Proper scaling of recipes

[myerstyson]

OK, my two recent OG misses has taught me that I need to scale these recipe kits to match my preferred technique.

First a bit of background:

Just finished batch #5 (Maibock) and missed the OG by about 10 points. Before that was a doppelbock that missed a bit, too. Before all that, batch #1, my Holiday Ale, I brewed to the recipe but lost almost an entire gallon to trub and my crappy bottling technique (since corrected). So I decided to take care of this by boiling full wort and putting 6 gallons into the fermenter instead of 5 (or 5.2 as some recipes call for).

Well, noob that I am, I didn't realize the effect an extra gallon of water on the wort OG would be. I want to hit the proper OG so I think I need to scale up my recipes, yes?

So here's the questions:

a) Can I simply multiply the DME by 1.2 to add the extra 20% (if I even did that math correct) to make up for the extra gallon?
b) Do I have to scale up the steeping grain as well?
c) Hops? Do I have to add 20% more hops?
d) Is there some program that'll do this for me? (I have a chromebook, so can't use brewsmith. I do have a BrewToad acct, but haven't looked too closely to it.)

Here's some caveats before you answer:

a) I do NOT have the capability to do AG right now;
b) My brew kettle is 8 gallon and I've boiled, with DME in it, 6.5 gallons safely so far;
c) all my recipe kits are DME-only as I have shipping restrictions where I am currently stationed.

I think that's it. Thanks in advance folks.

 

[C-Rider]

To my understanding is you are doing extract kits be it dry or liquid the only way to miss your OG is to add to mu ch water OR not really mixing the top off water. Now is seems if you are doing a full boil w/that 8 gallon pot if you get your fermenter size down to say 5.5 gallons you should be right on. Don't know how you can miss OG when using extract.

 

[myerstyson]

To my understanding is you are doing extract kits be it dry or liquid the only way to miss your OG is to add to mu ch water OR not really mixing the top off water. Now is seems if you are doing a full boil w/that 8 gallon pot if you get your fermenter size down to say 5.5 gallons you should be right on. Don't know how you can miss OG when using extract.

Hmm...now I'm more confused.

 

[McKnuckle]

BrewersFriend.com (website, not installed software - should help you out a lot)

 

[RM-MN]

a) I do NOT have the capability to do AG right now;

You do if you want to. If you have a LHBS that will mill your grains or are willing to order from a store that will mill them for you all you need to add to what you have is a paint strainer bag. Search for BIAB and you'll have thousands of ideas of how to make it work, and most of them will be right.

 

[black_belt]

Simple answer: if you want 20% more in the fermentor, you need to increase all ingredients by 20%. Steeping grain, hops etc.
When bottling, scale the priming sugar for the actual volume you will be bottling, or you may overdo it.

 

[NTexBrewer]

I use Brewer's Friend and like the program. I usually brew 2 gallons batches so I usually put in the 5 gallon recipe and use the scale feature.

You can sign up for a trial membership with Brewer's Friend which will allow you to play with it some to see if you like it.

As others have said to go from a 5 gallon to a 6 gallon batch the simple answer is to multiply by 1.2

If you are using brewing software you can make sure that your hop scaling is correct and account for hops that are a different AA than what the recipe calls for. Or if you have limited access to brewing supplies you may be substituting hops often.

 

[madscientist451]

Stop using kits and extract; with your 8 gallon pot an BIAB bag you can switch to all grain for less than $10. Or even better, spend an extra $20 at walmart and get a 5 gallon round cooler and put the BIAB bag in that.
You'll recover your investment in just a few brews compared to kits maybe 3-4 brews with extract.
Your batch size and actual yield of beer depends on the equipment you have and your process. Different stoves and pot geometry give many different evaporation rates, so you'll have to try different things until you find what works for you.
I also brew indoors and have settled on 4 to 4.5 gallon to the fermenter the realistic amount I can make, but my brewpot is smaller than yours.
Measure your initial gravity and if you start mashing the starting and ending gravity of your runnings. Pull a sample of hot wort w/5 min left in the boil and chill in an ice bath, check to see if your gravity is where its supposed to be. If its low, you can continue the boil if its high you can add water.

 

[peterj]

As others have said: http://www.brewersfriend.com/. They have tons of calculators and they have a feature on the recipe creator that will scale everything for you. If you're going from 5 to 6 gallons then you do need to increase everything proportionally. DME, all specialty grains, hops, etc. Brewer's Friend will do that for you if you put the recipe in.

BIAB is pretty easy and cheap to get into, but you can also make great beers using extract. This past weekend I actually did an extract brew on Saturday and an all grain brew on Sunday.

 

[myerstyson]

You do if you want to. If you have a LHBS that will mill your grains or are willing to order from a store that will mill them for you all you need to add to what you have is a paint strainer bag. Search for BIAB and you'll have thousands of ideas of how to make it work, and most of them will be right.

I live in Kyrgyzstan. Not only is there no LHBS here, the few beers that are available are sh!t. Thus I homebrew.

The only stove I have is an electrical glass top. I have enough trouble keeping the water at temp for steeping. I'm not going to attempt BIAB without gas. And no, I can't ship burners here and I don't want to try and find the equivalent of a gas burner here.

I have shipping size restrictions so no I can't get an igloo HLT or mash tun or whatever.

I appreciate AG and I intend on trying AG (and kegs) when I return to the U.S. I appreciate all of you AG-ers, and your inputs, I really do, but I put the caveat above to try and prevent any of the proselytizing I've seen in HBT wrt AG vs. Extract.

I'm happy with my extract batches now. I just needed help figuring out how to scale my recipes, so thanks to you all who advised Brewers Friend, which I'm going to go check out now.

 

[Yooper]

While brewing software is helpful, and I use Brewer's Friend and Beersmith and love them- your initial queries are correct- simply scale up the recipe and ingredients by 20% if you want to make a 20% larger batch. Grains, extract and hops- all scale just fine.

One of the things that drives me crazy is when people tell others to "go all grain". Extract brewing is fine, as you know, and it can make great beer.

It'd be like me complaining on a car forum about the brakes on my truck, and the answer being "Well, get a new truck!" Sometimes the answer is simply working with what you have.

Anyway, you've got the basics of it down.

 

[bernardsmith]

So the question still stands, though: if you are using extract how come you are not hitting your target gravity? Here's my thought - the recipes you are using probably call for US gallons. I am assuming - though I may be wrong that you are using gallons and not liters. But US gallons are smaller than Imperial gallons by about 1/5 and if you are using equipment that does not come from the US are you certain that your volumes are in fact the volumes associated with the recipes you have? In other words, if you pour 5 Imperial gallons of water in a kettle you will fill to the brim a 6 gallon kettle if the kettle uses US measurements -

 

[peterj]

So I decided to take care of this by boiling full wort and putting 6 gallons into the fermenter instead of 5 (or 5.2 as some recipes call for).

Well, noob that I am, I didn't realize the effect an extra gallon of water on the wort OG would be. I want to hit the proper OG so I think I need to scale up my recipes, yes?

So the question still stands, though: if you are using extract how come you are not hitting your target gravity? Here's my thought - the recipes you are using probably call for US gallons. I am assuming - though I may be wrong that you are using gallons and not liters. But US gallons are smaller than Imperial gallons by about 1/5 and if you are using equipment that does not come from the US are you certain that your volumes are in fact the volumes associated with the recipes you have? In other words, if you pour 5 Imperial gallons of water in a kettle you will fill to the brim a 6 gallon kettle if the kettle uses US measurements -

No, he wasn't hitting his gravities because he has been adding an extra gallon of water and he didn't realize he needed to adjust the recipe until now.

 

[myerstyson]

No, he wasn't hitting his gravities because he has been adding an extra gallon of water and he didn't realize he needed to adjust the recipe until now.

That's exactly it.

I've got U.S. equipment, not imperial.

And I've now played around with Brewers Friend AND I LOVE IT.

Thanks all!

 

[C-Rider]

Hmm...now I'm more confused.

Let me get this straight in my mind. You say you are using DME. Does this come from a "kit" you are buying? IF so as long as you get the volumes correct you should get the OG that the kit maker claims.

 

[myerstyson]

Let me get this straight in my mind. You say you are using DME. Does this come from a "kit" you are buying? IF so as long as you get the volumes correct you should get the OG that the kit maker claims.

Yes kits, but as I said at the very top, I had added a gallon of water, which I didn't know would affect my OG....because I'm a noob.

Now I know better.

 

[Moose_MI]

So you found Brewers friend and can scale with confidence now...

I'm just curious...you're adding the gallon to compensate for a bottling issue that you said you've since corrected...you're also compensating for trub loss. I don't know your system but losing a gallon to trub seems like a lot for your average DME kit. Was just wondering if avoiding the trub loss would let you avoid the effort of scaling up recipes to start with?

 

[myerstyson]

@Moose_MI, yes, I've since taken an unused racking cane, cut it to fit a #2 stopper, which I then put into my bottling spigot. The cane end points down.

I haven't used it for bottling yet, but I think it'll get that little bit that falls below the spigot but above the trub, thus minimizing my loss.

I've also gotten a lot better at bottling, thanks to (can't remember his/her name)'s sticky in the bottling forum about bottling day. Now, the little tupperware on the floor has hardly any beer drips in it. (My first couple of bottling days were embarrassing!)

So I may not have to scale, but a few of the recipes I did I loved, and I'd like to have more beer (my pale ale particularly) from the batch.

 

[C-Rider]

Yes kits, but as I said at the very top, I had added a gallon of water, which I didn't know would affect my OG....because I'm a noob.

Now I know better.

Ok, Think I said the first time that as long as you reach correct volumnes you reach the correct OG. Welcome to the party. Have a beer and relax. LOL What brings you to that part of the world? Got the impression you are not a native to the place.

 

[C-Rider]

@Moose_MI, yes, I've since taken an unused racking cane, cut it to fit a #2 stopper, which I then put into my bottling spigot. The cane end points down.

I haven't used it for bottling yet, but I think it'll get that little bit that falls below the spigot but above the trub, thus minimizing my loss.

I've also gotten a lot better at bottling, thanks to (can't remember his/her name)'s sticky in the bottling forum about bottling day. Now, the little tupperware on the floor has hardly any beer drips in it. (My first couple of bottling days were embarrassing!)

So I may not have to scale, but a few of the recipes I did I loved, and I'd like to have more beer (my pale ale particularly) from the batch.

I offer my 15 minute video on cleaning bottles, getting rid of lables and filling them w/home brew?

 

[pablosbrewing]

In most cases - don't fear the trub, you can leave less (or even none) behind in the kettle.