Plugging a carboy for long-term aging

[RatCity]

Did a few searches and couldn't find anything: If I wanted to age a batch of high OG brew, or even apfelwein, could I just put a stopper (plug) on the carboy after it's fermented out (IE, after 1+ month of fermentation)? Or does it still need to degas?

I ask because I oxidized TWO batches of apfelwein due to the airlocks running out of liquid. Made me think I would've been better off with just an airtight cap on them. Or maybe I should just be checking the airlock levels more often...

Anyone have experience with this?

 

[RatCity]

Finding in some threads that people have success bulk aging in cornys, which is maybe just the simplest way to go about it...although I have way more empty carboys than corny kegs at the moment.

 

[Yooper]

Sure, we winemakers do it all the time. Once it's finished and no longer producing co2, it's fine to put a solid bung on it. I still use airlocks, because even barometric changes can cause some pressure in the carboy and expel the bung. I tried carboy caps, but they weren't 100% airtight and I ruined a carboy of wine from slight oxidation- so I still use the airlocks much of the time, though!

Unless you live in a desert, water in an airlock should stay for at least a few months!

 

[cheezydemon3]

......................oxidized??????????

Oxygen doesn't just seep through CO2 to oxidize your beer on a whim.....

INFECTION?, yes.

Better to BOTTLE a beer you wish to age.

Bulk conditioning is done fine in carboys. Add water every 3 months to the airlock.

Bottle conditioning is time honored and a fine substitute.

 

[RatCity]

Yooper - Awesome, thanks for the reply, and honored to get one from the guy who's Dead Guy clone recipe I plan to use!! I might just more dutifully check on the airlock level. No excuse not to check it at least monthly...

My problem now is I built a fermenter out of a wine cooler but it only holds 1 bucket at a time. Fermenting all my beers at 3 weeks slows me down to a 5 gallon batch per every three weeks...(not enough for my consumption and how much I give away to friends). Do you think it would be OK to ferment for 2 weeks in the temp controlled environment, then get the last week or two of fermentation in a closet (70ish degrees but fluctuating temp)? Or could that produce some bad flavors?

Cheezy - The apfelwein tasted nutty, like sherry - which after some careful research, I learned would give me a nasty hangover so I ditched both batches...10 gallons down the drain. Maybe it was infected and not just oxidized. And good point about bottle conditioning. I haven't done enough, frankly, since I got a keg setup, but it is indeed a time honored and fine substitute!! Makes me think I will do a round of that next.

 

[JRems]

I might be wrong but I think yoopers a girl.

 

[jvcjbl]

Yooper - Awesome, thanks for the reply, and honored to get one from the gal who's Dead Guy clone recipe I plan to use!! I might just more dutifully check on the airlock level. No excuse not to check it at least monthly...

My problem now is I built a fermenter out of a wine cooler but it only holds 1 bucket at a time. Fermenting all my beers at 3 weeks slows me down to a 5 gallon batch per every three weeks...(not enough for my consumption and how much I give away to friends). Do you think it would be OK to ferment for 2 weeks in the temp controlled environment, then get the last week or two of fermentation in a closet (70ish degrees but fluctuating temp)? Or could that produce some bad flavors?

Cheezy - The apfelwein tasted nutty, like sherry - which after some careful research, I learned would give me a nasty hangover so I ditched both batches...10 gallons down the drain. Maybe it was infected and not just oxidized. And good point about bottle conditioning. I haven't done enough, frankly, since I got a keg setup, but it is indeed a time honored and fine substitute!! Makes me think I will do a round of that next.

Fixed

 

[RatCity]

Oops, thanks!

 

[02fx4dude]

Finding in some threads that people have success bulk aging in cornys, which is maybe just the simplest way to go about it...although I have way more empty carboys than corny kegs at the moment.

I bought a few extra kegs for aging. They're durable, stackable, and don't let light through. I've had a few get knocked over with no problems, not gonna get that with a glass carboy.

 

[Yooper]

I might be wrong but I think yoopers a girl.

Lemme check. Yep, it's a girl alright.

Yooper - Awesome, thanks for the reply, and honored to get one from the guy who's Dead Guy clone recipe I plan to use!! I might just more dutifully check on the airlock level. No excuse not to check it at least monthly...

My problem now is I built a fermenter out of a wine cooler but it only holds 1 bucket at a time. Fermenting all my beers at 3 weeks slows me down to a 5 gallon batch per every three weeks...(not enough for my consumption and how much I give away to friends). Do you think it would be OK to ferment for 2 weeks in the temp controlled environment, then get the last week or two of fermentation in a closet (70ish degrees but fluctuating temp)? Or could that produce some bad flavors?

Cheezy - The apfelwein tasted nutty, like sherry - which after some careful research, I learned would give me a nasty hangover so I ditched both batches...10 gallons down the drain. Maybe it was infected and not just oxidized. And good point about bottle conditioning. I haven't done enough, frankly, since I got a keg setup, but it is indeed a time honored and fine substitute!! Makes me think I will do a round of that next.

I don't like the idea of fluctuating temps, but it really won't harm the flavor much. If you have serious motivation, you could put the fermenters into a bin/cooler/trash can type water bath, to minimize temperature fluctuations. I do that in the summer, when it's cool in the evenings but warm during the day. In the summer, I even add a frozen water bottle to the water bath to cool it down a bit. If you don't want to go that route, covering the fermenter with a sleeping bag to insulate it will help minimize temperature fluctuations as then it'll take a LONG time for 5 gallons of liquid to change temperature.

Nutty and sherry flavors are definite oxidation flavors! I don't think you'd get a big hangover, though. It just doesn't taste very good.

 

[shortyjacobs]

......................oxidized??????????

Oxygen doesn't just seep through CO2 to oxidize your beer on a whim.....

It does, actually.

Gas diffusion isn't a joke. CO2 is heavier than O2 alone, yes. While that gives you short term protection, given a bit of time the CO2 will leak out, and O2, (and N2) will leak in. Then, given a bit more time, O2 will diffuse into the beer itself. This is a slow process, measured in days/weeks, not minutes, but with a dry airlock, oxygen can CERTAINLY seep through CO2 to oxidize your beer. It's not "on a whim", it's an established physical process driven by concentration (really, partial pressure) gradients.

People see CO2 and O2 as oil and water, i.e. they always self separate, and won't mix without an outside driving force. They aren't. Gasses love to mix, and will do so readily. CO2 and O2 are more like a stout and an ale in a black-and-tan. When you first pour it, yes, there is stratification and separation. But leave it on the table for an hour, and you'll come back to just a "brown" not a black-and-tan.

/takes off engineer and chemist hats.

 

[philogeek]

Airlocks are fine - just check 'em often and top up as necessary.

I create and store my drinks in the same place, so I'm in there often enough to notice when an airlock needs to be topped up - If they're tucked away out of sight, maybe just create a reminder on your phone or whatever, weekly, to go take a peek?

GL!

 

[cheezydemon3]

Good info Shorty!

 

[ezzieyguywuf]

Huzzah to shorty! I am a mechanical engineer and can definitely say that he speaks truth.
ezziey

 

[str8wire]

Huzzah to shorty! I am a mechanical engineer and can definitely say that he speaks truth.
ezziey

I've never even ridden on a train, and you can work on them and drive them:rockin:

 

[RatCity]

Shorty - great info, and I definitely think that's what happened to my batches. D'oh.

Yooper - thanks again. Doing anything outside is tough, I'm right in Boston with no yard to speak of, but I think I will try and finagle some way to keep the temps normal-ish. In the summer I might just have to do 2 weeks fermenting in the wine cooler for the smaller ABV batches (Cream Ale, etc) and let it do the rest of the aging in a keg (2+ weeks before I tap) - so I can have a consistent pipeline of good table beer. Mmmm. Beer.