Non-proportional effects of scaling recipes

[dude1]

I'm wondering what are the most likely effects of scaling a beer recipe with a factor of, say 2.5x more, without using a software such as BeerSmith.

Are there typical non-proportional effects when simply multiplying every ingredient by the multiplying factor?

Thanks

 

[day_trippr]

I can't think of any ingredient that wouldn't scale properly.
otoh, I'd expect scaling would bring out equipment issues (limitations) at some point...

Cheers!

 

[hezagenius]

Hop utilization does not scale linearly. You get more bang for your buck per ounce as you scale up. Conversely, you lose when you scale down.

 

[Iseneye]

Your mash losses and kettle losses generally won't scale if you are using the same equipment. Say you have 0.5 gallon dead space in your mash tun with a 5 gallon mash you will still lose 0.5 gallon with a 10 gallon mash, not allowing for additional grain absorption.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

For those that use recipe software to scale, do any of them explain what (and why) the software does?

 

[Jag75]

So if I make a 5 gallon batch one day . Then i want to brew 1 barrel of the same brew i just multiply it by 6 correct except for hops you say ?

 

[lump42]

For those that use recipe software to scale, do any of them explain what (and why) the software does?

Brewer's Friend scales ingredients linearly. The only estimated parameter that changes is the calculated IBU, but the change from a but going from 2.5gal to 10 gal changed the calculated IBU from 22.44 to 20.87. Even if the calculations are correct, that's not a perceptual change.

 

[lump42]

So if I make a 5 gallon batch one day . Then i want to brew 1 barrel of the same brew i just multiply it by 6 correct except for hops you say ?

You'd have to account for equipment changes as well at those scales. But if the 5 gal brewhouse and the 1 barrel brewhouse had the same proportional system loses and efficiencies, I would think that yes it would scale linearly.

 

[Jag75]

Reason I've thought of that is I helped someone brew a barrel. It was an Irish Red I believe and I thought he wasnt using enough grain . In my recipe at 5 gallons compared to his 30 gallons I would have used about 70 #'s he used 30 #'s.

 

[lump42]

Reason I've thought of that is I helped someone brew a barrel. It was an Irish Red I believe and I thought he wasnt using enough grain . In my recipe at 5 gallons compared to his 30 gallons I would have used about 70 #'s he used 30 #'s.

I'm not sure that's right. Most base grains have a yield extract between 35-40 ppg. That means 30lbs of base malt has 1050-1200 points per gallon. In a 1 US barrel (31.5gal) batch, the total potential gravity is between 1.033-1.038

My math shown in case I've messed up. It's been a few years since I ready Palmer's book.
30lbs *37ppg=1110 gravity point / 31.5 gal = 35 points = 1.035 specific gravity

 

[Jag75]

So I would be right 30 #'s of grain for 1 barrel is not enough and produce a thin beer . Is this correct?

 

[lump42]

So I would be right 30 #'s of grain for 1 barrel is not enough .

Depends on his goal, it would be on the low end of the BJCP style guideline if he used 30 lbs of grain. He may not have been following BJCP style guides at all (I often don't). Unless he has a market for sub-4% beer, he may have added more than you realized? Most craft beer I've seen rarely dips below 5%. I was told because they don't sell as well .

 

[CascadesBrewer]

Are there typical non-proportional effects when simply multiplying every ingredient by the multiplying factor?

My view is that moving from a 5 gal system to a 20 gal system has the same issues as moving from one 5 gal system (say a BIAB in a 10 gal kettle) to another 5 gal system (say a RIMS system). The equipment and process differences will have a much larger impact on the beer than the size. I do a mix of 2.5 gal and 5 gal BIAB batches, and the only thing I worry about changing is water do to different boil off rates...I tend to get a few points lower efficiency with the 2.5 gal batches too.