New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA
- Thread starter Braufessor
- Start date
Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
I have been using regular rolled oats, not even "quick" or "minute" ones. I think it works fine. I haven't figured out the exact PPG yet of using rolled oats, but I think it is lower than the 37 for "flaked oats". it will not haze your beer, and it adds a ton of body. They are so cheap when sold that way too.
One thing I am wondering is how to perfectly balance the flaked oats with something like Cara Pils. The rolled oats will add incredible mouthfeel, but they also tend to decrease the head retention for better or worse. Adding Cara Pils can counteract that head-killing effect very nicely; I just know how much to add yet. I have been experimenting with adding 5% rolled oats and 5% Cara Pils in place of 2-row recently to add body and maintain great head retention
I have tried using Rye malt in place of Cara Pils, but it has very definite flavor and "maltiness" that I don't always appreciate, especially in an IPA.
I think the quick oats are just finely shredded rolled oats.
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
On another note, I tried inverting my recent Eureka! IPA keg last night. I felt that it was already losing hoppiness after only a couple days in the keg. I decided to try inverting the serving keg a couple times last night at around 11PM or so. Today at 5:30 I tried the beer, and it is greatly improved! It has a lot more aroma and flavor!
What do you mean by "invert"?
I think he means turning it upside down so the hop and yeast particulate circulate throughout the keg more as opposed to just sinking to the bottom. So like a bottle he flipped it then sat it backdown on the bottom end but that'll throw all the yeast and hops that have settled back into suspended state as opposed to when you let a beer or keg sit and all the hops and yeast settle to the bottom of the keg.
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
Yes, exactly.
This is very interesting to hear. I've had my first attempt at this beer (original posted recipe) in the keg for about a week now, and have noticed a significant drop in aroma and flavor the last few days. I was actually about to make a post asking if anyone else had experienced this. It's also my first time kegging so I wasn't sure if I did something wrong when force carbing. I've also noticed the color has gone from a great hazy yellow to more of a muddy brown.
I'll try inverting tonight to see if this helps. Thanks for the tip.
surgical_ass
Well-Known Member
I too noticed toward the end of the keg that it turned brownish. Please let me know if color and aroma works for you by inverting. Also for anyone who has done this were dryhops in a bag or loose and did the beer stay cloudy from the invert (talking about a beer other than this style since haze is what were shooting for here) Got a pale ale with hops in the keg in a bag that are fading. About two weeks in.
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
I've only done it in a keg that had no dry hop addition and in a keg that had dry hops in the bag. Both will result in much cloudier beer and may or may not improve the flavor.
OP
OP
Mine are almost always gone in 2 weeks........
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
i just flipped another ipa keg. i swear it tastes better again!
Well, I entered this beer in a local competition, and it got a terrible score (25).
A grand master's judge's comment that it was sweet and under attenuated (it finished at 1.012). The hop character was too much like orange juice and one-dimensional. And that the beer was much too hazy and should be allowed to ferment to completion and allowed to clear before racking. He gave it a score of 23.
I don't put a ton of stock in this, as I have the same beers score more than 20 point differences among different competitions - it is subjective in the end. I just find it interesting to get the objective assessment of someone who presumably knows what their doing, but may be tied to an old-school dogma.
A grand master's judge's comment that it was sweet and under attenuated (it finished at 1.012). The hop character was too much like orange juice and one-dimensional. And that the beer was much too hazy and should be allowed to ferment to completion and allowed to clear before racking. He gave it a score of 23.
I don't put a ton of stock in this, as I have the same beers score more than 20 point differences among different competitions - it is subjective in the end. I just find it interesting to get the objective assessment of someone who presumably knows what their doing, but may be tied to an old-school dogma.
surgical_ass
Well-Known Member
I entered my version of this in the nhc. I placed first in the first round of judging. Mine was hazy as it gets but I did not go with the chloride sulfate levels listed here so it did have a good bitterness to it. I entered mine into the white specialty ipa category. I rebrewed for the finals and used a recipe closer to what is here but still with a firmer bitterness. Btw just took a sample and couldn't be happier. The water profile is unlike anything I have ever had.
OP
OP
In fairness - I do think this beer should not do all that well in a BJCP competition if it is entered as either a pale ale or IPA..... I guess, like them or not, the style guidelines are fairly clear and a beer like this is outside of those characteristics. I don't really see it as "dogma" in the context of entering a BJCP competition. I brew a lot of beers for competitions, and when I do, I brew them to specifically hit the guidelines (as that is how they are suppose to be judged). I brew this beer for drinking because it is my favorite type of beer to drink.
As mentioned above, I could see it holding up better in a specialty IPA category.
All that said - a cloudy, one dimensional IPA that tastes like orange juice sounds exactly like something I could drink all day long
Brewing up my first try at this style this weekend.
1.060 OG
160/100 Chloride to Sulfate, mash pH of 5.4
20% mix of flaked wheat and oats
1318
Ounce each of Amarillo/Mosaic/Citra at 0, Steep at 160F, DH, and Keg hop
Anything I'm missing?
1.060 OG
160/100 Chloride to Sulfate, mash pH of 5.4
20% mix of flaked wheat and oats
1318
Ounce each of Amarillo/Mosaic/Citra at 0, Steep at 160F, DH, and Keg hop
Anything I'm missing?
Looks similar to the version I just brewed. I went a little more extreme on the water chemistry, 200ppm Chloride, 50ppm Sulfate. And a little less on the flaked grains, about 15% of the total grist. But other than that, your beer looks pretty close to mine. I used Citra and Amarillo too, but went with Simco instead of Mosaic.
Looks good to me!
Mine has been in the keg for aboutn 2 1/2 weeks now and it's really coming around to be a great beer. I'll post a pic soon.
Dan
surgical_ass
Well-Known Member
planning on doing a 60 min addition?
surgical_ass
Well-Known Member
I think that is a good ibu range for that og. Just brew something similar and used 53 ibu with a 1.064 og. Was happy with the results. This was the second time making this. The first time I did a 60 min addition and then a whirlpool. I thought it lacked a bit of hop flavor. This go around I did a 10 min addition of all 3 hops at a rate of .33 oz for each. Pulled a sample yesterday and was very happy with the results. Just some food for thought.
I also think that's a good plan. In mine, I only went for about 32 IBUs out of my boil additions (a single 60 minute addition of Nugget), then got the rest of my IBUs from the whirlpool. I feel like the beer could do with a little more bitterness. Next time I brew it I'm going to aim for more like 50-60 IBUs from my boil hops (approx 1.067 OG).
Dan
OP
OP
I think the points on increasing bitterness are good - keep in mind, my original recipe is only a 1.050-1.055 type beer. Many people prefer a bigger version (1.06-1.075) of this and upping the bitterness would be very appropriate in that case.
I think I am going to brew a 1.065ish version of this over the weekend..... had a recent version that @olotti sent me of one he brewed and thought it was really outstanding. Inspired me to try a bigger version. I have done 3 batches of my regular version (lower gravity, different hops) over the last 3 weeks..... so, the pipeline should be good and I can throw something else in.
I will up the bitterness when I up the gravity as well.
I think I am going to brew a 1.065ish version of this over the weekend..... had a recent version that @olotti sent me of one he brewed and thought it was really outstanding. Inspired me to try a bigger version. I have done 3 batches of my regular version (lower gravity, different hops) over the last 3 weeks..... so, the pipeline should be good and I can throw something else in.
I will up the bitterness when I up the gravity as well.
LJvermonster
Well-Known Member
Sticky, where do you get your rolled oats from? Grocery store? Have you tried regular quick oats?
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
I just use regular rolled oats from the grocery store. the quaker rolled oats are fine. I never tried quick oats. As far as I have researched, quick oats are just rolled oats that have been cut into smaller pieces. They should work fine too. I just have a 50# sack of rolled oats for making large batches of granola, so I use some from that.
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
I think I'd like to do a version of this with Eureka! and Citra. I'm debating adding in something dank like CTZ or Comet or Summit too. Or, I could go with some Galaxy instead for a tropical bomb. Anyway, is the "Wheat" people refer to in recipes Wheat Malt? I am assuming it is wheat malt and you would say Flaked Wheat if it you were using unmalted wheat, right? I just ordered some honey malt to try. I also just ordered a SS screen for dry hopping in the keg as well as a tube of WY 1318 to try in this. I'm getting excited! I've heard 1318 will not flock out well at all, and that is exactly what I am interested in, along with the fruit notes.
emr25
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2015
- Messages
- 123
- Reaction score
- 89
Anyone used Ella in this recipe or style yet?
We are brewing the OP recipe as is (Citra, Mosaic, Galaxy) for the first time this weekend, but I think we may follow that up with an even split (4 oz each) of Citra, Mosaic, Ella.
We are brewing the OP recipe as is (Citra, Mosaic, Galaxy) for the first time this weekend, but I think we may follow that up with an even split (4 oz each) of Citra, Mosaic, Ella.
OP
OP
Wheat - I use regular weyerman wheat malt. I have also used flaked wheat as well.
I have a pound of Eureka in the freezer I need to use as well. Have not used it before, but had it in a local commercial beer and really liked it. Not sure what the best combo would be..... I like the sound of Citra/Eureka with some columbus in lower levels.
I have a pound of Eureka in the freezer I need to use as well. Have not used it before, but had it in a local commercial beer and really liked it. Not sure what the best combo would be..... I like the sound of Citra/Eureka with some columbus in lower levels.
Brewed up another batch of this yesterday. 50/50 Citra/Mosaic. Came out super green. It was a little darker than my last batch but that could possibly due to not using any sort of filter when draining the kettle. I spent a bunch of time on the last batch draining the kettle through a steel mesh filter.
My last batch with 2:1 Citra/Galaxy came out great so hopefully this does, too.
OG 1.062
Ca 100
Sulfate 100
Cl 180
Mg 12
Na 28
My last batch with 2:1 Citra/Galaxy came out great so hopefully this does, too.
OG 1.062
Ca 100
Sulfate 100
Cl 180
Mg 12
Na 28
Brau - I saw on the Treehouse Julius clone thread someone post a note from Annie Johnson that one of the tricks to the NE Style IPA is to have super soft water and flaked grains (as we know) but the mash pH is in the 4.5-4.8 range. I would think that would lead to a thin beer and very dry. I know you're successful and happy with a 5.4 pH, but have you ever gone this low, or has anyone else tried it?
OP
OP
I have not tried it..... I don't see how that would work at all. In fact, short of dumping a ton of acid in, I don't even know how you would achieve it???
Also, pH will then drop in the boil kettle and further drop in fermentation..... If you START in that range, you are heading for the high 3's by the end of fermentation.
I had scottish ale I brewed a while back that I screwed up on.... my mash pH ended up in the 5.1 range. Post fermentation I was at 4.0....... I could TASTE the acidity. I had to go back and add baking soda to the keg to bring the pH up to 4.3 where the beer tasted good and as it should.
I would also question the idea that this is the "secret" to the NE IPA's that are "all the rage" right now.
I don't know..... I have not done it. Annie Johnson is a truly great brewer. However, this just does not make any sense, on any level to me. I think you would end up with a hoppy "berliner" IPA....
emr25
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2015
- Messages
- 123
- Reaction score
- 89
We brewed the OP recipe yesterday. Our 4th batch overall, 3rd all grain, and first with a full RO water profile as described in the OP.
Our 3rd batch was the Zombie Dust clone and we used the "basic" RO water profile from this thread. It was by far our best batch yet.
Brew day went great, we BIAB in an 8-gallon heavy duty stainless steel kettle. 5 gallons of strike water at 163*, stirred in the grains and closed up at 153*. Wrapped in insulation and Reflectix, stirring at 20, 40, and 60 minutes. Only dropped to 150* with the hot and humid GA weather. Pour over sparged with 3.75 gallons of room temperature RO and added the necessary minerals.
Our pre-boil gravity was 1.045 and our OG ended up at 1.055, which means our efficiency was exactly in line with the recipe! Pitched a decanted 1.2L starter of Vermont DIPA yeast (Conan) last night, getting some bubbles in the blowoff bucket but no krausen so far. Also our first batch using the new chest freezer fermentation chamber with InkBird controller.
Thanks Braufessor for the recipe, hopefully fermentation and the dry hopping goes well, 3 weeks to go until we can taste the final product!
Our 3rd batch was the Zombie Dust clone and we used the "basic" RO water profile from this thread. It was by far our best batch yet.
Brew day went great, we BIAB in an 8-gallon heavy duty stainless steel kettle. 5 gallons of strike water at 163*, stirred in the grains and closed up at 153*. Wrapped in insulation and Reflectix, stirring at 20, 40, and 60 minutes. Only dropped to 150* with the hot and humid GA weather. Pour over sparged with 3.75 gallons of room temperature RO and added the necessary minerals.
Our pre-boil gravity was 1.045 and our OG ended up at 1.055, which means our efficiency was exactly in line with the recipe! Pitched a decanted 1.2L starter of Vermont DIPA yeast (Conan) last night, getting some bubbles in the blowoff bucket but no krausen so far. Also our first batch using the new chest freezer fermentation chamber with InkBird controller.
Thanks Braufessor for the recipe, hopefully fermentation and the dry hopping goes well, 3 weeks to go until we can taste the final product!
OP
OP
Made some changes today..... took the same basic recipe and just made it a bit bigger. 1.068 gravity. Upped the Warrior bitter addition to 1.25 ounces.
Flameout and Whirlpool addition were both:
1.5 ounces Citra
1 ounce Eureka
.5 ounce Columbus.
Going to dry hop with the same hops.... but probably going to taste it first to determine ratios.
Flameout and Whirlpool addition were both:
1.5 ounces Citra
1 ounce Eureka
.5 ounce Columbus.
Going to dry hop with the same hops.... but probably going to taste it first to determine ratios.
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
Oh yeah, baby, looking forward to the results! Ratios look good for a 1st try
Eureka + Columbus is a good combo. I've only used the hop once, but it definitely smelled to be squarely in the "piney" corner with simcoe, chinook, and the like. And citras fruit/citrus flavor is never a bad idea IME
OP
OP
I added a pound of 2 row, and a pound of Golden Promise.
Added 1/2 pound flaked oats and 1/4 pound of wheat and a 1/4 pound of light Simpsons Caramalt (10-15L).
emr25
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2015
- Messages
- 123
- Reaction score
- 89
Great fermentation activity last night after about 24 hours. Ramped the InkBird to 66* yesterday afternoon and 68* this morning. Almost 48 hours from pitching and I'm guessing we'll be nearly finished up on Wednesday night (96 hours from pitching) when I add the first dry hop.
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2015
- Messages
- 935
- Reaction score
- 355
Made my third batch of this yesterday. Fermentation was going strong by 6am this morning.
My second batch came out awesome. Didn't repeat my mistake with doubling the warrior. Tried one yesterday after being in the bottle for 4 days. Not nearly long enough but I wanted to compare to batch #1 while brewing batch #3.
Batch #3 I did with 100% distilled (until my water test/report comes back) and built up to match the profile in the first post. Excited to see how this compares to the first two which were both 50% distilled and 50% carbon filtered tap water.
My second batch came out awesome. Didn't repeat my mistake with doubling the warrior. Tried one yesterday after being in the bottle for 4 days. Not nearly long enough but I wanted to compare to batch #1 while brewing batch #3.
Batch #3 I did with 100% distilled (until my water test/report comes back) and built up to match the profile in the first post. Excited to see how this compares to the first two which were both 50% distilled and 50% carbon filtered tap water.
Took mine off temp control last night. Couldn't get it above 66.5 in the swamp cooler. Krausen is still going after 96 hours. I'm hoping to dry hop in the next day or two. As soon as the krausen drops, I'll take a SG reading and assess from there.
stickyfinger
Well-Known Member
Why such a small blow-off receptacle? I usually just fill my chest freezer full of star san.
