not distilling related...

[TheBluePhantom]

I am not a wine maker, by any means, so I want to learn something here. Before you ferment your Orange wine, do you adjust the PH? I realize that is far from a total, if hardly anything adjustment for final product. when you ferment something so acidic the PH would drop like rocks and maybe stick the fermentation? Am I way off?
Maybe some crushed Oyster shells in a hops bag dropped in during primary fermentation would help by keeping the PH up?
If that is totally off base, how would you adjust it at the end without destroying clarity?
Just some curious questions for my learning sake.
Just one more ignorant question..what is the address for Keller’s website?

That was one of my first projects. I don't remember adding any acid, definitely didn't reduce it. I did ferment too warm and it came out hot, but I bottled it anyway. Came back over a year later and opened one to see if it could at least used for cooking. It had mellowed perfectly, still one of the best ever.

To reduce acid these days I just use one of the packaged powders, calcium carbonate or potassium bicarbonate.

His original site was taken down when he passed away, If you search for "Jack Keller recipes" you will find a partial collection, but I didn't see the orange wine recipe.

I looked in my computer and found a partial list. The original recipe mentions orange juice, but was actually for oranges. It only gives tannin and yeast nutrient as additives. He does put a shot of cointreau in each bottle, and I agree, the spicing added is great. I remember using 5 gallons of juice and table sugar from the supermarket. ONce I added pectic enzyme everything dropped like a rock. Definetly ferment below 68, I did it at about 71 and got orange rocket fuel until it aged. Very strong orange flavor and amazing color, a bit too acidic on the first batch, but I didn't have a ph meter at the time. I would have to go digging to see if I had the original gravity. It does need to be back sweetened to balance.

If it didn't come out drinkable plan B was going to be make orange chicken with it. I still think that would have been killer.

Forgot to mention. He had a book published with some of his recipes.

Home Winemaking: The Simple Way to Make Delicious Wine: Keller Jr., Jack B., Pambianchi, Daniel: 9781591939474: Amazon.com: Books

 

[yaakov]

That was one of my first projects. I don't remember adding any acid, definitely didn't reduce it. I did ferment too warm and it came out hot, but I bottled it anyway. Came back over a year later and opened one to see if it could at least used for cooking. It had mellowed perfectly, still one of the best ever.

To reduce acid these days I just use one of the packaged powders, calcium carbonate or potassium bicarbonate.

His original site was taken down when he passed away, If you search for "Jack Keller recipes" you will find a partial collection, but I didn't see the orange wine recipe.

I looked in my computer and found a partial list. The original recipe mentions orange juice, but was actually for oranges. It only gives tannin and yeast nutrient as additives. He does put a shot of cointreau in each bottle, and I agree, the spicing added is great. I remember using 5 gallons of juice and table sugar from the supermarket. ONce I added pectic enzyme everything dropped like a rock. Definetly ferment below 68, I did it at about 71 and got orange rocket fuel until it aged. Very strong orange flavor and amazing color, a bit too acidic on the first batch, but I didn't have a ph meter at the time. I would have to go digging to see if I had the original gravity. It does need to be back sweetened to balance.

If it didn't come out drinkable plan B was going to be make orange chicken with it. I still think that would have been killer.

Forgot to mention. He had a book published with some of his recipes.

Home Winemaking: The Simple Way to Make Delicious Wine: Keller Jr., Jack B., Pambianchi, Daniel: 9781591939474: Amazon.com: Books

https://swguildpa.com/wp-content/up...ler-Complete-Requested-Recipes-Collection.pdf

 

[bracconiere]

well i added boiling water to my yeast cake...topped up with water, pitched wine yeast....it's active now, i added the yeast around 5pm yesterday, it's 10am day after....

i get a brix of 16.1, and a hydro of 1.065...gives me 8 gallons with the 12lbs of sugar i added, and already at 0.2% ABV, i'll report back tomorrow if it's actually fermenting or not....

 

[Homebrew Harry]

Bro. You left us hangin'

 

[bracconiere]

Bro. You left us hangin'

tell you the truth i couldn't tell for sure if it was fermenting or not, and was for concrete evidence one way or the other....

so i added the boiling water, 7-6-22 (Wednesday of last week) the OG with 12lbs of sugar was ~1.070... first day after, down to 1.060...looking good but the hydro starts creeping up with the active fermentation. so it's tough to know, second day 1.050 or so...subsequent days still 1.050....Sunday, yesterday, i filled a BIG hop bag with a few cups of wheat germ and tossed in hoping for a cold brew...

I'll check it now.

P.S. i should point out this is at 5psi....and if got two days ferment with a weak sugar wash yeast cake maybe it'd work with a nice big beer one?

 

[bracconiere]

@Homebrew Harry damn you just saved my batch! glad you asked, i opened the fermenter up, and that hop bag with wheat germ was floating half way up above the surface! covered in wheat germ stuff....it would have shurely molded by tomorrow if i didn't pull it...

it's down to 1.040 now, and it's a rolling ferment also, not just a fizzy one....so the yeast were kind of a lack luster 1 star nutrient...


(i was going to kinda be creeped out by drinking canibal booze anyway! reminds me 'mad cow disease'. )

 

[Homebrew Harry]

Wheat germ stuff doesn't sound pretty. Glad you caught it.

 

[bracconiere]

Wheat germ stuff doesn't sound pretty. Glad you caught it.

it was still a pure unadulterated virgin, and silky white. but in a day it would have been black, or green....

 

[brewster2012]

Next time I'd invert the sugar by boiling for an hour or so with some citric acid or cream of tartar. As I understand it, this turns the sucrose into glucose and fructose which the yeast have an easier time converting to alcohol.

 

[bracconiere]

well i kinda feel like i'm in a room full of crack heads, trying to think straight...


but as an update, i just dropped a hydro in this again, even though the yeast cake didn't happen and this is now just a cold brew wheat germ wash...

this time i got 1.030-1.040, which crept up to ~1.050....but i decided to double check with my refrac got 11.4 BRIX with a known 12lbs of sugar in an eyeballed 8-9 gallons..

so a corrected gravity of 1.028-1.030....

i haven't given up on the creative reuse of a yeast cake YET, i'll try one more time, (i've heard people swear by it?) but i'll use the refrac for gravity readings instead of a hydrometer next time.

 

[brewster2012]

The refractometer will not read accurately after the yeast start converting the sugar to alcohol.

 

[bracconiere]

The refractometer will not read accurately after the yeast start converting the sugar to alcohol.

well i've been hanging around here for 4 years, and to tell you the truth...before i learned that, and learned that i could use that fact to calculate how much ABV something had not knowing the OG by comparing a hydro reading AND refrac reading....i never even had a refrac because i thought BRIX was only for sissy wine drinkers...

i punched it into a calc for fermenting wort where i knew the OG, AND BRIX...and trusted the calc to be at least a good guess...


and if i knew the hydro reading and BRIX i could solve for OG....pretty cool stuff! (at least so far it's been pretty acurate for me when i double check?)

 

[Homebrew Harry]

When I'm making a batch of whatever, I use both tools and record the differences. I put a little "r" or "h" like you would for exponents in my records. That way I can refer back to notes and just use the refractometer and not even worry about using conversions because of the alc content.

 

[bracconiere]

i'm not sure i get how that works?

 

[Homebrew Harry]

i'm not sure i get how that works?

If I make an identical batch later, I feel comfortable using the refractometer only and know about where it is.

 

[Joe P]

Yes, because potatoes are a big hassle to use. The amount of alcohol that you get for the mess snd volume of potatoes that you use just isn’t worth it. There are distilleries that make excellent potato vodka (which I prefer), mostly in Poland. For a home distiller it would be a major pain in the ass. Check out Jessie on Still It (youtube). He does a run of potato vodka, but mainly shows how to work with potatoes. Flaked corn works great with Barley…the Barley enzymes break down the starches in the corn and bring out the sugars for fermentation. 150-155F for an hour. You could go further with Glucoamylase (follow instructions on packaging, then add more) and Amyloglucosidase to break down unfermentable sugars (polymers and maltrose) 1-3 ml / 5 gallons into fermentable glucose. So I would say that potatoes, for any purpose in brewing need enzymes from either malted grain or supplemented to be worth anything in alcohol production.
As far as using potatoes for a nutrient in hard seltzer, I couldn’t say

 

[Joe P]

TITOS Vodka. ( I think it's spelt correctly) made in Pa from potatoes. Pretty good stuff. I've made my own but sorry the hassle wasn't worth it. Not when Titos went down so smooth. Whiskey, different story as that can be basically conjured to your individual tastes. Caramels, roasts, smoked oak ect. Vodka is pretty straightforward. Non flavored vodka anyway. Try Titos and you might find the convience way more rewarding then then the process. Again, just saying, cheers!

 

[bracconiere]

If I make an identical batch later, I feel comfortable using the refractometer only and know about where it is.

so more an art then science?

 

[Homebrew Harry]

so more an art then science?

If I had to put a label on it, that would take the fun out of it

 

[bracconiere]

If I had to put a label on it, that would take the fun out of it

i suppose for some i like having fun as a 4th grade educated adult trying to figure out all the cool buttons on scientific calculator though....


that way i get the 4th grade reaction of "hey, i'm smart!"