New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[stickyfinger]

This Brulosophy on the oats vs no oats mouthfeel exbeeriment has me wondering. maybe i'll ditch my 20% oats next time and see how it goes. i have been noticing that crystal malts seem to contribute to a thick mouthfeel as effectively as oats i think. maybe i'll try pale ale base or 2-row base with a little munich and some light crystal. want to do a 12 gallon batch and do half with citra:mosaic:galaxy again and maybe one that is more of a simcoe:citra or something.

 

[mintyice]

http://brulosophy.com/2016/11/21/the-impact-of-flaked-oats-on-new-england-ipa-exbeeriment-results/

Interesting read...... Further supports what I have thought about the "hazy" factor of these beers..... It is NOT from yeast or flaked grains - but rather from interaction of dry hopping in primary, water chemistry, (and I still think) pH.

I do like that he had started out dismissing these types of beers, but remained open minded enough to play around with them.... eventually discovering that they can be quite good.

I rarely, if ever dry hop during primary and it's still super hazy.

 

[EndOfLine]

http://brulosophy.com/2016/11/21/the-impact-of-flaked-oats-on-new-england-ipa-exbeeriment-results/

Interesting read...... Further supports what I have thought about the "hazy" factor of these beers..... It is NOT from yeast or flaked grains - but rather from interaction of dry hopping in primary, water chemistry, (and I still think) pH.

I do like that he had started out dismissing these types of beers, but remained open minded enough to play around with them.... eventually discovering that they can be quite good.

Marshal also said it was the best ipa he has made! He must be so conflicted haha

 

[stickyfinger]

Marshal also said it was the best ipa he has made! He must be so conflicted haha

yeah, mr. clear-beer! ha ha.

 

[murphyslaw]

yeah, mr. clear-beer! ha ha.

I always wonder if the clear-beer folk shun hefes and other cloudy beer styles or if they just insist on certain styles being clear. If its the later, why not just recognize that these are essentially a different style?

I love listening to denny and drew, but man, every time they bash NE IPA as a style I wonder if they've had any good ones. I've only tried 2, both from tree house, and I just can't imagine someone drinking it and thinking anything other than "hold s*** this is amazing and different and amazing and give me more!"

Hoping to make it to tree house again this week!

 

[EndOfLine]

Recently I entered a British golden ale into a "real ale, cask condition only" event/competition. Because I wanted excellent mouth feel as well as hoppyness, I used the NE pale ale water profile, as well as the keg hop technique during priming.
The result? The beer was a hop bomb, hazy, and got me to the best in show table despite it being super hazy.

Only 2 ounces of hops for dry hop, tasted like I added 6 ounces. I closed transfer every with gas, and was super careful about not oxidizing my beer. I think that is why it was so hoppy.

Also one odd thing. The beer was tropical and juicy... Even tho I used 4 to 1 EKG to Chinook. Not sure where the passion fruit came from... Bio transformation during the priming and keg hopping maybe? The national ranked BJCP judges thought I used citra simcoe.

 

[murphyslaw]

Recently I entered a British golden ale into a "real ale, cask condition only" event/competition. Because I wanted excellent mouth feel as well as hoppyness, I used the NE pale ale water profile, as well as the keg hop technique during priming.
The result? The beer was a hop bomb, hazy, and got me to the best in show table despite it being super hazy.

Only 2 ounces of hops for dry hop, tasted like I added 6 ounces. I closed transfer every with gas, and was super careful about not oxidizing my beer. I think that is why it was so hoppy.

Also one odd thing. The beer was tropical and juicy... Even tho I used 4 to 1 EKG to Chinook. Not sure where the passion fruit came from... Bio transformation during the priming and keg hopping maybe? The national ranked BJCP judges thought I used citra simcoe.

Was it in a cask out front or a keg out back? I must have missed that one--would love to have tried it.

 

[Braufessor]

Recently I entered a British golden ale into a "real ale, cask condition only" event/competition. Because I wanted excellent mouth feel as well as hoppyness, I used the NE pale ale water profile, as well as the keg hop technique during priming.
The result? The beer was a hop bomb, hazy, and got me to the best in show table despite it being super hazy.

Only 2 ounces of hops for dry hop, tasted like I added 6 ounces. I closed transfer every with gas, and was super careful about not oxidizing my beer. I think that is why it was so hoppy.

Also one odd thing. The beer was tropical and juicy... Even tho I used 4 to 1 EKG to Chinook. Not sure where the passion fruit came from... Bio transformation during the priming and keg hopping maybe? The national ranked BJCP judges thought I used citra simcoe.

Wow..... that is really interesting. Beyond brewing NE IPA's like it is my job, my other two favorite areas to dabble are German Lagers (Dortmunder, Helles, Pilsner) and English Session ales like bitters and milds......

I have a beer engine....... I am now super curious about doing a NE IPA version of an EKG type ale..... Conan or 1318 are English yeasts ..... wheels are turning.

 

[stickyfinger]

Wow..... that is really interesting. Beyond brewing NE IPA's like it is my job, my other two favorite areas to dabble are German Lagers (Dortmunder, Helles, Pilsner) and English Session ales like bitters and milds......

I have a beer engine....... I am now super curious about doing a NE IPA version of an EKG type ale..... Conan or 1318 are English yeasts ..... wheels are turning.

what's your favorite bitter recipe? i am craving a good bitter after our trip to England last summer!

 

[EndOfLine]

Was it in a cask out front or a keg out back? I must have missed that one--would love to have tried it.

Hello fellow burp'er! It was in a keg out back with beer engine. It came out in the second wave. The whole keg only lasted an hour before it was all gone.

I am brewing it again now lol

 

[EndOfLine]

Wow..... that is really interesting. Beyond brewing NE IPA's like it is my job, my other two favorite areas to dabble are German Lagers (Dortmunder, Helles, Pilsner) and English Session ales like bitters and milds......

I have a beer engine....... I am now super curious about doing a NE IPA version of an EKG type ale..... Conan or 1318 are English yeasts ..... wheels are turning.

Haha, I have you, and everyone in this thread to thank for the base water/acid/mineral recipe. As well as how to maximize hoppyness with an easy dry hop and closed transfer method. Really, I read every, post, in this thread for inspiration.

In my opinion this thread is not only a great NE pale ale thread, It's a great thread for any hop forward beer.

My English golden ale started with RO water with 3G of gypsum, and 5g of cal cloride.

11lbs of Weyermann pils, 4lbs of Morris otter, and 3% acid malt.
45 min boil.
No hops till 10 min left
10 min: 1 ounce of chinook and ekg
Flame out: 4ounce ekg and 1 ounce of chinook.
Chill asap

Used us 05 funny enough!

Then I used 1 ounce of chinook and ekg for the dry hop, in a dry hop keg. In this beer I primed and dry hopped for 7 days before I cold crashed and closed transferred after 2 days cold. Then I closed transferred again after a week being cold to serve.


One more thing. I have done an IPA with only EKG and Marris otter. It was very tasty, a lot of orange marmalade, honey, and herby notes, with a earthy citrus finish.

 

[Braufessor]

Haha, I have you, and everyone in this thread to thank for the base water/acid/mineral recipe. As well as how to maximize hoppyness with an easy dry hop and closed transfer method. Really, I read every, post, in this thread for inspiration.

In my opinion this thread is not only a great NE pale ale thread, It's a great thread for any hop forward beer.

My English golden ale started with RO water with 3G of gypsum, and 5g of cal cloride.

11lbs of Weyermann pils, 4lbs of Morris otter, and 3% acid malt.
45 min boil.
No hops till 10 min left
10 min: 1 ounce of chinook and ekg
Flame out: 4ounce ekg and 1 ounce of chinook.
Chill asap

Used us 05 funny enough!

Then I used 1 ounce of chinook and ekg for the dry hop, in a dry hop keg. In this beer I primed and dry hopped for 7 days before I cold crashed and closed transferred after 2 days cold. Then I closed transferred again after a week being cold to serve.


One more thing. I have done an IPA with only EKG and Marris otter. It was very tasty, a lot of orange marmalade, honey, and herby notes, with a earthy citrus finish.

Thanks for the recipe ideas.... I was just coming back to ask you some details!

Awesome that you took info in this thread and applied it the way you did. That is a really interesting concept. I am definitely going to Try a version of this. I am envisioning a nice british session pale ale......

I am thinking something like ....

Golden Promise Base.....
In spite of Brulosophy Xbeeriment, I might go with 20% flaked grains/wheat
So, Maybe 80% Promise, 15% Flaked Oats/Barley, 5% Regular Wheat.

Hops all EKG.... All late like you did, dry hop in Primary. Might throw in a bit of a "compliment" hop like you did with the Chinook.... Have to think about that some more.

Debating on yeast at this point. Either 1318 or Conan I am thinking.

Same water strategy that you used.

I am going to put it in two 3 gallon kegs and prime it lightly in the keg and serve it off of my beer engine......

Kind of fired up to try this out.

 

[Braufessor]

what's your favorite bitter recipe? i am craving a good bitter after our trip to England last summer!

I have always based my Bitters off of this recipe from Northern Brewer and always used 1469 yeast (1318 from time to time too).) I generally use all EKG in it though. It is suppose to be a Timothy Taylor Landlord type clone. It is a good, simple bitter. Regularly wins medals in comps I enter it in.
https://www.northernbrewer.com/documentation/allgrain/AG-Innkeeper.pdf

 

[EndOfLine]

Thanks for the recipe ideas.... I was just coming back to ask you some details!

Awesome that you took info in this thread and applied it the way you did. That is a really interesting concept. I am definitely going to Try a version of this. I am envisioning a nice british session pale ale......

I am thinking something like ....

Golden Promise Base.....
In spite of Brulosophy Xbeeriment, I might go with 20% flaked grains/wheat
So, Maybe 80% Promise, 15% Flaked Oats/Barley, 5% Regular Wheat.

Hops all EKG.... All late like you did, dry hop in Primary. Might throw in a bit of a "compliment" hop like you did with the Chinook.... Have to think about that some more.

Debating on yeast at this point. Either 1318 or Conan I am thinking.

Same water strategy that you used.

I am going to put it in two 3 gallon kegs and prime it lightly in the keg and serve it off of my beer engine......

Kind of fired up to try this out.

Glad you are fired up, and happy to give back!

The hop combo I used: mostly EKG with some chinook was nfluenced from this ancient home brew talk thread:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=140192

I know, it like 8 years old...

If you scroll down a bit. A guy who won the GABF with a 48 point (crazy unheard of high score lol) English IPA posted his recipe and later goes on saying that water was a big contributor to his success.

I basically took his hop combo, and NE Pale aled it (new verb?) with info from this thread, and all of the AJ Delange/Martin Brungard Info that I could absorb.

I was going for a more "toasty" "grainy" malt profile, and didn't want any strong malty or caramels flavors.

 

[mintyice]

I have always based my Bitters off of this recipe from Northern Brewer and always used 1469 yeast (1318 from time to time too).) I generally use all EKG in it though. It is suppose to be a Timothy Taylor Landlord type clone. It is a good, simple bitter. Regularly wins medals in comps I enter it in.
https://www.northernbrewer.com/documentation/allgrain/AG-Innkeeper.pdf

Have you used 1469 in a NEIPA? That's my next project.

 

[Braufessor]

Have you used 1469 in a NEIPA? That's my next project.

I have not..... I almost went with that for this English version, but, just put a 1318 in the cart.... it will be here Wednesday. Brewing this on Friday.

One thing I will say about 1469 from using it in bitters.... watch the temps.... I liked to start it at 65-68 for a couple days and let it go to 70-72, but not over that. It can get weird when it gets warm in my opinion.... spicy, belgiany kind of stuff.

 

[Braufessor]

Glad you are fired up, and happy to give back!

The hop combo I used: mostly EKG with some chinook was nfluenced from this ancient home brew talk thread:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=140192

I know, it like 8 years old...

If you scroll down a bit. A guy who won the GABF with a 48 point (crazy unheard of high score lol) English IPA posted his recipe and later goes on saying that water was a big contributor to his success.

The guy who posted that recipe has the most insane home brewery ..... When I saw his name, I recognized it from this thread (dream home brewery for sure): https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=99310

 

[murphyslaw]

Hello fellow burp'er! It was in a keg out back with beer engine. It came out in the second wave. The whole keg only lasted an hour before it was all gone.

I am brewing it again now lol

Nice! I had a Porter out there that scored pretty well. It was my first time at that event and I thought it was really cool

 

[mintyice]

I have not..... I almost went with that for this English version, but, just put a 1318 in the cart.... it will be here Wednesday. Brewing this on Friday.

One thing I will say about 1469 from using it in bitters.... watch the temps.... I liked to start it at 65-68 for a couple days and let it go to 70-72, but not over that. It can get weird when it gets warm in my opinion.... spicy, belgiany kind of stuff.

Same thing with 1318. My latest NEIPA came out a little off because I let the temps get away from me. 1318 at 74F is no good.

 

[EndOfLine]

The guy who posted that recipe has the most insane home brewery ..... When I saw his name, I recognized it from this thread (dream home brewery for sure): https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=99310

Wow....... And I thought I had a good set up.... That brew house is a work of art

 

[stickyfinger]

Dude has a VERY unique spouse no doubt...

 

[beardandbutter]

http://brulosophy.com/2016/11/21/the-impact-of-flaked-oats-on-new-england-ipa-exbeeriment-results/

Interesting read...... Further supports what I have thought about the "hazy" factor of these beers..... It is NOT from yeast or flaked grains - but rather from interaction of dry hopping in primary, water chemistry, (and I still think) pH.

I do like that he had started out dismissing these types of beers, but remained open minded enough to play around with them.... eventually discovering that they can be quite good.

Just tapped a Golden Promise/Citra SMaSH NEIPA. High chloride:sulfate ratio, 1.06 OG, wlp007, 154 degF

.75 oz Citra @ 60 min
1.0 oz Citra @ 10 min
1.0 oz Citra @ 5 min
2.0 oz Citra Whirlpool for 30 min
1.0 oz Citra Prefermentation Dry Hop
2.0 oz Citra Dry Hop after 4 days
3.0 oz Citra Dry Hop after 8 days
cold crash for 3 days

Very happy with how it turned out, but I "feel" like it lacks the smooth mouthfeel as high flaked % beer. As photo shows it is still very hazy, but unlike the times I brewed the recipe in this thread, I can actually see the shadow of my fingers holding the glass.

 

[Duden89]

What did your final gravity end at? I mashed at ~155 on my last batch and used 007, ended about 1.018.

 

[crusader1612]

What about an El-Dorado/Galaxy mix?

 

[hezagenius]

Just tapped a Golden Promise/Citra SMaSH NEIPA. High chloride:sulfate ratio, 1.06 OG, wlp007, 154 degF

.75 oz Citra @ 60 min
1.0 oz Citra @ 10 min
1.0 oz Citra @ 5 min
2.0 oz Citra Whirlpool for 30 min
1.0 oz Citra Prefermentation Dry Hop
2.0 oz Citra Dry Hop after 4 days
3.0 oz Citra Dry Hop after 8 days
cold crash for 3 days

Very happy with how it turned out, but I "feel" like it lacks the smooth mouthfeel as high flaked % beer. As photo shows it is still very hazy, but unlike the times I brewed the recipe in this thread, I can actually see the shadow of my fingers holding the glass.

A fellow central Iowa brewer! Looks good! I'm tapping a NE IPA today and I used WLP007 as well. Going into the keg, I had a ton of haze. I was at 1.010 on Day 6 so I'm thinking my mouthfeel will be a little thin but the color was very nice.

 

[jbedell2]

Curious if anyone has tried the original base recipe with Carapils or Carafoam instead of (or in addition to) oats. I've been jumping back and forth between this thread and the Treehouse Julius thread for a couple weeks, and seems like there is more consistent use of Carapils or foam in the grain bills posted over there.

I've made about 6 batches based closely on the original recipe here, and all are excellent. I've had friends do blind tastings against a few different Treehouse beers, and mine nearly stand up in flavor and aroma. But as I was drinking my most recent batch side-by-side with a Green recently, the mouthfeel is still quite different. There is a silkiness to the Treehouse beers that I'm not getting very close to yet.

Combining that with the recent Brulosophy xbeeriment, I'm wondering if very light crystal malts in larger than normal quantities could contribute.

I just brewed the following grain bill recently, based on a post in the Julius thread. Kegged on Monday - will post back with results in a day or two.

10 lb United Kingdom - Maris Otter Pale 38 3.75 66.7%
2 lb American - White Wheat 40 2.8 13.3%
2 lb German - CaraFoam 37 1.8 13.3%
1 lb Flaked Oats 33 2.2 6.7%

 

[stickyfinger]

Curious if anyone has tried the original base recipe with Carapils or Carafoam instead of (or in addition to) oats. I've been jumping back and forth between this thread and the Treehouse Julius thread for a couple weeks, and seems like there is more consistent use of Carapils or foam in the grain bills posted over there.

I've made about 6 batches based closely on the original recipe here, and all are excellent. I've had friends do blind tastings against a few different Treehouse beers, and mine nearly stand up in flavor and aroma. But as I was drinking my most recent batch side-by-side with a Green recently, the mouthfeel is still quite different. There is a silkiness to the Treehouse beers that I'm not getting very close to yet.

Combining that with the recent Brulosophy xbeeriment, I'm wondering if very light crystal malts in larger than normal quantities could contribute.

I just brewed the following grain bill recently, based on a post in the Julius thread. Kegged on Monday - will post back with results in a day or two.

10 lb United Kingdom - Maris Otter Pale 38 3.75 66.7%
2 lb American - White Wheat 40 2.8 13.3%
2 lb German - CaraFoam 37 1.8 13.3%
1 lb Flaked Oats 33 2.2 6.7%

Very timely post for me. I have been thinking similar things to you. Based upon some IPAs I have been drinking that have carapils and crystal malt in them, I would say they have more body than any of the 20% flaked oats NE IPAs I have brewed. I have two I am tasting side by side now.

My next NE IPA will be 80% base (probably Golden Promise), 10% crystal 10L and 10% carapils. I think it is going to have more body than my oats versions; I hope so at least. It's just a refinement though really, the oats with basemalt version is really great too.

 

[beardandbutter]

Just checked - 1.014

 

[beardandbutter]

From some of his posts, OP is from NE Iowa, so he is able to get a constant flow of Toppling Goliath and pulpit rock, @Braufessor - you able to get some of that double dry hopped psuedo-sue that was announced today? I went up last monday for the first time on a whim and was able to get some king sue, vanilla/cinnamon term oil, and saftig.

Brewing a Citra/Galaxy/Topaz version Saturday - didn't have enough galaxy in my fridge to do a full version and the homebrewstore was out of galaxy... they recommended topaz as a sub

32.2% golden promise
32.2% rahr pale malt
25.3% flaked oats
6.9% crystal 15
3.4% carapils

wyeast 1318

 

[Braufessor]

From some of his posts, OP is from NE Iowa, so he is able to get a constant flow of Toppling Goliath and pulpit rock, @Braufessor - you able to get some of that double dry hopped psuedo-sue that was announced today? I went up last monday for the first time on a whim and was able to get some king sue, vanilla/cinnamon term oil, and saftig.

Brewing a Citra/Galaxy/Topaz version Saturday - didn't have enough galaxy in my fridge to do a full version and the homebrewstore was out of galaxy... they recommended topaz as a sub

32.2% golden promise
32.2% rahr pale malt
25.3% flaked oats
6.9% crystal 15
3.4% carapils

wyeast 1318

Ha.... that is a sad state of affairs when someone from central iowa has to tell me about DDH Sue Been super busy and had not seen that, so glad you mentioned it - will be in Decorah to get some on Friday for sure. I actually like DDH Sue more than King Sue.... all the hops, less of the alcohol. Drink more

But, yes..... I do have a constant flow of Pulpit and TG 10 minutes and I am at either place. Pulpit Rock has been putting out some great stuff.... I am a big fan of Saftig. Loopy Lynn and some of their other DIPA's have been great as well.

Just had a bomber of Pompeii and a bomber of Sue tonight as a matter of fact. Got some King Sue, Sosus and Hop Smack in the fridge as well.