New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[doublebogey10]

I plan on brewing one of these soon, with a combination of Citra, Mosaic and Vic Secret. Never had a beer with Vic Secret but I've heard it's great. I'm using the WeldWerks Juicy Bits recipe as a base and have tweaked it slightly. They use Citra, Mosaic and El Dorado as their hop combo for FWH, then flameout and whirlpool.

...

I think El Dorado is really underrated for this style. I've used it twice, in various combinations and both were terrific.

 

[doublebogey10]

For those who use 1318 how do you get your fg lower than 1.020? I have a hard time getting it to ferment out more than that in the few times I've used it. I do make yeast starters. I want my beer a little dryer than what I've been getting.

I have a Galaxy/Mosaic hazy pale in keg now that finished a 1.012 with 1318. Healthy starter/good aeration at pitching/ferment around 67 and then ramp to 71 or 72 before crashing. 15 days grain to glass.

 

[Hannabrew]

@Rdom I think I found a deal on fermonsters for you!

I have 2 7 gallon Fermonsters and love them.

Any leaking is likely due to overtighening.

The lid issue is slightly annoying but from everything I've read about other PET wide mouth carboys, it's the lesser of all evils. Getting it on is not an issue but getting it off was challenging until I bought a strap wrench and now it's pretty easy.

If you use one I'd highly recommend skipping the airlock in favor of a blow off tube due to the suckback. With the weird weather we get in Chicago in March I was having to fill the airlock every day.

 

[Hannabrew]

Is it normal to get a green floating layer like this? I used to always bag my hops so I'm hoping it's normal when you don't bag em.

This morning I swirled it and it fell. When I got home from work it was back. I just decided to go ahead and cold crash, trying the plastic bag suck back solution.

Also, Im on batch 3 or 4 with my fermonster and I love it. No leaks. No problem tightening it. I did find it almost impossible to get the lid off, but I bought a $5 rubber loop grip thing and have no trouble now. The only negative is that it's thin plastic which makes it hard to carry. You really have to have a brew hauler.

what's the ziplock bag trick? Fill it with CO2 I assume? How is it connected to the bung?

 

[murphyslaw]

what's the ziplock bag trick? Fill it with CO2 I assume? How is it connected to the bung?

That's right. A zip lock full of co2 with a hose coming out of the corner that extend through the bung. Ive never tried it before.

 

[leesmith]

Is it normal to get a green floating layer like this? I used to always bag my hops so I'm hoping it's normal when you don't bag em.

This morning I swirled it and it fell. When I got home from work it was back. I just decided to go ahead and cold crash, trying the plastic bag suck back solution.

Also, Im on batch 3 or 4 with my fermonster and I love it. No leaks. No problem tightening it. I did find it almost impossible to get the lid off, but I bought a $5 rubber loop grip thing and have no trouble now. The only negative is that it's thin plastic which makes it hard to carry. You really have to have a brew hauler.

How many days into the fermentation was this?

 

[Hannabrew]

That's right. A zip lock full of co2 with a hose coming out of the corner that extend through the bung. Ive never tried it before.

How do you get an airtight seal on the hose coming into the ziplock?

 

[murphyslaw]

How many days into the fermentation was this?

14 days.

I'm down to 4*C and it hasn't budged. I just swirled it again to knock it down.

I've noticed this before, but apparently it didn't make it into my normally copious notes and I don't remember which beer or if or when it went away. I suspect it was my first shot at this recipe, which came out great. The current batch is my second with this recipe.

How do you get an airtight seal on the hose coming into the ziplock?

The hose doesn't come through the zipper. I cut a tiny hole in the bottom corner, shoved the hose through it, and then wraped electrical tape around it. It's probably not perfect, but as long as the bag is full of co2, I think the pressure should be outwards, rather than o2 coming in. I think?

I flushed it from the zipper side, then sealed it, then filled it from the tube.

 

[leesmith]

14 days.

I'm down to 4*C and it hasn't budged. I just swirled it again to knock it down.

I've noticed this before, but apparently it didn't make it into my normally copious notes and I don't remember which beer or if or when it went away. I suspect it was my first shot at this recipe, which came out great. The current batch is my second with this recipe.

Weird...usually they drop out after a few days and a couple swirls. And I don't cold crash. Come to think of it, I had a bag of Amarillo pellet hops that didn't like to drop out during dry hopping. When they dissolved there was a lot of plant material instead of more powder. I dry hop differently now but I used to use a fine mesh bag tied over the racking cane to prevent clogs. Worked good.

 

[hezagenius]

Thanks for the picture!, do you prefer the flavor of the blend of pilsner malt or just the pale malt?

It's still got a pretty raw hop flavor so I can't say how it will taste just yet. This is my first time using pilsner malt. I like to give my beers a week or two to settle down in the keg. Before that, the rawness of the hops tends to dominate for me.

 

[murphyslaw]

The lid issue is slightly annoying but from everything I've read about other PET wide mouth carboys, it's the lesser of all evils. Getting it on is not an issue but getting it off was challenging until I bought a strap wrench and now it's pretty easy.

Yes, that's it. A strap wrench. That's what I meant by "rubber loop grip thing"

Weird...usually they drop out after a few days and a couple swirls. And I don't cold crash. Come to think of it, I had a bag of Amarillo pellet hops that didn't like to drop out during dry hopping. When they dissolved there was a lot of plant material instead of more powder. I dry hop differently now but I used to use a fine mesh bag tied over the racking cane to prevent clogs. Worked good.

Yeah, I used to cold crash, then learned about suck back oxidation and stopped for a while. I just end up moving or jostling my kegs often enough that it was starting to bug me that I'd repeatedly have to clear some sludge. This is the first time I've done it in a while.

 

[BennyN]

Thought I'd share this. Just took advantage of a killer deal on some hops that have been talked about quite a bit on this thread. Buy three 8oz packs and get 8 oz of citra free.

http://www.yakimavalleyhops.com/product_p/hopsvarietysuperstar3-8oz.htm

 

[Hannabrew]

Thought I'd share this. Just took advantage of a killer deal on some hops that have been talked about quite a bit on this thread. Buy three 8oz packs and get 8 oz of citra free.

http://www.yakimavalleyhops.com/product_p/hopsvarietysuperstar3-8oz.htm

Between the deals YVH and Label Peelers have been running, my chest freezer is LOADED!

If you buy the 1LB version of that you're paying $1.05/oz...not bad!

 

[plazola86]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1494022647.107173.jpg

Citra,Mosaic,Eureka, third Gen Conan. Best one yet!

 

[curtisbrewer]

just brewed one on saturday that included:

OG 1.070
10 gallon batch
ibu- 80
6.8 srm
7.3 %

2-row- 62%
golden promise-21%
flaked oats-12%
caramel 60 - 3%
honey malt - 2%

edit: not sure if i will get questions about going full 80% 2 row and/or why i added 20% golden promise. golden promise without a doubt creates a richer,maltier, deeper feel to me at a small scale( which just adds a slight edge off setting the pound of hops .. when experimenting i have done equal parts 2row and golden promise without desirable effects.


10 minutes (2 OZ of each)
amarillo
azaaca
centennial

20 min steep:
2 oz citra
2 oz mosaic
1.5 oz azaaca

first dry hop ( 2.5 days in gravity reading at 1.020)
2oz azaaca
2oz citra
1oz mosaic

after sampling it at 1.020 this beer seems extreme in the juicy floral fruity departments, but holds the pine as well. i plan on splitting it, and throwing an additional keg hop in to one of them which will be complicated/crazy with a stupid blend.

will report back with pics / final results.

edit: added slight explanation to the grain bill

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1494023894.598707.jpg

Absolutely unreal , came out very fruity with just the right amount of pine . If anything I would push the late boil additions a little closer to flame out. The batch was split in two and one of kegs received an additional:
.5 simcoe
.5 azaaca
.5 citra
.25 mosaic .

I am very pleased with both , one just being lighter in flavor then the other

 

[stickyfinger]

just did an all-mosaic dryhop. i am very impressed. very resinous and drinkable

 

[WiscoBrewer]

IPA day; using Denali and Vic Secret for sure, the Vic Secret will be whirlpool and dry-Hop only. Any suggestions, I have Cascade, Citra, Galaxy, Mosaic, Nelson, Old Chinook, Simcoe, and Warrior (usually bitter with this)

 

[doublebogey10]

It's still got a pretty raw hop flavor so I can't say how it will taste just yet. This is my first time using pilsner malt. I like to give my beers a week or two to settle down in the keg. Before that, the rawness of the hops tends to dominate for me.

What kind of pilsner malt did you use?

 

[k-daddy]

I had a keg plug up on me once and I never want to deal with that again. I went and bought an inline from fermenter to keg filter that filters down to 100 micron. Less than $20 on vacmotion.com

I'm looking at purchasing a similar filter. It is offered with a smaller mesh (15 micron nominal) size. After cold crashing for several days @ 34 degrees, I push the beer, using Co2 pressure, out of the carboy and in through the liquid post on the keg, being as careful not to submerge the racking cane into the hop sludge. Question, based on your experience with the 100 micron filter, do you think the tighter, 15 micron filter will clog shut with pellet hop material, creating more of a problem with transfer? I'm trying to reduce the pellet hop material that seems to always come through the first couple of pours.

 

[mintyice]

http://www.clearbeerdraughtsystem.com/

These have worked pretty well for me.

 

[plazola86]

I'm looking at purchasing a similar filter. It is offered with a smaller mesh (15 micron nominal) size. After cold crashing for several days @ 34 degrees, I push the beer, using Co2 pressure, out of the carboy and in through the liquid post on the keg, being as careful not to submerge the racking cane into the hop sludge. Question, based on your experience with the 100 micron filter, do you think the tighter, 15 micron filter will clog shut with pellet hop material, creating more of a problem with transfer? I'm trying to reduce the pellet hop material that seems to always come through the first couple of pours.

If you could crash before I don't think you'll have a problem. The bigger pieces should settle down. The 100 micron is plenty small and pretty much filters everything though. I was thinking of getting a smaller micron filter but I think 100 is the perfect size. I have read people lose flavor and aroma the tighter it is but I'm not sure if that's true or not.

 

[JJ900]

Braufessor,
If you are still making these at a frequent enough pace, have you tried changing up ingredients to address the ultimate question, what is the secret to the NEIPA? I see people saying its not the yeast, its not the flaked blah-blah. Maybe remove all the flaked anything in a batch, or keep everything the same but don't dry-hop during active ferment. I guess I am volunteering you or anyone else who feels like they've got the process nailed down, I am still on the way to making it work while bottling.

 

[stickyfinger]

Braufessor,
If you are still making these at a frequent enough pace, have you tried changing up ingredients to address the ultimate question, what is the secret to the NEIPA? I see people saying its not the yeast, its not the flaked blah-blah. Maybe remove all the flaked anything in a batch, or keep everything the same but don't dry-hop during active ferment. I guess I am volunteering you or anyone else who feels like they've got the process nailed down, I am still on the way to making it work while bottling.

i am very confident that flaked grains are not needed at all. i think yeast, maybe pH, and hopping are key. still unsure about pH

 

[WiscoBrewer]

IPA day; using Denali and Vic Secret for sure, the Vic Secret will be whirlpool and dry-Hop only. Any suggestions, I have Cascade, Citra, Galaxy, Mosaic, Nelson, Old Chinook, Simcoe, and Warrior (usually bitter with this)

Ended up with galaxy, Denali, and Citra at 15, 5, and flameout; Vic secret, Denali, and Citra in the whirlpool

 

[WiscoBrewer]

Braufessor,
If you are still making these at a frequent enough pace, have you tried changing up ingredients to address the ultimate question, what is the secret to the NEIPA? I see people saying its not the yeast, its not the flaked blah-blah. Maybe remove all the flaked anything in a batch, or keep everything the same but don't dry-hop during active ferment. I guess I am volunteering you or anyone else who feels like they've got the process nailed down, I am still on the way to making it work while bottling.

I replaced flaked grains with wheat and golden naked oats in this last batch, still doing double dry hop but the first is closer to end of fermentation.

 

[Braufessor]

i am very confident that flaked grains are not needed at all. i think yeast, maybe pH, and hopping are key. still unsure about pH

I agree with this..... I have not really done any real controlled exploration though. For the most part, it would be more of a curiosity for me. I have never "tried" to make these beers cloudy or anything. They just turn out that way.
So, if I asked myself the basic question..... How come I brewed IPA's and Pale Ales for years and years that always came out clear, and these come out cloudy/hazy...... What is different?

*Hops - I think this has a lot to do with it. The varieties, the sheer quantity, the lower temperature hop stand, the dry hop during active fermentation..... all of that is "different" than how I used to make IPA's.

*Flaked grains..... sure..... but, I think I have seen enough testimonial from others who have not used them and still gotten cloudy beers.... so, I am not convinced this is necessary.

*Yeast... Yeah - conan, 1318 are different than what I have maybe used once upon a time. However, I have also used 1056 and 1272 and gotten hazy beers. So, I think Yeast plays a role, but not sure that you have to be that specific with the yeast. I do think 1056 and 1272 will eventually drop a bit clearer than 1318 or Conan.... but, it still takes quite a while and I never get "clear" beer using them in this.
.....I do think the yeast/hop interaction, no matter the yeast, is important.

*Chloride..... Not convinced this is the key. I have used more chloride in these. However, I have also used less as well and gotten cloudy beer.

*pH - I did not really keep track of pH on beers that I brewed 5+ years ago. However, I do think these beers tend to be a touch high on pH. During the boil and post fermentation. I tend to brew these in the 5.4 range and I find that mine finish post ferment at around 4.4-4.6. That is higher than most beers. I can't say that is a key component. But, I have always wondered if it played a role.

If I had to make a guess, I would lean toward it being a complex interaction of hop oils and yeast during fermentation. Maybe at some point I will look at it more closely. But, to be honest, If I am going to test stuff, I probably lean toward testing things that make the beers more or less toward my preference. Things like different water profiles or different yeast, or different hops..... like I said, the "haze" for me has always just been a byproduct. Not so much a goal.

 

[ttuato]

I haven't commented in a while, but have continued to follow the thread and brew a slightly amended recipe of post 1418. I am 15 batches in. I am posting my key learnings just in case it may help someone else.

RECIPE

> Totally agree with Braufessor, 1318 is My least fave yeast. The esters it produces are too over powering. Yes, it results in a "juicy" beer but it also mutes the hop flavor / aromas. Same for WLP644. Current fave is Imperial Organic Barbarian (Conan). Am on fourth gen - Attenuation was 85% last batch, Peach esters are subtle but present - ferm temp of 64 day 1-7, then let it rise to 68 remainder of ferment

> For the people that say Galaxy is too overpowering / dank - the BEST NEIPA by Treehouse (Green) is 80%+ Galaxy....very fruity with little to no dankness...

> Sadly, I am one of the small percentage of folks that can taste onion/garlic in Mosaic so the "primo" hop combo of Citra / Galaxy / Mosaic doesnt work for me...

> In combo with Citra / Galaxy I have tried - Mosiac, Azacca, Amarillo, Simcoe, Centennial, Denali, and Citra/Galaxy 1:1. ----- Nothing comes close to Citra / Denali / Galaxy.....TRY IT. My hop schedule is now 1:1:2 on the two dryhops with the double dose going to the “feature” hops.

> With the upped dry hops I am at ~16oz hops per batch. According to Brewcipher - 1oz of hops = 0.025 gal of loss….do the math 16oz = ~50oz of volume loss. Now that I account for this I am finally getting full 5 gal kegs.

> I adjusted the grain bill to shoot for a ABV to 7%, seems like the best balance of malt hops (considering the extra doses in the dryhops). Also once I upped the hops - the head gained stability


PROCESS

> Dryhopping both rounds in the primary = more drinkable beer in keg with no appreciable loss in flavor / aroma --- assuming drink whole keg in under a month. Plus less risk for oxidation off flavors

> I have been on a "witch hunt" for a "off-flavor" in the recipe - tried everything, finally figured it out today - oxidation in draft lines. Happens literally overnight. Have 8ft lines of the barrier stuff and still get it. I toss the first 2-3 oz of the pour at beginning of nightly session - no more wet cardboard flavor.

> I use Seidel fermentor with a spout mounted to the top as well. I attach a blow off tube to that spout until day 3 (fermentation almost finished). Add dry hop #1 through the top, remove blow off and seal top spout. (This is my first step of avoiding oxygen exposure).

> At day 3 the SG is almost always 1.018-1.020. I don’t bother checking before then.

> Stalled fermentation? - skip all the “tricks” - go straight to amylase powder (NOT Beano). Amylase works every time without fail, takes 5-7 days to work its magic though. I kept getting crappy attenuation with 1318 (60-65%). Amylase got it to 70-75% every time. Since switching to Conan yeast, I haven’t had the need to use this though.

> On day 10 I add dry hop #2. I have a open hose attached to my CO2 tank, set pressure around 10lbs. As I remove the top spout, I place that hose in the top of the fermentor and leave it there as I quickly pour in the hops. (Got this idea from growler filling stations). I reseal the top then attach the hose to the BOTTOM spout open it up and bubble in some CO2 from the bottom to pressurize the fermentor back. (step 2 of avoiding oxygen)

> After two days dry hop # 2, I cold crash at 40 degree. The pressure that was introduced in the previous step stabilizes the air pressure after cooling. .

> To purge keg I fill completely with sanitized water and then pour out entire keg through draft line (simultaneously cleaning draft lines). I do use a lot of CO2 but no oxygen hits my beer. Once the keg “blows”, I detach it from the lines and set it upside down for about 30min to allow the sanitizer foam to settle. I pick it up, leaving it upside down and pull the pressure release valve. This blows all of the remaining sanitizer liquid out of the PRV. I hold open until nothing but gas escapes (step 3 of avoiding oxygen)

> Closed transfer to keg, attach CO2 hose to top spout turn on the gas then open top spout, attach transfer line from bottom spout to “out” line of keg then open bottom spout (step 4 of avoiding oxygen)

EQUIPMENT

> I use the clear draught system and love it. By the time the beer is chilled and carbed up I am pouring “clear” beer from first pint to the last

> I brew with the Grainfather system. I use an aluminum heat wand to warm sparge water and then drop it in the boil to make it more vigorous. I use a large diameter (8&#8221 hop spider. I stuff stainless steel scrubber inside the pump filter because the black stopper always pops off.

 

[Hannabrew]

http://www.clearbeerdraughtsystem.com/

These have worked pretty well for me.

I've thought about getting one of these however I'm concerned about the dead space as it relates to being able to do my normal fill with sanitizer / Purge with CO2 method. I'm worried it will leave too much sanitizer.

Do you have any experience with that?

 

[ttuato]

I've thought about getting one of these however I'm concerned about the dead space as it relates to being able to do my normal fill with sanitizer / Purge with CO2 method. I'm worried it will leave too much sanitizer.

Do you have any experience with that?

Yes I do and here is the solution that I have come up with to get rid of the sanitizer:

> To purge keg I fill completely with sanitized water and then pour out entire keg through draft line (simultaneously cleaning draft lines). I do use a lot of CO2 but no oxygen hits my beer. Once the keg “blows”, I detach it from the lines and set it upside down for about 30min to allow the sanitizer foam to settle. I pick it up, leaving it upside down and pull the pressure release valve. This blows all of the remaining sanitizer liquid out of the PRV. I hold open until nothing but gas escapes (step 3 of avoiding oxygen)

 

[ultravista]

Is 1.020 too sweet for a NEIPA?