On the fence about this buy....

[OpenSights]

My club has a sour barrel that’s been going for a number of years. Take a gallon, add a gallon... up to five at a time.

To fill a 53 gallon barrel to keep the inside wet I’d have to a brew a ton of extract or see if I can brew a micro on my buddy’s 7 barrel system.... if that’s even possible.

Other than the logistics of brewing 53 gallons, can I make it, say a stout barrel without having to make it a sour? Can I take 5 gallons and add 5 and keep it a stout? I know the club barrel started out as a dark beer then turned it into a sour barrel. If I buy one, and have to wait to brew, fill it with water? I would think that would be stripping it of the existing flavors....

The only info I have so far is what you see. Don’t want to bug the person without knowing if this is a fruitless adventure.

Thanks in advance!

Oh, if I go extract, I have the capability of brewing at least close to 50 gallons in one day, but that would be 5 burners and kettles and a very long day! Chilling would definitely be an issue! Plus separate plastic fermenters, which means I’d have to keg most of my beers and ciders.

 

[Steveruch]

A smaller barrel?

 

[OpenSights]

A smaller barrel?

A 5 gallon new runs about $120...

That’s what makes me wonder. While 50+ gallons would last me a year or more, the idea of a rotating, mostly aging supply sounds tempting....

 

[Jayjay1976]

I don't know if the take some/add some will work with a stout. Sounds like you'd be exposing it to a lot of oxygen and sooner or later it will become infected. Once some wild microbes gain a foothold, sours are all you can do with it from that day forward. If you just want to age conventional stouts on oak, look at cubes, chips, or spirals and do it in a fermenter. On the other hand, if you want the sherry-like flavors that long aging can produce, a barrel is just the ticket. Bottle caps are too tight to allow the gradual oxydation and other reactions that produce deep aged flavors. You could also look into packaging your beer in bottles using natural corks, which are supposed to encourage aging with extremely slow oxygen ingress.

 

[OpenSights]

@Jayjay1976 you pretty much answered my question and summed up my concerns. Thanks!

While I appreciate sours for what they are, not my favorite... in fact, more like the least favorite for my wife in the aroma aftermath.

Watched a good video from Townsend on YouTube today about sanitization in the 18-1900’s today that made me ask the question.

I’m still new and learning, never hurts to ask.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

I have been informed that a barrel will only stay “clean” for 2-3 batches of aged beer. If you acquire a used barrel, even freshly emptied, best practice is to fill it to check for leaks and sanitize before filling. Yes it will not smell as nice, but the barrel has had the spirits in side for a year plus presumably, so the character will come through. 53 gallons sounds like a group effort is needed, or a brewing buddy with a really big set up.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Like @Hoppy2bmerry said, sanitize it before use and after to get the most out of a barrell. A brewer I know uses a handle of cheap High Ten whiskey to condition and sanitize between batches; its decent for sippin' before it goes into the barrel and pretty damned good after it comes back out, having darkened and acquired a really nice oaky flavor. You might argue that this strips away some of the flavors of the barrel, but if you hang onto the whiskey you can dose it back in either before or after aging.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

Instructions/guide https://www.williamsbrewing.com/pdfs/b03.pdf

 

[madscientist451]

I get pretty good oak character using barrel chips that are originally sold for smoking meat. I soak them in bourbon or calvados before using.
Using a stainless steel canister, you can add them to a keg. Pull them out when the desired flavor profile is reached, but I usually reserve part of the batch as un-oaked for blending purposes. If I'm using them in cider, I'll add them to gallon glass jugs and rack the cider on top.
Using chips, staves, spirals or similar products doesn't provide the same character as using a barrel, but you don't have the same headaches either, and you don't have to worry about 50+ gallons of beer going sour.
Having said that, some day I'm going to get a 5 or 10 gallon whiskey barrel to play around with.
Using a big barrel for home brewing seems kind of crazy to me. But if that's your thing, go for it.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

A brewer I know uses a handle of cheap High Ten whiskey to condition and sanitize between batches; its decent for sippin' before it goes into the barrel and pretty damned good after it comes back out, having darkened and acquired a really nice oaky flavor.

Thanks for sharing this info. I have been toying with the idea of filling my barrel with some everclear type spirit to keep it clean for a couple more brews.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Thanks for sharing this info. I have been toying with the idea of filling my barrel with some everclear type spirit to keep it clean for a couple more brews.

I've read that you can also fill the barrel with water and use campden tablets to kill any undesirables, I think you would then dump it out and use the whiskey soak to get it ready for beer.

Disclaimer: I've never messed with barrels myself although I have read about it here on HBT, hopefully somebody with a lot of actual experience will chime in...

 

[OpenSights]

I think I’m going to pass on this deal. Maybe if I enjoyed sours more.... seems inevitable. No way I could ever drink that much sour!

Before my LHBS closed they had a few 5 gallon barrels that eventually sold out at $120. I would’ve bought one but waited too long. Now I’m rethinking the entire idea.

Thanks for all the good info!

 

[OpenSights]

I've read that you can also fill the barrel with water and use campden tablets to kill any undesirables, I think you would then dump it out and use the whiskey soak to get it ready for beer.

Disclaimer: I've never messed with barrels myself although I have read about it here on HBT, hopefully somebody with a lot of actual experience will chime in...

Hadn’t thought about cleaning with campden! That’s an awesome idea between batches!

My last brew day I had a lemon peel bag blow into my cooled wort. Decided to treat it with campden and pitch the next night.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

I've thought about doing a 5 gallon barrel. My wife wants me to do one...not because she wants any (won't touch a stout with a 10 foot pole), but because she thinks it would be cool.

I tried to start a group effort in my club to fill a full-sized barrel, but we couldn't agree on a recipe. Nobody liked my idea of a cuvee where each person brewed their own favorite RIS and we blended them in the barrel. The only thing we could agree on was that all involved would sample and have to approve anything that went into the barrel. It never came to be even though I had a line on a "wet" (freshly dumped) bourbon barrel.

I age my big stouts in a corny keg and oak with bourbon soaked oak staves. They go pretty fast that way, so I age first and add the oak towards the end, then carb and bottle after racking to a freshly sanitized keg. The next one will be naturally carbonated in a keg.

 

[OpenSights]

I've thought about doing a 5 gallon barrel. My wife wants me to do one...not because she wants any (won't touch a stout with a 10 foot pole), but because she thinks it would be cool.

I tried to start a group effort in my club to fill a full-sized barrel, but we couldn't agree on a recipe. Nobody liked my idea of a cuvee where each person brewed their own favorite RIS and we blended them in the barrel. The only thing we could agree on was that all involved would sample and have to approve anything that went into the barrel. It never came to be even though I had a line on a "wet" (freshly dumped) bourbon barrel.

I age my big stouts in a corny keg and oak with bourbon soaked oak staves. They go pretty fast that way, so I age first and add the oak towards the end, then carb and bottle after racking to a freshly sanitized keg. The next one will be naturally carbonated in a keg.

Too bad you’re club didn’t go with your idea... it’s really cool having a communal barrel!

My club is 23 years old, many members have gone pro. We have a seven barrel system and brew 1-2 times a year. I’ve only been a member for about 2.5 years and now on the board.

My understanding is the club paid for a barrel of wort from one ”firebrew” years ago, not sure what, but you could add a similar beer and take from the barrel. Once it soured any beer can be added as long as the barrel keeper, a 20+ year veteran home brewer and former president approves it.

Last sample I tried was really good! Made of hundreds of different beers from stout to IPA.

If you can convince your club to go in on it, I’d say have a vote on one, at least with my club, currently just under 40 members, we can all agree on a base beer to begin with. Brew your recipe and combine. Keep that style until it sours, then do what we do. Acceptable beer, take and add.

Our barrel is lightly funky and lightly sour. Really nice balance.

 

[Cyclman]

I got mine here, got a deal. 15G is perfect for home brewed. Have a batch of Imperal Stout, currently have Belgian Strong in it, fermenting a Flanders Red which I plan to Solera every year. Love sours, though.

https://www.thebeveragepeople.com/p...-rye-whiskey-american-charred-15-gallons.html

 

[gnef]

I have a full size Jack Daniel's barrel that houses a Flander's Red solera, started in 2015. It is past due for the next partial drain and refill, and the beer coming out of it so far has been fantastic. This next pull is going to be more tart than the previous ones because we waited two years now, and I still haven't done it (it's crazy how life can get in the way of things!).

I have also started a personal multi-vessel barleywine solera using stainless sankey kegs. I started in 2017, and I've brewed the batch for this year to be able to fill the second vessel and displace some in the first vessel. This will be on a 2 year schedule for me, and it should be fine in that regard. I do add oak cubes into the sankey kegs before reassembly with the spear. I'm going to look in to mini staves though and I may use those instead in the future, we'll see.

 

[mashpaddled]

If your sanitation was really on point with every batch and every pull (if you do it as a solera-type system) then conceivably you could keep a barrel going clean but the risk of infection grows every time you open the barrel and put in more beer/wort. Chances are good in a home environment that you will end up with some kind of infection over time.

With any barrel you have to think not only about consuming the content of the barrel but the need to constantly keep liquid in it to keep the staves tight and deter infection. With a five gallon batch you are probably turning it over every six to twelve months (if not sooner) which means the barrel is going to put out five to ten gallons of beer every year whether you want that much additional beer until whatever point you decide to sell or retire the barrel.