Pineapple extract?

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

I'm getting ready to brew my summer lager loosely based on Kona Longboard. Last year I tried adding real pineapple to secondary. I ended up with a load of trub, considerably less beer and zero pineapple flavor. So this year I am trying pure pineapple extract and looking for some guidance.

I am leaning toward adding it in the bottling bucket rather than the fermenter but I don't have a feel for how much. Everyone always says add a little at a time until you get the flavor you want but I have had mixed results with that approach with other flavors. What tastes good in the bottling bucket is not always the same flavor in the finished brew.

Has anyone tried this? I haven't found a lot of info on using pineapple extract. I am thinking about using 2 oz. Just looking for a hint of pineapple.

 

[didinho]

maybe ananas has a lot of pectins and vegetable gelatins, so you got a lot of trub.
how many sugars does it contains? if you use it for priming, you need to consider the right quantity of fermentables, to avoid to put bombs in your bottles

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

The trub mostly wasn't actually trub. It was just a lot of left over pineapple chunks that soaked up a lot of beer and gave me no flavor. The extract doesn't have fermentables (or at least very little) in it so I can add it at bottling without worrying about bottle bombs.. I just don't know how much flavor is in an ounce of extract so I don't know how much is enough and how much is too much.

 

[GilSwillBasementBrews]

I think most extracts used roughly call for 2-4oz per 5 gallon batch. I would start with 1-2 oz of extract per 5 gallons and add more if the flavor isn't what you desired. You can always add more. You can't take too much back out. You could always find a similar beer of the style your brewing and see how much to add to your glass till you get the flavor you want then scale upto a 5gallon batch.

 

[bruhaha]

I'm getting ready to brew my summer lager loosely based on Kona Longboard. Last year I tried adding real pineapple to secondary. I ended up with a load of trub, considerably less beer and zero pineapple flavor. So this year I am trying pure pineapple extract and looking for some guidance.

I am leaning toward adding it in the bottling bucket rather than the fermenter but I don't have a feel for how much. Everyone always says add a little at a time until you get the flavor you want but I have had mixed results with that approach with other flavors. What tastes good in the bottling bucket is not always the same flavor in the finished brew.

Has anyone tried this? I haven't found a lot of info on using pineapple extract. I am thinking about using 2 oz. Just looking for a hint of pineapple.

May I ask for your feedback once you have gotten a bit deeper in your process? I am looking into infusing a wheat beer base with pineapple and jalapeno. I keep thinking if I get a really GOOD pineapple extract, that would take most guess work out of how fresh fruit will interact with the beer. If you get a good feel for the pineapple extract, will you give me a shout out? I am soaking some fresh garden jalapeno peppers in vodka for a tincture now. I think this will be great added with pineapple extract during kegging and lagering.

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

I think I will try 2 oz in the bottling bucket and see where that gets me. I will post and update once I have a finished brew but it will probably be a couple of months at least.

 

[bigdaddybrew]

I brewed a basic 5 gallon Cream Ale recipe with 2 oz of Citra hop pellets at the end of the boil.
I also peeled and diced a fresh pineapple and added it at the end of the boil. It added some tartness and bit of fruitiness but no obvious aroma so I added 1 dram of Loran pineapple extract to the bottling bucket. It added just enough pineapple aroma to know you were drinking a pineapple beer but not overwhelmingly so....
http://www.homebrewing.org/Pineapple-Flavoring-1-Dram-_p_3634.html

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

Wow, 1/8 ounce gave you noticeable flavor? I wonder if this flavoring is more concentrated than the extract I have. I may start with 1/2 oz in the bucket and see how it tastes before I step it up. Thanks for the info.

 

[bigdaddybrew]

They recommend 1 dram per 5 gallons using the Loran oil but 2-4 ounces of this product...
http://www.homebrewing.org/Natural-Pineapple-Flavoring-Extract-4-oz_p_6258.htm

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

Ok, so there is a difference between the two. Good to know.

 

[bruhaha]

Wow, 1/8 ounce gave you noticeable flavor? I wonder if this flavoring is more concentrated than the extract I have. I may start with 1/2 oz in the bucket and see how it tastes before I step it up. Thanks for the info.

I ordered some all natural pineapple extract from Adventures In Homebrewing. The brewer said this extract has high reviews compared to other flavors, and that even some craft breweries use this product. But this extract, and probably the extract you have, is likely different than the "oil" version being discussed.

In the extracts we have, it is suggested to infuse beer with around 2 ounces of the product. In my case, that's half of my 4 ounce bottle. If 2 oz is enough, this gives me enough for two 5.5G batches. BUT, I'll add a bit at a time in my keg and taste...or in your case, the bottling bucket. My only question is, will the flavor profile change with a couple of days of aging? I could always add more to my keg at any point, your bottling efforts are limited to getting it right to begin.

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

Usually the flavor in my bottling bucket is a bit stronger than the flavor in the final carbonated and conditioned beer. Sometimes not. But if I add enough that it is noticeable in the bucket but not strong, I should be OK either way. We'll see ...

 

[bigdaddybrew]

I remember a strong pineapple aroma when I added the dram to the keg but it was more subtle when carbonated, using the dram of Loran pineapple extract.

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

OK, so I wanted to post an update. I brewed this lager on August 5 and bottled a couple of weeks ago. The good news is it went very smoothly and came out clear as a bell. So far, that's the only good news.

Since there seemed to be a consensus that 2 oz was kind of a standard amount of extract to add to the bottling bucket, that's what I did. I should have stuck with my 1/2 oz plan. Two ounces was too much. It definitely has a bit of a cough syrup-ish flavor. Oh, well. I'll let it sit for a few months and hope it mellows.

 

[petrolSpice]

Good info, thanks for the update.

As a data point, I brewed a 5 gallon batch of an 8% IPA and added nearly 7lb of pineapple puree to the secondary. My results were similar, lots of lost beer (about 0.75 gallons) and virtually no pineapple flavor. If someone told you there was pineapple in it and you closed your eyes and imagined very hard you might taste it. Otherwise it's not obvious at all.

As it was fermenting again after adding the pineapple it smelled very good and I was sure it would have some flavor. I could also smell it in the bottling bucket. But after 4 weeks in the bottles that flavor is virtually nonexistent.

Next time I will probably try to find pineapple concentrate or pure pineapple juice in addition to extract.

I wonder if extract is better at bottling or in the fermenter? Maybe the yeast would help "clean up" those off flavors from the extract.

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

Once I get past the cough syrup flavor there is some aroma and hint of pineapple. Next time I will try 1/2 oz. It's amazing to me that 2 oz of extract in 640 oz pf beer (about 0.3%) has such a strong effect.

 

[Jmash]

I added the whole 4 oz bottle of extract to my 5 gal batch in secondary. Same recipe as the grapefruit sculpin. 4 oz is a bit too much but it's only been in the bottle for 1.5 weeks. (I'm an impatient bastid). Do you think it will mellow out over time?

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

I know vanilla extract fades over time so I'm hopeful the same applies to pineapple.

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

Quick update. So it has been about 5 months since I bottled my "pineapple infused" lager. What started as more of a pineapple cough syrup lager is finally starting to mellow. I've been trying about a bottle a month and it has just about reached the point of being enjoyable. It is still just a touch too much pineapple up front but eases off pretty quickly. In another month or two it should be pretty good. Still way too much trouble and waiting. Next time (if there is a next time) I will go with 1/2 of of extract. Lesson learned.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Here's a suggestion for next time. Buy 4-5 cans of canned pineapple. Puree all the pineapple, add it to brew kettle at 10 minutes before flame out. - Or - At flame out, add it, stir it in, and continuously stir for 20 minutes before running your chiller. (This idea/technique for adding fruit flavor came from reading "Extreme Brewing" written by Sam Calagione, Owner of Dogfishhead)

After further thought and recollection;
- If using whole fruit use the last 10 minutes of the boil to break up the fruit fibers.
- If using puree use the 20 minute stir & steep method .

Then gyle your beer at bottling or kegging time with pineapple juice. Use this - Gyle Calculator

Take a sample of your pineapple juice, measure the gravity. The use the calculator with "Gyle with different OG" checked.

Works well. See this thread. Made Cherry X-Mas Wheat using this method. Nothing fake or medicinal using this method.

HBT Thread: Priming with Juice

BTW - Here's another "adding fruit taste" experiment, no gyling, just adding fruit late in the boil and at flame out - Cherries and Bananas: HBT Thread: Donkey Kong Strong Ale

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

Thanks for the tips. I did the extract with this batch because I had tried using pineapple concentrate and pureed whole pineapple with previous brews, both of which resulted in no pineapple flavor at all. I've tried adding during the boil and adding in the fermenter with no luck. The only flavor I ever detected was a tinge of apple The flavor always just fermented away, which is why I was trying the extract.

I do like the idea of gyling at bottling. That may warrant giving this brew another try. It seems there may be a reason you don't find many pineapple brews around. Even the commercial ones I tried (Sculpin I think?) weren't that "pineappley". I've had luck with other flavors but this one has been elusive. Oh, well. Live and learn.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Thanks for the tips. I did the extract with this batch because I had tried using pineapple concentrate and pureed whole pineapple with previous brews, both of which resulted in no pineapple flavor at all. I've tried adding during the boil and adding in the fermenter with no luck. The only flavor I ever detected was a tinge of apple The flavor always just fermented away, which is why I was trying the extract.

I do like the idea of gyling at bottling. That may warrant giving this brew another try. It seems there may be a reason you don't find many pineapple brews around. Even the commercial ones I tried (Sculpin I think?) weren't that "pineappley". I've had luck with other flavors but this one has been elusive. Oh, well. Live and learn.

Sorry to hear of the trial and error issues using pineapple. I have several brewing books with recipes and I am always surprised on the amount of fruit required to get a significant fruit taste. To me it often seems excessive in some cases and fairly expensive and I know it usually dramatically hurts your yield. Essentially you have a lot of pulp that just won't siphon.

I have used cranberry before, in very moderate amounts, and got a bunch tart cranberry fruit taste, but its pretty dominate tasting fruit. I took a 1 pound bag of cranberries, boiled 1 cup of sugar, and 1 cup of water and simmered the cranberries for 20 minutes. I only primaried it. Boiling 5-7 lbs of bananas in the wort definitely works too.

I know priming with works with cherry juice. I also know long term aging on fruit works too. The latter tends to be with big beers that have attenuation problems on their own. (ones having a bunch of crystal and roasted malts)

One thing to try is yeasts that don't attenuate well on their own. Windsor, London ESB, possibly several others;

https://byo.com/resources/yeast

http://www.shegoguebrew.com/p/yeast-strains.html

http://www.brewunited.com/yeast_database.php

http://www.lugwrenchbrewing.com/2010/08/fermentation-attenuation-ranges-by.html
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If you have the ability to do temp control, try lower temps and mash higher if you do all grain. I'd try the low attenuation yeasts first.

A little riskier is to bump the gravity up and under pitch the low attenuating yeast and keep it in the coolest place you can find in the house.

 

[Schlenkerla]

I forgot about this option....

Do you keg? If you do, you can sorbate the base beer, then add pineapple juice at kegging and carb it up with gas.

I personally like the priming with juice for natural reasons. Not mention it requires you to consider the juice OG and adjust accordingly for the sugar concentration.

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

I don't keg but I like the idea of using lower attenuating yeast. I hadn't thought of that. Next time I will try it with Windsor and mash at 154F. I do have a ferm chamber and usually ferment in the lower third of the yeast's temp range so that won't change. Pipeline is full right now so t will be a while before I can report back on the next attempt.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Just thinking lactose might be an option too to leave some residual sweetness....