Question about fermentation temp for Oktoberfest yeast

[RugerRedhawk]

I bought the AHS Anniversary Oktoberfest kit (http://www.austinhomebrew.com/product_info.php?products_id=12912). The yeast it came with was: WLP820 Oktoberfest/Märzen Lager Yeast (http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/strains_wlp820.html)

The yeast vial said to keep it above 70 until fementation starts. It took over 24 hours to start where i had the bucket at about 71 degrees. Now what temp should I put the bucket at if not lagering? Should I move it as cool as I can get it (around 67-68 probably)? They say it will work fine at 'room temp', but would like to know what would be best in my situation. To either leave it at 71, or try to cool it a few degrees. It's bubbling regularly.

 

[boo boo]

Get it down to a stable temp of about 50f and when you get time check out this reference http://www.howtobrew.com/

 

[ThePearsonFam]

Get it as close as you can to ideal temps... 52-58 according to WL. Stable is also VERY important. Can you cool it by keeping it in a bath of water with a wicking towel/fan blowing on it?

 

[ThePearsonFam]

Sounds like a good excuse to get a temp controlled fridge to me

 

[RugerRedhawk]

AHB assured me at the time of order that it will be fine at room temp as I am in no way capable to get it anywhere near the lagering temps. I was just wondering if 68 would be better than the 71 that was needed to get it going, or if I should just not touch it.

 

[boo boo]

A better yeast then would have been to your advantage. Using ale yeast in place of lager yeast at room temps will give you a better brew than lager yeast at room temps.

 

[ThePearsonFam]

simple answer... yup. I was asking if you are able to employ some low-cost options to drop the temp even a bit further (wicking water with a towel draped over the fermenter with a fan blowing on it --or-- maybe a tub of water with some ice poured in on occasion).

 

[RugerRedhawk]

A better yeast then would have been to your advantage. Using ale yeast in place of lager yeast at room temps will give you a better brew than lager yeast at room temps.

Yeah maybe. I am a newb and ordered the kit with the suggested yeast. Had no idea about the temps required until I googled the yeast name. I called AHB and asked if I should change yeast, and the guy I talked to said no, it will be fine. I'll move it to the coldest spot in the basement, but I fear I'd have trouble keeping it much cooler than room temp constantly.

 

[RugerRedhawk]

simple answer... yup. I was asking if you are able to employ some low-cost options to drop the temp even a bit further (wicking water with a towel draped over the fermenter with a fan blowing on it --or-- maybe a tub of water with some ice poured in on occasion).

Thanks, those are helpful ideas

 

[C-Rider]

Yeah maybe. I am a newb and ordered the kit with the suggested yeast. Had no idea about the temps required until I googled the yeast name. I called AHB and asked if I should change yeast, and the guy I talked to said no, it will be fine. I'll move it to the coldest spot in the basement, but I fear I'd have trouble keeping it much cooler than room temp constantly.

Put your primary in a large plastic "tub" w/a few 1/2 jugs of ice, change often, cover w/towel. I'm doing that outside in Hawaii and can hold it down to about 55 w/1 gal after a while using more ice.

 

[RugerRedhawk]

Put your primary in a large plastic "tub" w/a few 1/2 jugs of ice, change often, cover w/towel. I'm doing that outside in Hawaii and can hold it down to about 55 w/1 gal after a while using more ice.

How do you monitor the temp? a stick on thermometer? It's already been fermenting for over 32 hous at 71.

 

[C-Rider]

How do you monitor the temp? a stick on thermometer? It's already been fermenting for over 32 hous at 71.

I have one of those garden thermometers in the tub and the receiver in the house.


The one on the left is in the tub w/my fermenter.
The on on the right is in a refer set as warm as I goes to condition my Cooper's Wheat Beer.

 

[RugerRedhawk]

Ok, actually I found the far corner of my basement is about 60 degrees now, so I moved it there and set it on the concrete floor. What will happen to the rate of fermentation at this point? Right now it's about one per second or a little faster.

 

[RugerRedhawk]

I'm a bit wary of this process as this is my first brew on my own. I feel like I'm mixing instructions as there are two sets that came with the kit. One for lagering, and one for room temp. With what I'm doing now I'm not really doing either. The lagering instructions say after 10 days move to a secondary and cool it to 40 degrees for a month. The warm temp process says to move to secondary for 5-7 days than bottle. Do I do harm fermenting at 60 then secondary at 60 for a week or two?

 

[RugerRedhawk]

Just so I'm clear, is the fermentation going to slow down now? I wasn't expecting this type of brew process for my first so I'm being a bit paranoid I think.

 

[statseeker]

You wont do harm to the beer you just might have some temporary flavor issues which will work their way out with age. Hell, you may like the warm fermented beer better anyway. So do it how you are able to do it, it wont hurt.

Firstly, dont measure fermentation activity by the air lock. It wont tell you much of anything about the process going on in the fermenter. Only gravity readings will give you a for-sure sign that fermentation is still happening. Second off, I would do the cool aging if you can do it like the guys on here do it using the bucket of water and the ice packs.

Oktoberfests take a while to condition. I use the word condition because most of the fermentation process is done in the first couple of weeks. The next part of the process is basically lagering. Aging/conditioning the beer at low temperatures. That will give you the best results according to the Oktoberfest brewing tradition.

 

[RugerRedhawk]

You wont do harm to the beer you just might have some temporary flavor issues which will work their way out with age. Hell, you may like the warm fermented beer better anyway. So do it how you are able to do it, it wont hurt.

Firstly, dont measure fermentation activity by the air lock. It wont tell you much of anything about the process going on in the fermenter. Only gravity readings will give you a for-sure sign that fermentation is still happening. Second off, I would do the cool aging if you can do it like the guys on here do it using the bucket of water and the ice packs.

Oktoberfests take a while to condition. I use the word condition because most of the fermentation process is done in the first couple of weeks. The next part of the process is basically lagering. Aging/conditioning the beer at low temperatures. That will give you the best results according to the Oktoberfest brewing tradition.

Thanks. I think it will work out fine. I doubt I'll be doing any lagering on this kit. I realize that would be best, but I don't really want to tie my only secondary up for that long. I also have some concerns about how well I'd be able to carbonate a lagered beer on my first homebrew batch.

 

[fxdude]

You can always try the water bucket with ice thing like others have mentioned. Take water jugs or plastic soda bottles filled with water and freeze them, throw a couple in the water and leave a few in the freezer, then you can rotate them out every day. For an Octoberfest you'd have to do that for quite a while though so you may just want to let it sit as is.

You can cold condition in the bottle if you'd like. It won't be true lagering but it would be better than just letting it sit at room temp for months. Just bottle as instructed and let the bottles sit out for a couple of weeks at room temp or high 60s low 70s. Crack one open and see if the carb level is close to what you want, if it's low leave it for another week, if it's good then go ahead and put your bottles in the fridge and leave them there for a few months. Even if you can only get 1/2 or 1/4 of the bottles in the fridge for a few months.

Octoberfests are more of an advanced beer and take quite a bit of conditioning/aging, they definitely shouldn't have recommended that as your first beer but oh well, you're stuck with it now. I would recommend brewing an easy ale as soon as your primary frees up so you can forget about the octoberfest for at least a few months, even do a second ale after that just to keep your mind off that octoberfest while it cold conditions.

I'm working on my first lager and it's been a total of three months now since I brewed it but I've probably brewed and drank three ales since then, it's been pretty easy to keep my mind off of it.

Since it's your first beer don't be afraid to crack one open every week or so to see how it tastes, if it gets to a point where it's good and you don't want to wait any longer just start sharing and drinking. That's the beauty of the this hobby, the beer usually gets better with age but if tastes good right now it's up to you if you want it to taste better or enjoy as is.

Good Luck

 

[Homercidal]

Outside of the actual chilling method, for lager I recommend starting at the temp you are going to ferment at. you can start high and then drop, but then you will have to perform a Diacetal rest before the lagering stage. If you start low, then the D-rest is supposedly not needed. You should really build a large starter to help it get going. Starting low might cause a bit of a lag, but it should not be a problem.

The yeast I used called for a 50F ferment for 4 weeks, then a 35ish lager for 4+ weeks.

I pitched an Oktoberfest yeast and it worked fine after a slow start, but I underpitched and I am pretty sure I can taste it in the beer. Lagers can really show that kind of mistake.

 

[RugerRedhawk]

If you let it lager for a month at say 40 degrees, would there still be yeast alive come bottling day though? I have a spare fridge, could probably buy an extra carboy and try it, but afraid they wouldn't carbonate well after a month of cold temps. I will plan on long bottle conditioning in the extra fridge for sure if nothing else. Thanks.

 

[Homercidal]

The yeast will likely be alive. I hear that they can be slim in population, but there is usually enough to carb a beer. However you could grab a few off the bottom when transferring to bottling bucket by sucking up just a bit.

I have a kegging system, so I don't have first hand experience with this.

 

[RugerRedhawk]

The yeast will likely be alive. I hear that they can be slim in population, but there is usually enough to carb a beer. However you could grab a few off the bottom when transferring to bottling bucket by sucking up just a bit.

I have a kegging system, so I don't have first hand experience with this.

ok, i'll have to visit this when the time comes. Hardly seems worth the risk to me since I don't have kegging as an option at this point and know nothing about lagering beyond this post.