Pro contract brewing

[MikeRLynch]

Alright, my buddy and I have stumbled into something pretty big, and we're going to need some advice.

Over (several) pints of a local brewerys offerings, my friend arranged with the owner of the establishment to possibly do a contract brew on their system. At first I jumped for joy, then the reality set in that we would need an original and flawless recipe. My first instinct was to do an IPA, as they don't have one in their lineup, but I quickly realized it's because of the shortage that they don't have one, not because it won't sell. We would also have to use their house yeast, which as far as I can tell is a fairly neutral ale strain, possibly english.

The issue is this: we need to do a pilot batch to bring for approval before we even step foot in the brew house. Our beer needs to be simple to make, yet unique and drinkable (this is most likely going to be served in their pub). The offerings at this place already cover a fair amount of ground, they have a pale, blueberry ale, hefe, irish red, ordinary bitter, and occasionally an oktoberfest and a coffee beer.

We're not too fond of stouts or porters, and they don't sell very well anyway so the brewery wouldn't be too keen on making them. Check out Honest Town Brewery for details on the place.

Ideas? With the limitations of few hops, neutral ale yeast, and a simple grain bill, the options are few. Thoughts?

mike

 

[Fingers]

I don't see a brown ale on the list. The brown would go well with your British ale an low hop bill.

 

[MikeRLynch]

Agreed. Here's a rundown on a brown I did a little while ago which I liked:

You're a Good Man Charlie Brown Ale

What do you think?

mike

 

[vfinch]

I agree with Fingers, maybe a nice brown. Another option would be an American Wheat, but with a twist to set it farther apart from their Hefe (honey maybe?).

 

[FishinDave07]

Northern/Southern Brown ale would be good, especially if the house yeast is english. Maybe a Scottish 60/70/80 schilling. Belgian blonde's are tasty.

 

[portlandbeergeek]

My first thought was a Wit due to the low hop restraint. If you're stuck with the house yeast, maybe you could tweak it with vanilla and some 80L? I dunno....I'm still a newbie

 

[Ooompa Loompa]

I think a milk stout would be awesome on that lineup. I love milk stouts, and know a lot of other people who do as well, but I don't see them offered a lot at brewpubs.

 

[k1v1116]

I would also say some kind of brown ale or something from the wide range of belgian styles (although the yeast would kind of limit this). I dont know what type of customers this would be sold to, but when I make brown ales most people who try them complain of low carbonation, even when its carbed to the upper limit of the style.

 

[jay075j]

I would go with a Hazelnut Brown Ale for the fall months. Kind of earthy and nutty with a hazelnut finish. I have been making this for years during the fall and it's always a big hit with everyone. I'll post the recipe if your interested.

 

[ericd]

Do you have to use the house yeast? It sounds like you want a kolsch.

 

[McKBrew]

Kolsch, another excellent suggestion.

I think just having this opportunity would kick butt. Congrats.

 

[Skrimpy]

Hmmm. Contract brewing. I've actually been thinking a lot about this lately. Yours is obviously not "selling alcohol" but selling a brewing service to someone who is going to sell the beer, so you aren't the one that needs the liquor liscence. What if you were to "brew" for private parties to consume the beer, explicitly stating that you weren't "selling beer" but contracting with a private party to brew it for them. They pick the recipee, they give you the ingredients, you brew it, they take it home. Is that "selling beer", or is it selling labor? In essence the money you are making is on your services, not the beer...I'm sure someone is going to tell me it's selling "my beer" but think about it this way...
A contract computer programmer isn't selling his program. He's programming for the guy selling the program. How would this be any different? I know that I've come home only to find I drank the last bottle of homebrew the night before and thinking to myself, gee I wish I could pay someone to bottle that ale in the fermenter.

 

[Stevorino]

I think we'd have to know more about the house ale yeast-- but I'd suggest doing something really simple like a kolsch or blonde ale. That could be a hit at this place where they don't have anything for the average joe.

 

[beerthirty]

since you say the house yeast is english and that makes it a little fruity, I would try a nice clean belgian. Many have a bit of wheat and not alot of hops. If its clean on the palette then it would appeal to many not just a few. I dont like most belgians but a smooth clean one is delectable.

Edit: I know of a couple pub owners that want me to do the same but they don't have equipment and I don't feel I have the experience yet. We are talking though and maybe in the next year or two my beers will convince them the equipment would be a worthy investment, so I understand your deleima.(I want nothing to do with the licensing of a brewery)

 

[HarvInSTL]

I'd verify first what yeast you would be using.

But a Rye Pale Ale would be a nice fit in thier lineup.

 

[MikeRLynch]

Edit: I know of a couple pub owners that want me to do the same but they don't have equipment and I don't feel I have the experience yet. We are talking though and maybe in the next year or two my beers will convince them the equipment would be a worthy investment, so I understand your deleima.(I want nothing to do with the licensing of a brewery)

I know what you mean, I was looking at the requirements for getting a small brewery off the ground and it was ridiculous (not to mention prohibitively expensive). However if you have some established partners who want a house brew to call their own, you might want to consider using a 3.5 bbl setup, here's a link to one. Total cost is under 80,000, which isnt all that bad.

So i've decided to take advice and go with a brown ale, and I'm going to try to sell the usage of more hops. My brown is usually around 5%, so perhaps if I lower the abv to around 3.5% I can save a little money on grain and still keep the hops coming through. Brewing it today, we'll see how things work out. I'm using wyeast 1056 american, only because i'm not entirely sure of what they use at the brewery. I figure I'll make a good beer and tweek the details of yeast, grain, and hops when we get this thing rolling. I don't expect to get in there until the fall anyway, so it would be a good time for a brown.

Thanks for your input guys, any tips on making a good american brown? I'll have my recipe in my sig if you want to take a look at mine.

mike

 

[Bob]

Slow down, tiger! You're putting the cart before the horse.

You must find out what yeast they're using before you brew anything. The yeast profile is going to have such a significant impact on the beer that it's folly to do otherwise. Don't waste your money, even on a pilot brew, until you have this essential information.

Why? There are many different kinds of 'English Ale' yeasts, each of which has its own ester production and attenuation profile. Each will produce different results.

Call the brewer and ask. Don't guess, don't tell yourself you think it's fairly neutral; get the Wyeast or White Labs product number. Otherwise, the pilot batch you make will be nothing like the larger batch.

Of course, this post cunningly avoids issues of batch scaling. We can leave that for another thread.

Cheers,

Bob

 

[jfrizzell]

Or better yet, get some yeast from them for your pilot batch. I would still find out what strain they're using for the house yeast, but if you get get some of their yeast to use, then you'd be sure you're getting the same results on your pilot batch.

 

[jspence1]

Hmmm. Contract brewing. I've actually been thinking a lot about this lately. Yours is obviously not "selling alcohol" but selling a brewing service to someone who is going to sell the beer, so you aren't the one that needs the liquor liscence. What if you were to "brew" for private parties to consume the beer, explicitly stating that you weren't "selling beer" but contracting with a private party to brew it for them. They pick the recipee, they give you the ingredients, you brew it, they take it home. Is that "selling beer", or is it selling labor? In essence the money you are making is on your services, not the beer...I'm sure someone is going to tell me it's selling "my beer" but think about it this way...
A contract computer programmer isn't selling his program. He's programming for the guy selling the program. How would this be any different? I know that I've come home only to find I drank the last bottle of homebrew the night before and thinking to myself, gee I wish I could pay someone to bottle that ale in the fermenter.

In Canada as long as the person you are making the beer for pitches the yeast your good. it can't be beer until it ferments, it can't ferment without yeast,

 

[Saccharomyces]

Or better yet, get some yeast from them for your pilot batch. I would still find out what strain they're using for the house yeast, but if you get get some of their yeast to use, then you'd be sure you're getting the same results on your pilot batch.

Yep. +1

Once you settle in on your recipe if you want to be doubly sure you could try to get a few other local homebrewers together to try the recipe so you can judge how repeatable the results are with the same ingredients. Aah, research.

 

[Skrimpy]

In Canada as long as the person you are making the beer for pitches the yeast your good. it can't be beer until it ferments, it can't ferment without yeast,

So what this means is, if they pay you to brew wort and store fermenting beer, you aren't selling beer. You are being paid to cook and store. Not make beer. Of course the monetary transaction will have to take place prior to pitching. This sounds good to me! I'll have to look into it. I have often thought to myself how nice it would be, to be able to purchase a homebrew. Yes I like brewing, but with three very young children and some other obligations I have very little time to brew. We all agree here that there is something distinctly different about homebrews (maybe an oxydation thing), and that they could be a very, very viable product if the laws about starting commercial breweries weren't so prohibitive like MLynchLtd said. I would guess it would be a way more viable product than ANY commercial beer. I love beer, but I know that if I had the choice between a homebrewed ale vs my favorite commercial brew (Bass), I would take the homebrew, even under pain of death. My very critical and suspicious natured mind thinks that the commercial breweries would have a stake at keeping the prohibitive rules in place and that they would do everything they could to stop a product like it.