This is only my second brew and I'm pleased with it!

So here goes (apologies for strange amounts, had to convert from UK to US gallons):

Marris Otter: 8lb
Aromatic: 0.45lb
Crystal: 0.55lb
Special B: 0.45lb

Hops:
Chinook: 0.25oz 60min
Goldings: 1.2oz 60min
Goldings: 1.2oz 10min
Goldings: 1.2oz 5 day dry hop
Chinook: 0.25oz 5 day dry hop

Protafloc / whirlfloc added 15min

Mash 154F 75mins
Batch sparge 180F

Currently in bottles but tasting whilst bottling was good! Sweet with a good amount of hops but not IPA bitterness, should be a very enjoyable beer! Looks quite clear as well in bottles. Will add tasting notes in a week or two.

I'm only getting a measly 70% efficiency with my setup by the way. I think that's mostly due to not having a boiling pot big enough to cope with the evapouration... which means I can't sparge as much as I'd like unless I use a second, smaller pot which I'll probably be doing in the future until I sort myself out with a better setup.

 

[ChillWill]

I should also add I cheated with fermentation... it dropped to 1.018 after 3 days with a lot of flocculation so I put it into secondary with dry hops for 5 days where it hit target FG.

Naughty I know... but wanted it ready for when my brother gets back from Afghanistan for a 2 week R&R and it was coming along nicely so thought I'd risk it. Is getting a full 2 weeks in bottles though.

 

[ChillWill]

Just tried a test bottle a few days early... i'm not this impatient most of the time (honest)

Not too bad! Nice and clear although it had a little chill haze as it was in cold basement for a couple of days to settle the last of the yeast. Expect it to be better after another week.

Good mouthfeel, starts off on the sweet side and then the bitterness takes over (although not agressively). Not as hoppy as I'd have liked and maybe a little too bitter for what I was aiming for. Think an adjustment to hop schedule should make it a nice easy drinker (bring some of the early adition toward the end for a bit more flavour). Maybe change the IBU from 40 down to 35.

Anyway, I think it's better than quite a lot of the generic bitters/pale ales you can get from supermarkets that cost 3 times as much! (Worked it out this cost approx £0.50 in ingredients).

 

[FL_Brewer]

Recipe caught my eye cause I brewed the an ESB with the same concept in mind, brewed 3-18-11. The whole UK/America theme. It'll be interesting to compare some notes. I'm on my phone so i'll post more details when I get to a computer.

 

[FL_Brewer]

Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: WYeast 1275 Thames Valley Ale
Yeast Starter: Yes, 2000 ml
Batch Size (Gallons): 5.3
Mash: Single Step, Infusion, Fly Sparge
Saccharification Rest Temp: 152 Time: 60 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Original Gravity: 1.052 measured
Final Gravity: 1.012 anticipated
IBU: 41.1
Color: 11 SRM/ 22 EBC
Boiling Time (Minutes): 75
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 @ 65
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 @ 65

Malt

% LB OZ Malt or Fermentable °L
73% 7 8 Pale Malt (Maris Otter) 3
5% 0 8 Candi Sugar, Clear 0
5% 0 8 Briess CaraBrown 55
5% 0 8 Briess Crystal Malt 40L 40
4% 0 6 Flaked Barley 2
2% 0 4 Cara-Pils/Dextrine 1
2% 0 4 Biscuit Malt 23
2% 0 4 Victory Malt 25
1% 0 2 Special B Malt 118

Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
0.75 oz. Cascade Whole 5.00 15.4 60 min.
0.75 oz. Cascade Whole 5.00 3.1 10 min.
0.50 oz. Cascade Whole 5.00 1.7 1 min.
0.75 oz. Willamette Pellet 4.70 16.0 60 min.
0.75 oz. Willamette Pellet 4.70 3.2 10 min.
0.50 oz. Willamette Pellet 4.70 1.8 1 min.

Extras

Amount Name Type Time
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
2.50 Oz Corn Sugar (Dextrose) Other 28 Days (bottle)
2.00 Oz Isinglass, liquid Fining 4 Days (fermenter)
1.00 Tsp Irish Moss Fining 15 Min. (boil)
0.50 Tsp Wyeast Nutrient Fining 10 Min. (boil)
1.00 g Gypsum salt Mash
2.00 g Calcium Chloride salt Mash
1.00 g Epsom Salt salt Mash

 

[ChillWill]

Hi FL brewer! Yours looks a bit more complicated than mine! Although living in Sheffield (UK) the water doesn't need much adjustment here.

I've brewed this again recently (bottled yesterday). I did a slightly lower mash temp and reduced some of the specialty malts and added a little wheat malt as I felt it was a bit thin originally (but sweet, hence the lower mash).

Anyway, I used a pack of S-04 that I had opened and half used 2 months ago (had been taped up in the fridge); wasn't sure if it'd still be ok but it was and resulted in 83% attenuation! More than I've been getting from the likes of Nottingham yeast and the same as I got from WLP550. It took it down to 1.007 from 1.040, had a bit of a back log and it sat in primary for two weeks, then 1 week in secondary including a few days in the cellar to clear it.

I also added more aroma hops and used some more chinook (including a first wort addition) and reduced some of the goldings.

Anyway, hoping it's an improvement... then again, the first batch was pretty good and didn't last too long. People who tried it said they'd be happy if they got served a pint of it in the pub. Only a few issues though, carbed too low (think 2.2 vol) so gone for upper end of the scale for an APA of 2.8 vol CO2 in bottles.

 

[ChillWill]

I like the look of the Cascade:Willamette combo.

A local brewery which I've been doing a few shifts at does a pale ale using only Willamette and it's won all sorts of awards & medals.

 

[FL_Brewer]

Hey thanks, I was originally pretty excited someone else had the same idea as myself. I didn't want to do an ESB clone type with typical EKG, Fuggle, etc hop profile. (Although, they are some of my favorite hops, and I tend to us them in quite a bit in my porters) I grow hops at home so I had some Cascade to use up. Like you, I think I'm going to find out, when this beer is ready to drink, that I want to lower the IBU's to mid 30's.

I also switched to some new equipment, I upgraded to a barley crusher from a smaller mill. It dropped my efficiency down to 75% from 80%, and my OG was originally calculated to be closer to 1.056.

I just like the effect Gypsum has on highlighting hop character. The other 2 salts provide some balance.

Your 2.2 vols I think is pretty accurate to style, low ish. Like you I'm thinking I'll aim a little higher, 2.5 ish. I like most of my beers with a medium amount of carbonation, I just don't want so much carbonation than it overpowers the unique balances between the malt/hop/yeast character.

How clear was the final beer(s)?

Looking forward to this beer finishing up so we can compare versions, It'll be a huge benefit in tweaking the recipe later on.

 

[ChillWill]

Here is my modified recipe, shall probably create quite a different beer. Clarity in the first wasn't the best due to rushing it through, alhough what I've just bottled looks pretty clear so far and there wasn't a great deal of mess at the bottom of my secondary (I guess leaving it on the yeast for so long helped clear it out a bit more).

I suppose mine might be more in the ESB with bitterness with 38IBUs? The bitterness calms after 4 weeks or so in bottles so I guess it's just down to how quickly you want to be drinking it. I also noticed in my first batch the carbonation and body was much, much better after 3 weeks than it was after two in bottles.

Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: S-04
Yeast Starter: No
Batch Size (Gallons): 5
Original Gravity: 1.040
Final Gravity: 1.007
IBU: 38
Boiling Time (Minutes): 60
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 @ 68-70
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 @ 65

Marris Otter: 7.9lb
Aromatic: 0.2lb
Crystal: 0.4lb
Special B: 0.4lb
Wheat Malt: 0.4lb

Hops:
Chinook 12.4%: 0.4oz fisrt wort
Chinook 12.4%: 0.2oz 60min
Goldings 4.8%: 0.8oz 10min
Goldings 4.8%: 0.2oz 2min
Chinook 12.4%: 0.5oz 2min

Dry hop with 0.7oz of each for 7 days

Protafloc / whirlfloc added 15min

Mash 150F 60mins
Batch sparge 180F

I'll let you know how it turns out! My only concern is the low FG. The brewery I've been working at uses a mash of around 148F and often gets FG 1.010, but obviously when I tried doing closer to that, my yeast got a bit carried away with itself.

 

[FL_Brewer]

Ah that's true I wasn't even paying attention, your's is in the Special/Best/Premium Bitter criteria with the lower OG, whereas mine's more of an ESB. It'll still be good to compare.

I figured I was going to have to let this beer condition in the bottle for a good 2 months. Hopefully it will allow the flavors to properly develop.

What kind of brewery is it?

 

[ChillWill]

It's Kelham island brewery; a fairly standard English brewery. Been going for quite a while now (20 years I believe?). All cask conditioned with a small amount being bottled offsite. 30 barrel brewing capacity. They don't do many experimental brews apart from a collaboration with Brooklyn brewery a few years ago, maybe I could convince them to do this if it turns out well.

 

[FL_Brewer]

Wow that's cool though, my brief apprenticeship experience helped my brewing out a bunch. Just being able to relate and compare systems/scale makes ya think about things differently.

 

[FL_Brewer]

We have a bunch of 'safe' breweries around my area too, the exception being ommegang. Pretty exceptional beer, even thought I'm not a huge fan of belgian beers.

 

[FL_Brewer]

You brew there?
~ around here the breweries are afraid to be bold. They think safe = higher sales/customer loyalty, which its just the opposite. Customers are either unimpressed or they get bored. The place i was at actually told me, 'we don't brew stouts, they don't sell'. I laughed, what a joke.

 

[ChillWill]

Ah, I see you're from the finger lakes. I lived fairly close by in Rochester for a year (2007-2008) on an internship at a craft ale bar so am familiar with Ommegang, I really like their abbey ale (which I'll be making something similar to for my next batch) even though I'm not too big on Belgian beer either, although I guess making it for myself may give me a better appreciation!

I've brewed there a couple of times, although depends what you class as 'brewing'. I've done the mash in, sparge and hops additions under supervision. I usually end up doing stuff like weighing and breaking up the hops, filling the grist shoot for the next day, helping fill casks, cleaning the mash tun etc. Last week I got to skim yeast from the fermenter which was interesting... apparently they've been using the same yeast for 20 years, acid washing after every 10 uses. Puts into perspective how many people on here are concerned with pitching rates etc, where they just skim it off, weigh it and if it looks about right they'll just chuck it in the next batch with a some nutrient and have perfect fermentation everytime. They do try and make sure yeast from fermenter A is only used in that fermenter though for example, and not use yeast that has fermented a stout in a pale ale though.


The craft beer scene is still in infant stage in the UK, probably akin to the 90's for the states. The brewery I've been working at is fairly simple but they do a decent range from pale ales to bitters, stouts, porters & red ales amongst seasonal beers but rarely move from the 3.5%-5.5% range. That's ok though as they do them well and are well regarded locally. They're actually opening up another brewery not far away to help cope with demand and maybe start doing some more abstract beers (as it'll be in the grounds of a country estate where there is also a school for artisan food & drink operating). Hopefully when that happens they'll have a full time job for me!

 

[FL_Brewer]

I hate to use the cliché term 'it's a small world', but it definitely fits. I know the bar you were at, OT on Alexander? Heck, there's a chance we've crossed paths. I was probably in there a half dozen times in 2007-2008, although I can't say I really know anyone there. You know the brewery I was at, it is the one that produced the cask ales for the OT.

We've shared similar duties at our respective breweries. It was great just to become acquainted with the larger equipment.

I enjoy Ommegang's Rare Vos, Chocolate Indulgence, and they came out with a Belgian Scottish Ale that was damn good if you can get your hands on it. Cheers!

 

[ChillWill]

Yeah it was the OT. We got casks from a few places. Hmm, was it Roosterfish? Iirc, they only made them for us. Chocolate indulgence was good! I used it in a beer and dessert pairing I ran. Had to be served fairly warm to avoid a metallic taste that was present below 60f. I brought a bottle of 3 philosophers back to the UK with me.

We also got casks from custom brewcraft, rohrbachs, flying bison, a brewery in Syracuse (middle-ages or something like that). We even managed to score two casks of allagash curieux at one point, we stored one for 6 months and it aged really well.

Or was it ithaca you worked at? I think they were from the finger lakes weren't they?

 

[FL_Brewer]

I didn't realize all those places did casks, it was CB. When i was there the good people from OT, brought down pumpkin and other ingredients for a pumpkin ale, never got a chance to try it though.

 

[ChillWill]

Ah, CB's. Did Robyn Kraft work there when you were there? (well, she worked as a representative, we used to hang out together in the summer).

CB's were ok, but hardly exceptional and not up to the standards of some of the other breweries in the area. Recently though a brewer who used to work at Rohrbachs brewed a beer for the OT's 20th anniversary (an IPA) and someone sent a bottle over here and I reckon it was amongst the best IPA's I've ever tried. From what I've heard it was an amarillo / citra blend around 8% which I've based a batch on a few weeks ago, although added some Simcoe and only aimed for 6%

 

[FL_Brewer]

Sorry, i missed that you posted. I'm at a bar in buffalo with a regular of the ot you may know. Do you remember the dan the guitar guy?

 

[ChillWill]

Can't say I do. Met so many people over the year and I struggle to remember names.

edit: what's his surname?

 

[FL_Brewer]

Btw i racked my esb to the secondary on friday. The uncarbonated beer had some really nice flavors.
Not sure on dan's last name, but he's a friend of a friend so I'll ask.
Can't say i recall a robyn. The main people i know from cb, were bruce (from rhorbach's), and justin who ended up taking a job at victory. Both of whom are amazing brewers.

 

[FL_Brewer]

Welch is his last name.

 

[ChillWill]

Bruce does some really good stuff. I spoke to him recently for a bit of advice on the saison I made in February (which is nearly ready). I believe the OT20th anniversary IPA is his recipe and it's really good.

 

[ChillWill]

Can't say I recognise Dan but tracked him down on Facebook and he knows a few people I do. I've got around a week until my 2nd batch (with modifications) is ready.

 

[FL_Brewer]

Nice... Back to the waiting game

 

[ChillWill]

Just tried a bottle today (wanted to asses how 2.8vol CO2 was roughly before bottling an IPA).

Has come out nicely! The hop aroma and flavour has come out really well, similar to London pride sort of strength; good balance of flavour and drinkability. As it's a bit green the bitterness is still a bit high but I assume that'll mellow. Overall I'm pleased with it.

Will see how it is in a couple of weeks (after it's final week room temp conditioning and a week in the cellar). Then if needs be I'll make alterations to the bitterness, I'm thinking 30IBU may be a bit better for the low FG. Also wondering if a bit of Biscuit malt would help the malt profile, I'm hesitant to add anymore crystal as I think it's sweetness is about right with this batch. Maybe the current malt profile would be ok with lower IBU's. I'll report back when it's properly conditioned.

Oh, and 2.8vol looks about right for my IPA but I think it's a bit too much for this beer, maybe 2.4vol would be about right.

 

[ChillWill]

Bit of an update:

The 2nd version is too bitter and too dry. Also, despite the addition of wheat, head retention is poor, maybe this is something to do with much lower FG?

Also, I'm not too keen on the hop flavour, too much of an earthy, grassy flavour to it.

So for future:
-Slight tweak to malt base for extra body / flavour
-Higher mash temp (148 made it far too dry, maybe 152-154 would be better)
-Lower the IBU to 30
-Less carbonation
-Change the hops? I still want 1x UK and 1x US variety. Or maybe just change the way I use the goldings:chinook combo. Maybe less 10min & 2min additions and cut the dry hop to remove the earthy/grassy notes I've got from overdoing it. Saying that, my goldings were a bit on the old side so maybe that has something to do with it. Maybe try and more fruity hop than the chinook to go with the S-04? Maybe, maybe, maybe!!!

 

[FL_Brewer]

Based on the details you've posted, you're assessment sounds spot on. Bumping up the mash temp to mid-150's would produce a maltier sweetness. Also, the higher carbonation might account for the dry astringent flavor. Maybe swap out the wheat malt for flaked barley. I've had good luck using flaked barley for better head retention, at least in my darker ales. Other than that, I don't think you really have to change too much with the recipe.

Just an update on my beer...
Bottled last Friday @ 2.0 vols of CO2. Stored a room temp for the next couple weeks. Then I'll move them into a ~55*F cellar for permanent storage. 5 days prior to bottling I moved the carboy out to the barn to cold crash at ~45*F. In the last two days I added the isinglass.

The unfermented beer tasted quite good. Slightly hopier v. maltier, with a subtle floral/citrus aroma. Brilliant copper/amber/orange color, I was real happy about that. However, despite the cold crash and isinglass it was still a little cloudy. Hopefully that clears in the bottle, its not the end of the world if it doesn't.

I made an English Mild 2 1/2 weeks ago and bottled it the same day as the ESB, haha it was a lot of bottling. When I get a chance I'll share the recipe, I think it's going to be a winner. Only 1.036 SG, 1.010 FG. With the lower calories, lower alcohol I'm thinking it will be a nice summer brown beer. Or at least my idea of a good summer beer. haha

 

[FL_Brewer]

My preference would be for less late hoping and probably no dry hops, but that's completely your preference and whatever you like.

This maybe a dumb question but can you get Wyeast or White labs liquid yeast in the UK? If so give the Thames Valley Ale Yeast a try, I've been real happy with the outcome so far.

Enjoy the wedding Friday! Cheers my friend, have a beer for me!