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American IPA "Northeast" style IPA

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Sbe2

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Why not do a single hop of one of those you haven’t used?

30-60 IBU’s at 60

Flameout of a few ounces.

Same with dry hop.
I usually do with a new to me hop, but I kinda want to switch up my mo
 

Sbe2

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I would maybe give you a different recommendation....

Ella is still rather potent. It’s total oil content is higher than Citra. I wouldn’t use it in kettle but definitely in the dry hop.

Not sure if you’ve ever brewed a beer with all Aussie hops but they’re definitely unique and you can actually get away with using slightly less of them cause they’re so powerful. You’ll also want to give the beer a little longer to condition and potentially change how you dry hop IMHO. As has been discussed the Aussie hops are rather high in polyphenols so you’re more likely to get hop burn and the beer will be incredibly hazy.

Personally I’d use mosaic and a bit of Galaxy in the WP and then some blend of Galaxy, Vic Secret, Ella in the dry hop.

In my experience I find that especially Galaxy is more fruity and less dank/onion/ginger at lower DH temps. I get intense passion fruit candy from it around 57/58.

If you do dry hop during active fermentation you are more likely to get the hop burn associated with the high polyphenol content.

If you can condition this beer for longer and at colder temps it will be more enjoyable and really an intense tropical fruit explosion.

If you don’t want to just focus on the Aussie hops I’d go.

Mosaic/Galaxy 3:1 or 4:1 in WP
Galaxy/Citra 1:1 or 1:3 in DH

Maybe mix some Vic Secret in the DH as well. You’ll get some pine from Vic Secret which might add some depth.
I’ve probably used 10 lbs of Galaxy in my brewing life, and tried a pound of Enigma, but all I could get was Jolly Rancher red out of it.

I have a cf5, but still rely on the ambient temp of my basement for fermentation. Temperature control is something that I work around, usually by cold conditioning the keg before serving.

I like your suggestion on Mosaic/Galaxy WP with a blend of the aussies for a DH.
 

ttuato

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Seeking feedback - I have two batches fermenting with IO Kveiking at the moment (44hrs in). One observation of this and my previous experience with Hornidal:

I know the need for lots of yeast nutrient for kveik is well established and I have done that each time I used kveik BUT the first couple of times I used Hornindal I did not use whirlfloc nor did I worry about transferring clear wort to fermentor (per LODO techniques) and those two beers fermented like crazy reach FG in less that 24hrs. The last three batches of Hornindal and these two Kveiking batches I DID use whirlfloc and only transferred clear wort. Each of the Hornindal took 4-5days to reach FG (one batch I added Conan because I thought it was stuck), and now I am 44hrs in with Kveiking, and I still have a few points to go (1.067SG to 1.020 and dropping - target 1.014). As a result of these experiences it occurred to me that these kveik strains were originally used for high OG farmhouse ales - even no boil ales - that likely still have all of the proteins in the wort that would have been removed by whirlfloc / settling. As such, my hypothesis is that one should forgo the "clear wort" mantra of LODO when using kveik yeast strains. Other thoughts?

Side note: For the Kveiking batches - I pitched ~80mil cells per 4.5gal batch. Temp ~95*. The esters during the first 18hrs were true to form tropical / pineapple / guava and that would bowl you over with the aroma. I open fermented the first 18hrs too in order to boost the esters. These esters have subsided a bit now but present now as overripe tropical fruit. Am not sure how it will play out in the final beer though - I will report back. The whirlpool was a hodge podge of NEIPA hops (strata, simcoe, bravo, mosaic, vic secret - am cleaning out my supply before ordering 2019 harvest) - one will be DH with all galaxy, the other with Juicy Bits blend of mosaic, citra, eldorado. I will post back on the review in a week or so after kegging.
Reporting back

Twelve days post brew day. 7 days primary, 5 days cold conditioning in keg. Kieiking is a good NEIPA yeast. Ester profile very similar to 1318 according to my nose / tastebuds, albeit less pronounced than 1318. The most interesting thing for me was the dramatic difference in mouthfeel. The galaxy beer has a mouthfeel similar to the store bought premade chocolate milk in comparison to the Juicy Bits mix which has a mouthfeel to yoohoo. Originally I thought it was as a result of hop creep from the mosaic in Juicy Bits blend but I checked the SG again and both settled 1.017-1.018. Then I took this pic... polyphenols from galaxy gave a boost to protein in solution as seen been the significant differnece in haze

B262C171-728D-4EDD-A8CD-C9E814EE2830.jpeg



Identical / split wort (80 GP, 15 Malted Oats, 5 Chit), whirlpool and yeast - the only difference is the single dryhop added at FG, post soft crash.
 

Dgallo

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Reporting back

Twelve days post brew day. 7 days primary, 5 days cold conditioning in keg. Kieiking is a good NEIPA yeast. Ester profile very similar to 1318 according to my nose / tastebuds, albeit less pronounced than 1318. The most interesting thing for me was the dramatic difference in mouthfeel. The galaxy beer has a mouthfeel similar to the store bought premade chocolate milk in comparison to the Juicy Bits mix which has a mouthfeel to yoohoo. Originally I thought it was as a result of hop creep from the mosaic in Juicy Bits blend but I checked the SG again and both settled 1.017-1.018. Then I took this pic... polyphenols from galaxy gave a boost to protein in solution as seen been the significant differnece in haze

View attachment 643433


Identical / split wort (80 GP, 15 Malted Oats, 5 Chit), whirlpool and yeast - the only difference is the single dryhop added at FG, post soft crash.
Looks greats. What were you mash temps and fermentation temps? I’ve yet to be able to get kviek strain to finish above 1.012
 

ttuato

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Looks greats. What were you mash temps and fermentation temps? I’ve yet to be able to get kviek strain to finish above 1.012
Mash 152* 30min & 162* 30min
Pitch 100*
Ferm 95* 3 days, 85ish (no control) 2 days, 58* 1.5 day, 36* 1day

The galaxy beer is phenomenal.
The Citra, Mosaic, Eldorado is really good but is overshadowed.

Of the big NEIPA hops, Mosaic & Galaxy are the most variable hops for me regarding yeast selection for me. Citra is more consistent regardless of the english / kveik yeast I have used. I would use KK again with galaxy or citra but not mosaic.
 

ttuato

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Mash 152* 30min & 162* 30min
Pitch 100*
Ferm 95* 3 days, 85ish (no control) 2 days, 58* 1.5 day, 36* 1day

Same foe me with Hornindal 1.012-1.013.

The galaxy beer is phenomenal.
The Citra, Mosaic, Eldorado is really good but is overshadowed.

Of the big NEIPA hops, Mosaic & Galaxy are the most variable hops for me regarding yeast selection for me. Citra is more consistent in MEIPAs regardless of the yeast I have used. I would use KK again with galaxy or citra but not mosaic.
 

MrPowers

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NEIPA.jpg
Figured I should add my two cents to this thread.

My most recent NEIPA (or NE Pale Ale if you don't think the OG is high enough):

Water balanced toward sulfate over chloride. Full LoDo hot side.

10 Gallon batch
1.058 OG
1.011 FG
6.16% ABV

83% Fawcett Pearl Malt
10% Weyermann Pale Wheat
3.5% Fawcett CaraMalt
3.5% Flaked Oats

30 min boil

Columbus FWH to 20IBU Calculated
2oz Columbus @ Flameout (35 min whirlpool)
8oz Galaxy Whirlpool (Chilled to 175F, added 1/2 for 30 min and 1/2 for 15 min)

1272 fermented at 67F. Soft crashed to 55ish under pressure. Dumped yeast.

8 oz Galaxy dry hop under pressure and purged headspace. Let stand for a couple of days and then cold crashed under pressure, transferred to kegs, and forced-carbed.

It is easily the best NEIPA I have brewed to date and looked exactly like the picture for the entire 8 weeks it was on tap. No oxidation; no clearing; just doughy malt and bitter, dank, overripe-fruity goodness from the Galaxy.

Along with oxygen management, the soft crash before dry hopping was the key for me to get the character I was looking for in these beers. I would not hesitate to use this recipe as a base to try out different flavor/aroma hop varieties and different base malt varieties.
 

Sbe2

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View attachment 643607 Figured I should add my two cents to this thread.

My most recent NEIPA (or NE Pale Ale if you don't think the OG is high enough):

Water balanced toward sulfate over chloride. Full LoDo hot side.

10 Gallon batch
1.058 OG
1.011 FG
6.16% ABV

83% Fawcett Pearl Malt
10% Weyermann Pale Wheat
3.5% Fawcett CaraMalt
3.5% Flaked Oats

30 min boil

Columbus FWH to 20IBU Calculated
2oz Columbus @ Flameout (35 min whirlpool)
8oz Galaxy Whirlpool (Chilled to 175F, added 1/2 for 30 min and 1/2 for 15 min)

1272 fermented at 67F. Soft crashed to 55ish under pressure. Dumped yeast.

8 oz Galaxy dry hop under pressure and purged headspace. Let stand for a couple of days and then cold crashed under pressure, transferred to kegs, and forced-carbed.

It is easily the best NEIPA I have brewed to date and looked exactly like the picture for the entire 8 weeks it was on tap. No oxidation; no clearing; just doughy malt and bitter, dank, overripe-fruity goodness from the Galaxy.

Along with oxygen management, the soft crash before dry hopping was the key for me to get the character I was looking for in these beers. I would not hesitate to use this recipe as a base to try out different flavor/aroma hop varieties and different base malt varieties.
I’m impressed
 

stickyfinger

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Do you use Pearl Malt a lot? Have you ever had a medicinal or phenolic character from it? I had 2 bags with that character when I tried using it so gave up on it. Maybe it was just the lot or something in my process that made it come out.

did you dry hop at 55ish?

View attachment 643607 Figured I should add my two cents to this thread.
83% Fawcett Pearl Malt
1272 fermented at 67F. Soft crashed to 55ish under pressure. Dumped yeast.
 

MrPowers

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Do you use Pearl Malt a lot? Have you ever had a medicinal or phenolic character from it? I had 2 bags with that character when I tried using it so gave up on it. Maybe it was just the lot or something in my process that made it come out.

did you dry hop at 55ish?
This sack is actually the only Pearl malt i’ve used. The first half of the sack was for a heady clone, the second half was used in this beer. I didn’t get any medicinal or phenolic character at all, in either beer. In the heady clone i didn’t think it gave me much of anything that Rahr 2-Row couldn’t give me, but i’ve tightened up my IPA process since then, so I will have to try it again someday.

In this beer, the Pearl contributed a nice doughy, light baked-bread malt flavor that was perfect for my palette and balanced well with the bitterness level. It was full bodied, without being sweet like golden promise, and finished dry without being too anemic to stand up to the Columbus bittering charge. I’m not sure it’s worth 2x the price of rahr 2-row, but I wouldn’t hesitate to use it again in a low oxygen IPA.

I have a Motueka Bitter on tap and a NEIPA fermenting made with fawcett Optic malt and i’m really liking what i’ve tasted so far from that malt as well. It’s maybe even a little more mild than Pearl. To me it seems slightly toastier and less doughy. It’s very nice in the bitter and I can’t wait to see what it’s like in the NEIPA.

Yes I held at 55F for the duration of the dry hop. I believe it was 48-72 hours.
 

Frieds

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Poured my first pint of this one today, but it’s still a tiny bit undercarbed. Went Super heavy on the oats (33%) and it’s come out a treat. Super juicy and very dangerously smashable for a 7% beer.
 

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View attachment 643617
My latest iteration using Hornindal fermented at 95f.

11 lbs of Golden Promise
3 lbs of Honey (From Bees)

Simcoe and Galaxy

Do you get any honey character from the honey or is it purely for ABV? My girlfriend’s grandfather makes honey and it’s absolutely delicious so I’ve been wanting to try and use it in a beer but I don’t really know how to go about it.
 

cheesebach

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View attachment 643607 Figured I should add my two cents to this thread.

My most recent NEIPA (or NE Pale Ale if you don't think the OG is high enough):

Water balanced toward sulfate over chloride. Full LoDo hot side.

10 Gallon batch
1.058 OG
1.011 FG
6.16% ABV

83% Fawcett Pearl Malt
10% Weyermann Pale Wheat
3.5% Fawcett CaraMalt
3.5% Flaked Oats

30 min boil

Columbus FWH to 20IBU Calculated
2oz Columbus @ Flameout (35 min whirlpool)
8oz Galaxy Whirlpool (Chilled to 175F, added 1/2 for 30 min and 1/2 for 15 min)

1272 fermented at 67F. Soft crashed to 55ish under pressure. Dumped yeast.

8 oz Galaxy dry hop under pressure and purged headspace. Let stand for a couple of days and then cold crashed under pressure, transferred to kegs, and forced-carbed.

It is easily the best NEIPA I have brewed to date and looked exactly like the picture for the entire 8 weeks it was on tap. No oxidation; no clearing; just doughy malt and bitter, dank, overripe-fruity goodness from the Galaxy.

Along with oxygen management, the soft crash before dry hopping was the key for me to get the character I was looking for in these beers. I would not hesitate to use this recipe as a base to try out different flavor/aroma hop varieties and different base malt varieties.
Looks great! Thanks for sharing. Out of curiosity, what is the reason you chose not to go full-LoDo cold side (i.e. spunding or natural carbing)? Is it for convenience (avoiding foaming, fewer transfers needed, etc.)? Or do you have concerns with the way spunding may interact with the dry hop character? Just curious about your experience, since the cold side seems the easier part of the process to implement, but I have also struggled to find a way to spund and dry hop that gives me consistent results.
 

MrPowers

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Looks great! Thanks for sharing. Out of curiosity, what is the reason you chose not to go full-LoDo cold side (i.e. spunding or natural carbing)? Is it for convenience (avoiding foaming, fewer transfers needed, etc.)? Or do you have concerns with the way spunding may interact with the dry hop character? Just curious about your experience, since the cold side seems the easier part of the process to implement, but I have also struggled to find a way to spund and dry hop that gives me consistent results.
Really, it is a combination of several of the things you mentioned. I've tried doing full lodo cold side on a couple of NEIPA's. I ran into issues plugging up keg poppets trying to spund dry hopped beers, so I switched to keg hopping. When I switched to keg hopping I would spund onto bagged keg hops (keg hops being the only dry hops). The longevity of the beers was great and I didn't get any grassiness/polyphenol bite. However, I also wasn't really able to get the intense defined aroma that I was looking for. It always seemed a little muted or muddled. It might be better with loose keg hops and a floating dip tube, but I don't have any kegs set up to do that right now.

I also had some hop drift issues with 1272/conan when I was spunding onto keg hops. I never got diacetyl, but it was really hard to control the carb level and the FG.

The force carbing on this batch was mostly done for consistency (ie. to reduce the number of variables). It really held up better than I expected. I do plan to try natural carbing a batch using CBC-1 and DME at some point, but I haven't had the opportunity yet.
 

stickyfinger

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I'm beginning to wonder if we can get away with force carbonating instead of spunding and still have amazing IPA for several weeks? I've made some killer IPAs that were spunded and some that were force carbonated. It seems that hop flavor dropping to the bottom of the keg is a bigger factor than oxygen in my recent experience. Soft crashing before dry hop can obviate some of the flavor-drop effect I think as well.
 

ihavenonickname

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Im not experienced with spunding myself, but how does using a spunding valve make it “full LODO cold side”? Wouldn’t you still need to open the FV to add dry hops during ferm or use serial keg purges for a keg hop?
Edit. Spund
 
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Iseneye

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Im not experienced with sounding myself, but how does using a spunding valve make it “full LODO cold side”? Wouldn’t you still need to open the FV to add dry hops during ferm or use serial keg purges for a keg hop?
The way I do it is I place hops in my dry keg. Fermenter gas out is hooked up to dry keg so dry keg is continually flushed with co2 from fermentation. Closed transfer to purged dry keg and voila.
 

popquizkid

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The way I do it is I place hops in my dry keg. Fermenter gas out is hooked up to dry keg so dry keg is continually flushed with co2 from fermentation. Closed transfer to purged dry keg and voila.
Curious -- do you put the DH into your dry keg at beginning of primary -- or do you open and add them right before transfer. I always add them right before the beer is transferred in, figuring that any oxygen from opening and adding the hops would not be too detrimental. I figure the spunding the beer is still fermenting so any little residual oxygen will get consumed/scavenged by the active yeast. I have assumed it is better to keep the hops sealed and in my freezer until right before transfer, but have never tried it the other way.
 

Dgallo

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I figure the spunding the beer is still fermenting so any little residual oxygen will get consumed/scavenged by the active yeast.
So this is one of the biggest misconceptions in brewing (I myself misused and understood this prior to having it explained) which is the difference between oxidation and oxygen ingest. Yeast will consume oxygen that has been dissolved into the beer(which is ingest)when they are actively eating. However oxidation occurs when malt and hop compounds are oxidized by contact with oxygen on the surface or that is ingested. So anytime oxygen touches the beer or is ingested in the beer oxidation will occur to some extent(ie opening a lid, transferring without o2 free environment, etc.). Even if the yeast will consume the ingested oxygen, it does not counteract the oxidation that has occurred. So the longer the lag time is before the yeast start eating and the amount of o2 that actually gets will determine the amount of oxidation that occurs.

My point is even though yeast will scrub the o2, the beer will oxidize to some extent if you’re letting o2 in post fermentation. I hope that made sense.
 
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ttuato

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Im not experienced with sounding myself, but how does using a spunding valve make it “full LODO cold side”? Wouldn’t you still need to open the FV to add dry hops during ferm or use serial keg purges for a keg hop?
If you have a TC valve on fermentor, you can add hops via hop cannon. See the jaybird / norcal yeast brink / harvester thread. OR you can use a hop doser similar to this:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/northeast-style-ipa.568046/page-241#post-8659847

I was not able to figure out an alternative without a TC valve other than keg hopping (which I dont care for - even though I have floating diptubes). I have spike Flex+ and use the norcal yeast harvester as a hop gun. If I had the height in my ferm fridge and more cash I would have used the more elegant solution linked above by @kevink
 

Sbe2

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Do you get any honey character from the honey or is it purely for ABV? My girlfriend’s grandfather makes honey and it’s absolutely delicious so I’ve been wanting to try and use it in a beer but I don’t really know how to go about it.
I added the honey for flavor and points. I added it at flame out, and it did something to the beer. The mouthfeel is drier to be expected, but you can still taste a hint of honey. It is subtle behind the hops, but it is there.

My In Laws also produce honey and my FIL asked if I used it in this particular NEIPA because he could taste it.
 

MrPowers

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Im not experienced with spunding myself, but how does using a spunding valve make it “full LODO cold side”? Wouldn’t you still need to open the FV to add dry hops during ferm or use serial keg purges for a keg hop?
Edit. Spund
Add bagged dry hops to spunding keg. Purge keg with fermentation produced CO2 for at least 24 hours. Transfer beer on top of keg hops to spund.
 

Frieds

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I added the honey for flavor and points. I added it at flame out, and it did something to the beer. The mouthfeel is drier to be expected, but you can still taste a hint of honey. It is subtle behind the hops, but it is there.

My In Laws also produce honey and my FIL asked if I used it in this particular NEIPA because he could taste it.
That’s awesome. How much did you add at flame out?

EDIT: Nevwrmind, just re-read you original post properly.
 

VirginiaHops1

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Curious -- do you put the DH into your dry keg at beginning of primary -- or do you open and add them right before transfer. I always add them right before the beer is transferred in, figuring that any oxygen from opening and adding the hops would not be too detrimental. I figure the spunding the beer is still fermenting so any little residual oxygen will get consumed/scavenged by the active yeast. I have assumed it is better to keep the hops sealed and in my freezer until right before transfer, but have never tried it the other way.
I put my dry hops in the dry hop keg at beginning of primary and let it purge the whole time which should remove O2 down to negligible amounts, then close transfer over. I've actually only done this once before with pretty good results and have one going right now using this method. The upside is obviously less O2 exposure, since you never have to break the seal to dry hop. Downside is the hops potentially not being as fresh since they're sitting at ferm temp for 7-8 days and exposed to oxygen for first couple days while dry hop keg is getting purged.

Your method might work well though. How many points are left in fermentation when you transfer over to dry hop? I'm assuming after you add the dry hops but before you transfer over you purge the crap out of the keg with CO2? That won't remove as much O2 as purging through fermentation or water purging(which obviously you can't do with dry hops inside) but it should remove a lot of it and you're hoping the remaining activity helps scrub what you don't get.

One thing I don't like about your method is I like to crash my yeast out before transferring to dry hop, because I feel like I keep more hop flavor in the final beer doing this. You obviously can't do this if you still need them to be active though. I'm still tinkering with my process though and trying to figure out what the "best" methods are for the handful of styles I do.
 

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Am trying open ferment again look, this time with my house yeast - Conan (Barbarian) that I know super well. I wanna see if it enhances the esters. 24hrs in and I have the coolest looking krausen I have ever seen. Never seen "meringue" krausen before when using a blowoff - so fingers crossed something magical is happening.

012A2AF3-7E2A-4497-A935-AB76D9860E4C.jpeg
 

kevink

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I gained some inspiration from @kevink and others and modified the 10 gallon corny I acquired:

View attachment 643997

I was previously "pre purging" my dry hop charge in a mason jar with co2, then hooking up the CO2 when actually opening the keg to dry hop. This streamlines that process big time.
Hell yeah, man! Sweet! It looks like you can fit a good amount of hops in that chamber. A little extra money upfront is totally worth making every batch easier, quicker, and possibly better. What size valve is that, and have you tried it yet? How did the hops dump for you?
 

popquizkid

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Your method might work well though. How many points are left in fermentation when you transfer over to dry hop? I'm assuming after you add the dry hops but before you transfer over you purge the crap out of the keg with CO2? That won't remove as much O2 as purging through fermentation or water purging(which obviously you can't do with dry hops inside) but it should remove a lot of it and you're hoping the remaining activity helps scrub what you don't get.
I water/sanitizer purge, quickly add the dry hops, and then quick purge and vent with CO2. I leave the dry hops in the keg and my beers are peak about 2-3 weeks after packaging. I like tinkering around with different ways of dry hopping these beers.

When I have spunded I try to transfer about .003 - .004 from expected FG. With ales it is really hard to catch it and if I miss it I just let it finish out, prime in the fermenter, wait for activity to start (20 mins) and then transfer it over.
 

popquizkid

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It’s a great hop. I just had two beers from Grimm recently that were heavy Idaho 7 and they were terrific. Also
@marchuk96 just brewed and an Idaho 7 and Idaho gem NEIPA and the amount of true out of the bag hop aroma and flavor profile that can’t from the I7 was amazing. It was pure earth/dank with some citrus and tea notes. With citra and finishing it with Nelson in the dryhop will just give it the fruit forward notes that will make an amazing beer.
I can report that it is fantastic! Thanks for the recommendation. You are right -- the aroma of Idaho 7 coming out of the bag is out of this world. The Nelson, Idaho 7, and Citra played really well together. I was kind of getting tired of the Citra/Mosaic combo (it is great - don't get me wrong, but it has become almost overused in NEIPAs imho), so it was a nice change of pace. Second Idaho 7 beer this year, and I must say it really seems to shine the WP.
 

Andre3000

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Hell yeah, man! Sweet! It looks like you can fit a good amount of hops in that chamber. A little extra money upfront is totally worth making every batch easier, quicker, and possibly better. What size valve is that, and have you tried it yet? How did the hops dump for you?
Possibly better? More like for sure better. It's all 3". I didn't try dumping any hops yet but I really can't see there being an issue with that size with pellet hops given the size / angle. I can't wait to try it. I just need to build a collar for my chamber and I'll be off to the races!
 

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Figure I'll ask this here, too - what is it about these that makes them so much more sensitive to oxygen than other beers that they can't be bottled? I'm mostly asking so I don't make that mistake with other beers I brew until I get a kegging setup. :)
 

Dgallo

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Figure I'll ask this here, too - what is it about these that makes them so much more sensitive to oxygen than other beers that they can't be bottled? I'm mostly asking so I don't make that mistake with other beers I brew until I get a kegging setup. :)
The simple answer.... polyphenols and hop compounds. Both grains and hops contain polyphenols and they themselves can easily oxidize. In this style, the sheer amount of hops added are greatly increasing the amount of polyphenols is the final product which increase oxidation risk. Also the Hop compounds themselves are highly susceptible and oxidize easily. So the combination of that and the levels of both in this style is why.
 

Obese Chess

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The simple answer.... polyphenols and hop compounds. Both grains and hops contain polyphenols and they themselves can easily oxidize. In this style, the sheer amount of hops added are greatly increasing the amount of polyphenols is the final product which increase oxidation risk. Also the Hop compounds themselves are highly susceptible and oxidize easily. So the combination of that and the levels of both in this style is why.
Got it. So throwing an ounce or so of dry hops into, say, a SMaSH wouldn't be a big deal, but once you get into, like, "six ounces of dry hops into wort from a 15-pound grain bill," that's when it starts to get messy. Do I have that right?
 

VirginiaHops1

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If you believe Scott Janish(or rather believe the data he mines from studies), which a lot of people around here do, then manganese plays a huge role in oxidation. It is not removed during the brewing processes like some other heavy metals. Hops contain manganese, at various levels depending on the hop varietal. And flaked grains contain a lot more than malted grains.
 

couchsending

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This “style” of beer is defined by hop intensity. The first thing to go when beer is exposed to excessive amounts of oxygen is Hop aroma, and flavor.

When IPA used to be defined by bitterness slight oxidation wasn’t as big of an issue. IPAs used to be loaded with hops at the beginning of the process. Now they’re loaded at the end of the process.

Plane and simple.

Any beer will benefit from reduced oxygen exposure but since these beers are dependent on the first thing to go when O2 is introduced it’s just more blatantly obvious.
 
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If you believe Scott Janish(or rather believe the data he mines from studies), which a lot of people around here do, then manganese plays a huge role in oxidation. It is not removed during the brewing processes like some other heavy metals. Hops contain manganese, at various levels depending on the hop varietal. And flaked grains contain a lot more than malted grains.
That's interesting. I've heard several times people talking about oxidized NEIPAs turning almost purple. In its most oxidized state (permanganate) manganese has a very strong purple color. Though I don't know what levels would be needed to produce a noticeable color in beer.
 

Dgallo

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Got it. So throwing an ounce or so of dry hops into, say, a SMaSH wouldn't be a big deal, but once you get into, like, "six ounces of dry hops into wort from a 15-pound grain bill," that's when it starts to get messy. Do I have that right?
Yes and no. If you brewed the same 15lb grainbill for two beers, one used a total of 6oz of hops and one used 12oz, the 12oz beer would have a greater potential to oxidize, however if you improve your anti o2 practices you’ll be fine with either. I would say it’s very important to improve on than than worrying about how to limit your ingredients to limit your o2 pick up
 

Obese Chess

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Okay so - naturally it's worth limiting oxygen exposure anyway, it's just that the more hops you add, and the later in the process you add them, the more obvious and unpleasant any oxygenation will be?
 
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