Quick Tunraround Beers?

[rodwha]

I had tried two smaller batches to see if I could produce good beer ready to drink in 31 days for those times when you find out a gathering shall happen and you'd like variety and/or mass appeal beers.

For these I've figured keep the ABV around 5% and keep it as simple as possible. I cut back on my typical 3/3/1 week regimen to 14/14/3 day.

I had made a basic blonde which was good, and a honey wheat that had a bite to it at first.

I've worked up 3 recipes I'd like to use and would like opinions on whether they'd likely be ready by the 4th of July assuming I get my ingredients and can begin by the 23rd of May.

These are all 5.25 gal batches:

Texas Mild
5 lbs Ashburne Mild
1.375 lbs wheat
1 lb brown sugar (FO)
.5 lb crystal 90
.25 lb chocolate
.25 light DME
.75 oz Willamette (4.5%) @ 70/21 mins
.5 oz Willamette @ 7 mins
US-05

1.045/1.009
4.8%
23 IBUs
16 SRM

I would bottle this on the 8th.

Honey Wheat
I'll attempt this again. Brew on the 25th and bottle on the 10th.
2.5 lbs pale ale
2.25 lbs wheat
2 lbs honey (FO)
0.5 lb honey malt
.25 lb light DME
1 oz Willamette (4.5%) @ 70 mins
US-05

1.048/1.009
5.1%
20 IBUs
5 SRM

Cream Ale
Brew on the 1st and bottle on the 15th.
5.5 lbs pale ale
2 lbs flaked rice
.25 lb light DME
.75 oz Liberty (4%) @ 70/21 mins
.5 oz Libert @ 7 mins
US-05

1.045/1.009
4.8%
20 IBUs
4 SRM

Anything questionable? I figured the Texas version of a British Mild was the most complex and ought be be the first brewed to give it the most time.

Which has a greater impact bulk fermentation or conditioning? If I have 5 weeks for these which should I give the extra time to?

I may end up dropping one so as to give more time to the second brew as Mondays are my scheduled beer days, and to make this work I'd have to make SWMBO mad by taking up some Wednesdays and Fridays. I'm willing to take a bit of scolding though...

 

[douglasbarbin]

I'd hardly call 31 days "quick turnaround". Fastest I've ever done is 9 days grain-to-glass, on a split batch (half APA, half IPA). The only difference between batches was the yeast strain (Cal Ale for the IPA and San Diego Super Yeast for the APA) and the hopping (I did a whirlpool for the IPA and a larger dry hop). The APA turned out pretty well (won a silver medal) and the IPA was a terrible diacetyl bomb that I ended up dumping.

All of that to say, yeast strain is important, but 31 days should be plenty for any ale yeast. If you had a shorter time frame, I would look at something other than US-05. I have had diacetyl issues with that yeast as well when I didn't give it time to clean up. But as it stands, I think you will be fine.

To answer your other questions, I assume that you mean "bulk fermentation" to include all time spent in the fermenter, which includes letting the yeast clean up. And I assume "conditioning" is after you have removed it from the (primary) fermenter. Is that accurate? If so, fermentation will have a much greater impact. Leave the beer on the yeast until it is ready for packaging.


EDIT: The IPA I mentioned above also had some cane sugar added to it that the APA didn't have.

 

[rodwha]

Quick in that it's quicker than the typical 3 weeks for fermentation and conditioning, which is what I typical do unless it's a dark complex beer or higher ABV (>7%).

I did, indeed, mean it how you understood it.

To keep the grains all American I'll be swapping the pale chocolate for Briess chocolate and reducing it to 1/4 lb and increasing the wheat by 2 oz to keep the numbers the same, which I'll be editing to reflect.

 

[zippybasher]

just curious, what does .25lb light DME bring to the table here? Its probably negligible flavor wise and gravity wise....

 

[rodwha]

Yeast starters. I prefer to add my yeast while they're active. I've been placing them in my fermentation chamber to keep them at a reasonable temp, though I never noticed anything off when left at room temp.

 

[andrewmaixner]

Berliner weiss, 3.5%:
raw grain starter: 2 days.
BIAB mash, kettle sour: 2-3 days
boil, chill, pitch 2 packets US-05: 4-8 days
(optional dry-hop for yummy complexity: 4 days)
Chill and force-carb: 2 days

That's really only 2-3 weeks total turnaround including a starter and dry hop, for an awesome summer beer. Honestly, I bet most 3% beers could be made in this timeframe.

 

[rodwha]

I don't care for ultralight beers and so begin them around 4.7%, though I bottle condition which adds 0.1-0.3% all depending.

And since I don't keg the bottle conditioning takes more time.

 

[Yooper]

Most under 5% beers can spend 10 days in the fermenter, and then be bottled. You should have no problem having a sample at day 20, but be serving them at day 30.

I'd try to use an attenuative ale yeast that clears the beer better, and quicker. Like Wyeast 1335 or wyeast 1272,

But my newest favorite for producing American style ales that are clear quickly is also an old favorite that I had forgotten about- Wyeast 1332. Ferment it on the cool side (65 degrees) to avoid too much fruitiness, and you'll be ready to bottle in 10 days for sure. It's not as attenuative as some other American strains (plan on 70% usually), so mash lower if needed if you want a dry finish.

 

[rodwha]

I've been meaning to try out some liquid strains again. I had been using 001 and 1272 but tossed them once they had been well used and we were moving. At that time I went to US-05 which I actually prefer over 001 and decided to wash the yeast and keep.

I'm not too concerned with clarity.

 

[Yooper]

I've been meaning to try out some liquid strains again. I had been using 001 and 1272 but tossed them once they had been well used and we were moving. At that time I went to US-05 which I actually prefer over 001 and decided to wash the yeast and keep.

I'm not too concerned with clarity.

If you don't care about yeast in suspension, then s05 is ok for sure. I almost never use it (Hate the yeast that stays in suspension forever), but if you are serving to others, they may not love the cloudy sludgy beer when it's young. That's why I suggested other strains that drop out better, and don't have unpleasant esters at times. In bottling a young beer, S05 may leave a LOT of crud in the bottle, if it drops out before serving. If it doesn't drop out, it may look like a milkshake. Either way, people may not appreciate the beer with all of the yeast haze. If you cold crash before bottling, that may help.

 

[Natdavis777]

I think lighter beers can be turned around very quickly. Fermentation doesnt take weeks. After you have reached 80% ramp the temp up and the beer will finish within a day or so. Dry hop if you like, or if not, let the beer set there for a few days before crashing. Fine if you like then package. In beers that I dont dry hop, grain to glass is easily feasible within 2 weeks. Im sipping on a 14 day old Cream ale as we speak. Other brews I use a lot of 002 or 007 and those beers ferment within 72 hours usually and clear up like a champ.

 

[rodwha]

I'm a bit curious why the 3/3/3 rule seems to be the norm for most normal ABV beers if many don't need even half the time?

I'm not too concerned with the two lighter beers but wasn't too certain about the mild as it contains a couple of additional ingredients and is darker. My dark beers often need a fourth week of conditioning.

 

[masonsjax]

10 days grain to glass kettle soured Berliner Weiss. Full mash, 120F raw grain pitch, plastic wrap, blanket covered sealed in the cooler, quick boil, US-05 pitch, crash cool/keg carb/serve done and done.

 

[MaryB]

I made a batch of Innkeeper Ale 2 weeks ago, bottled it yesterday. OG was 1.044 FG was 1.007 in 2 weeks. Smelled and tasted good and now bottle conditioning. Will taste test next week to see how it is doing. I used Danstar Nottingham Ale yeast for it.

It is a Northern Brewer kit but the recipe is online(extract, would have to convert for grain which I am planning on doing f it tastes as good in 2 weeks as it did last night).

 

[aprichman]

Make a 2L starter of a highly flocculant British strain and you should be ready to bottle or keg any of those in under a week.

 

[FatDragon]

I just drank a 7% IPA that was 25 days old last night and it was delicious. 18 days in the primary (counting dry hop) and a week in bottles. I probably could have dry hopped at 7 days and bottled at 10, then popped the first bottle at the two week mark since they carb up nicely once the weather turns warm. You'll have a hard time achieving the 7-10 day turnaround that can be achieved with the right beer by someone who kegs, but with the right recipe that isn't too strong and doesn't need a lot of conditioning time, a good pitch with the right yeast, and good fermentation and bottle conditioning temperature strategies, less than two weeks is a very reachable target for grain to glass with bottled homebrew.

 

[GQT]

I just drank a 7% IPA that was 25 days old last night and it was delicious

Hey it all sounds so good, I wonder how long I can continue being shy and not asking you to mail me a plastic bottle of some of your IPA (or a heavily Chinese-spiced one)!

 

[FatDragon]

Hey it all sounds so good, I wonder how long I can continue being shy and not asking you to mail me a plastic bottle of some of your IPA (or a heavily Chinese-spiced one)!

They're usually only mediocre. I'm not as super-aggressive about hopping as some folks here are because I don't want to dump >￥200 on half a kilo of hops for a single 20L batch. However, I finally got some Citra again so this batch is super juicy - after over a year messing with various hops I'd never tried I had forgotten how much more flavor and aroma per weight you get from Citra versus most other hops. Seriously, though, shoot me your address and I can shoot some beer your way for much needed peer review. I share a lot of beer but getting useful feedback here is damn near impossible.

 

[GQT]

shoot me your address

Such offers should be dealt with before they expire! PM sent.
BTW I am all on local hops. "Cascade" (commas added on purpose), "Saaz", "Magnum" and "Nugget" - all from Xinjiang. Errr... well, they are still hops, OK.
I mean, well, errrr... it's better than "to dump >￥200 on half a kilo of hops for a single 20L batch"...

 

[h22lude]

What are these rules you are talking about? You mentioned 3/3/1 and 14/14/3 then 3/3/3. Is that weeks in primary/weeks in secondary/weeks in bottle? Never seen this before. I always ferment for 2 weeks or less then keg, carb and condition for 2 weeks. Only time I will stray from that is with really high og beers or adding something to primary like dry hops or fruit. If you pitch the right amount of yeast at the right temp and have a good temp control you can do most beers in 10 days. Bottling is hard to rush but if you keg you can carb within a few days if you push 30psi for 12 to 18 hours then go down to serving psi for a few days.

 

[Yooper]

I'm a bit curious why the 3/3/3 rule seems to be the norm for most normal ABV beers if many don't need even half the time?

I'm not too concerned with the two lighter beers but wasn't too certain about the mild as it contains a couple of additional ingredients and is darker. My dark beers often need a fourth week of conditioning.

I don't know of a "rule" like that, but 3 weeks in the bottle is pretty reasonable because it may take bigger ABV beers longer to carbonate. I've never waited three weeks myself before opening one or two or five, but it seems like a reasonable thing.

3 weeks in primary is about 11 days longer than I go normally. I usually leave my beers 10 days or so in the fermenter before packaging.

 

[rodwha]

The 3/3/3 rule is what I saw all too often here on HBT years ago when I began. There were exceptions that I noticed with simple lower ABV beers (and kegging), as well as more complex and higher ABV beers.

My quote from Revvy in my signature reflects this as well.

 

[mattdee1]

For pale and 5ish% ABV beers, I'm with Yooper--10 days in primary is more than adequate.

After 8-10 days, bottle that beer up, and store it somewhere that does not get too cold (i.e., avoid places like cellars or chilly winter basements with cold air and floors). If you stick around 70F, you can be carbed up in a week.

7-10 days after that, if you want a sample, chill a few in the fridge overnight and have at it. There is a chance the beer will still be showing its youth at this point, but there is just as good a chance that it will be very close to as good as it will ever get. Beers of this type are often inherently rather "non-complex" in nature, and they are what they are.

Put another way, if a 4.7% / 22 IBU blonde ale fermented with a standard American ale yeast (for example) has developed adequate carbonation and tastes good at 10 days, then it's not magically going to transform into an otherworldly marvel after several weeks.

 

[rodwha]

Indeed, which my simple blonde showed with 2 weeks for both fermentation and conditioning.

My honey wheat, also lower ABV, didn't do as well with the same regimen and had a bite to it that faded after a bit. I'm making another and hoping that it works out in time. Maybe something else was going on.

I was more concerned with this version of a mild since it's not quite as simple and uses some dark grains. I haven't (yet) tried more test batches slowly moving up the scale.

I have another beer to make (ale version of a schwarzbier) that I opted out of brewing for this trip since it uses more roasty grains. I would have liked to have taken it too to see what input I get. But I figured that one would potentially have the least chance of being ready in time.

 

[rodwha]

I took this "rule" to be you can't go wrong. Not so much that it was necessary to make a good beer. Maybe not so much at first...

 

[chickypad]

The 3/3/3 rule is what I saw all too often here on HBT years ago when I began. There were exceptions that I noticed with simple lower ABV beers (and kegging), as well as more complex and higher ABV beers.

I think you're talking about the 1-2-3 rule that used to be very popular, and that many kits still have in their instructions? I've never seen the 3/3/3.

 

[Yooper]

I took this "rule" to be you can't go wrong. Not so much that it was necessary to make a good beer. Maybe not so much at first...

But in 9 weeks, beers that are better fresh will already be past their peak in quite a few cases. So that "rule" definitely can steer you wrong.

I check dates when I buy beer in the store, and if the beer is outdated it may still be pretty good but in many cases it will be past its prime. IPAs and pale ales will be some of the first beers to lose flavor and aroma and change, but other beers (especially homebrew) that have a bit of oxidation will stale fairly quickly or lose flavor.

Some beers age well, or even require some aging, and those are not the ones I'm talking about here. I'm talking about beers like IPAs, pale ales, cream ales, milds, English bitters, nut brown, etc.

 

[rodwha]

I think you're talking about the 1-2-3 rule that used to be very popular, and that many kits still have in their instructions? I've never seen the 3/3/3.

I actually saw the typical kit time frames rebuked.

I tried to look back through my earliest posts but it doesn't go back further than 2014 for some reason when I was getting into mashing. Oh well....

Since we are talking about time frames at what point is it generally figured 3/3/3 is necessary?

 

[Yooper]

Since we are talking about time frames at what point is it generally figured 3/3/3 is necessary?

Never, in my opinion.

 

[chickypad]

I actually saw the typical kit time frames rebuked.

Yes I know, but 1-2-3 used to a pretty commonly quoted "rule". No one seems to know where you got the 3/3/3, and none of us are advocating that.