OFFICIAL Kate the Great Russian Imperial Stout Clone

[vacax]

From what I understand, the normal version of KTG is aged on port soaked oak spirals.

 

[RedHouse]

Today was Kate The Great Day at the Brewery. I had to work, so I couldn't make it....but from the sounds of it, the beer was great.

 

[kshuler]

Fantastic someone has posted this Recipe. Can't wait to find out how it turned out!

Klaus

 

[theover]

My brewday video of this monster stout

 

[kappajoe]

Nice setup... whats your target FG on this beer?

 

[mullenite]

From what I understand, the normal version of KTG is aged on port soaked oak spirals.

It is, and it provides a huge amount of flavor to the beer. The stuff they soak the spirals in is local and I've never tasted anything like it.

 

[ckwatkins]

I have the ingredients to brew this beer in the next few weeks. I have a good bottle of port that I wouldn't mind sacrificing to this recipe but I don't have ready access to oak spirals. Since I haven't been able to try this beer first hand I'm wondering what other form of oak would be appropriate. Chips or Cubes? Level of Toast? French, American, or Hungarian Oak? Thanks for the help.

 

[heywolfie1015]

Chips or Cubes? Level of Toast? French, American, or Hungarian Oak? Thanks for the help.

Since you'll be aging on the oak, definitely cubes. Chips are for active fermentation, when you want to impart an "oaky" flavor quickly. Cubes are for aging, when you want to obtain the subtle oak flavors that only come with long exposure to the wood.

Since this is such a big beer, my guess is that American Medium Toast is the way to go. Nice vanilla/coconut/banana flavors, good tannins, and big enough to stand up to the massive roast already present in this beast. (At least, that is my assumption based on the ingredients.) Here is a nice site with cubes for sale that--more importantly--has nice descriptions for the flavors and contributions you can expect. It will all depend on what you are going for, but different choices will affect the final result.

 

[ckwatkins]

Heywolfie1015- Thanks for the help! Would you recommend just putting the soaked oak cubes into the secondary or would you also dump the port that was used to soak the cubes in as well?

 

[mullenite]

Heywolfie1015- Thanks for the help! Would you recommend just putting the soaked oak cubes into the secondary or would you also dump the port that was used to soak the cubes in as well?

Let the cubes absorb the port and then drop the cubes in.

 

[dcp27]

Id add the port too since it will absorb some of the oak essence. I've had a clone before and he recommended using around a cup of port

 

[heywolfie1015]

Heywolfie1015- Thanks for the help! Would you recommend just putting the soaked oak cubes into the secondary or would you also dump the port that was used to soak the cubes in as well?

Opinions differ on this subject, but mine is that you should not pour the port in. There are a couple of reasons for this. First, new oak is really, really powerful. By soaking it, you are taking out some of the tannins and flavor, leaving behind a mellower, more subtle piece of wood. To me, this is desirable because it then allows you to age over a longer period of time and have a larger "sweet spot" for just the right amount of oak. (If you search through these and other home brewing forums, you'll see a lot of stories about over-oaking. Most, if not all, of those involve new oak.) Second, by pouring in the excess port, you run the risk of making the beer too boozy. If, at bottling or kegging, you think it needs more port, you can always add more at that time. You can't take out the booze, so moderation with the first addition is key.

Some others might disagree with my position, so feel free to take it with a grain of salt. I've never thought about using port before, so I'm really excited about this idea. Will be very interesting to see how it turns out.

P.S. The rule of thumb is 1-2 oz. of cubes per 5 gallons of beer. Obviously just a general rule, though, so make sure you taste as it ages to see when it gets to the level you like.

 

[1Mainebrew]

I'm buying my ingredients today and will be brewing this up on Tuesday.

 

[Linkin]

That's a hell of a recipe. Big and complex. I guess the beer is, too, no? I don't think I've ever heard of the brewery (I'm pretty certain they don't distribute to OH, or not this beer, anyway). Has anyone tried making this yet?

Since no one else really answered this.... Portsmouth Brewery is a brew pub and doesn't distribute anywhere. Their sister brewery by the same owner is Smuttynose (not sure if they distribute out in OH) and their beers are similar. I grew up around there and didn't realize KTG had such celebrity beyond the region. I always figured it was a local event. Anyways, fantastic beer if you are into stouts, although I suppose that is kind of a tease unless you plan on traveling to Portsmouth just for that beer.

 

[mullenite]

Since no one else really answered this.... Portsmouth Brewery is a brew pub and doesn't distribute anywhere. Their sister brewery by the same owner is Smuttynose (not sure if they distribute out in OH) and their beers are similar. I grew up around there and didn't realize KTG had such celebrity beyond the region. I always figured it was a local event. Anyways, fantastic beer if you are into stouts, although I suppose that is kind of a tease unless you plan on traveling to Portsmouth just for that beer.

Smuttynose Imperial Stout is nothing at all like Kate, though my understanding is the regular Portsmouth lineup is pretty similar to the Smuttynose beers.

 

[BCastine]

Yeah Smutty's imperial stout is much different then KTG. I actually prefer the Smutty when comparing the two fresh. The Smutty is very hop forward, lots of west coast hops. KTG should be aged at least 2 yrs imho, then its one of the most complex, best tasting beers I've ever experienced.

 

[Linkin]

Yeah Smutty's imperial stout is much different then KTG. I actually prefer the Smutty when comparing the two fresh. The Smutty is very hop forward, lots of west coast hops. KTG should be aged at least 2 yrs imho, then its one of the most complex, best tasting beers I've ever experienced.

I didn't mean to imply the Smuttynose Imperial Stout was the same as KTG, I was only responding to a general question about the Portsmouth Brewery (i.e., that their beers are similar).

 

[1Mainebrew]

I just made this and undershot my gravity by quite a bit. Too bad, really, but I'm sure it will be a mighty fine tasting beer.

 

[ckwatkins]

Wolfie, thanks for the input on the wood and the port. It makes perfect sense. I hope I have the patience to let this one age as long as it needs to

 

[heywolfie1015]

No prob. Just make sure you put it on oak after primary fermentation is done. Better for aging.

Good luck! I'll be making this one this fall.

 

[GiraffeBrew]

Its my hometown brew, of course I'm gonna make it!!!

Long legs means more room for beer!

 

[1Mainebrew]

So port-soaked oak in the secondary for a month and half, or can I get away with just pouring some port into the keg?

 

[Sleepyemt]

You'll miss out on what the oak brings to the table...

 

[Oldsock]

About to mash this one in. I'm have a hard time telling from Todd's recipe if he is calling for 26 P (which incidentally is 1.110) to be the pre-boil or the post-boil gravity. If the reports that it is 12% ABV are correct 1.110 makes more sense since that would put the FG ~1.020. If it was pre-boil, that would put the post boil close to 1.130 (which would mean an FG closer to 1.040). Any body done an actual FG reading on Kate?

 

[mullenite]

About to mash this one in. I'm have a hard time telling from Todd's recipe if he is calling for 26 P (which incidentally is 1.110) to be the pre-boil or the post-boil gravity. If the reports that it is 12% ABV are correct 1.110 makes more sense since that would put the FG ~1.020. If it was pre-boil, that would put the post boil close to 1.130 (which would mean an FG closer to 1.040). Any body done an actual FG reading on Kate?

It's a thick beer so 1.040 doesn't seem too unlikely. Darklord finishes around there and the two are similar in body from what I remember.

 

[1Mainebrew]

I think the 1.110 is post-boil.

 

[Oldsock]

Well I only ended up at 1.101... and that was with 1 lb of DME added. I'd been getting much higher efficiency than normal recently, but this one tanked down to 64%. Fermentation is already blowing off at an ambient temp 57.

Sometimes Kate is listed at 10.5% ABV, which would make more sense for the “lower” OG (putting the FG in the mid-high 1.020s). That said, his extract equivalent with 6 lbs of grain and 18-20 lbs of extract would make for a much stronger beer (18 lbs of LME in 5.25 gallons would be 1.130 on its own).

 

[webbcreative]

Forgot to post an update:
My FG finally hit my target at 1.024 after 3 weeks in the primary. For an ABV of about 10.8%.

So yesterday I went a head and split the batch and added a about 2 ounces of oak [reused or I probably would have used less than that since the oak would have been stronger, and this is just a little more then 2 gallons] that had been soaking in port for about a week now.

Going to bottle the "regular" half this afternoon, and let it sit for about 5.5 months, and crack my first bottle on my birthday.

I will keep you posted as this progresses.

 

[Oldsock]

It has been the single most violent fermentation I've ever had. I used half a yeast 1272 yeast cake from a big hoppy red that didn't have an issue. The Kate clone was blowing off 12 hours after pitching, and it was still going 24 hours later. I've already lost ~1.5 gallons of beer, so this morning I moved the remaining beer to an 8 gallon bucket in the hopes of not losing more.

 

[BCastine]

I did this recipe as well, fell a bit short on gravity(1.094) and it fermented down to 1.022. I pitched a 3rd gen. cal ale and it mowed right thru it in like 5 days. At 7 days it already tasted good, but getting aged anyways. Lots of chocolate notes. After the RIS was done I resparged with 4 gallons more and made a small beer, hit 1.044 hopped to 40 IBU with U.S. Goldings and Williamette and fermented down to 1.012 with the same yeast. Drinking now, its actually an excellent beer, pretty close to an Irish dry stout. So don't dump out the grain when done with the RIS, theres another good beer left in there!