Next Brew Yeast Question

[Weezknight]

Okay for my next brew I'm going to be doing a Biere de Garde. Ideally I would like to use the Trappist Yeast from Wyeast and ferment it in the warmer end of the range.

However in the winter "ideal" is not going to work, since I don't think I can maintain the warmer temps for long enough to get what I want out of the yeast.

What does anyone think about maybe using a lager yeast and fermenting it at ale temps? Will this work the same way? Or should I hold on this recipe and brew something else?

 

[mithion]

I don't know how warm you keep your house, but here's a little tip. If you keep your house at 65F (which is a pretty average temperature), and let your beer ferment at ambient temperature, the beer itself will be nearly 10F above ambient. Fermentation is an exothermic process and releases quite a bit of heat. Those belgian yeasts will give you the nice funky profile your looking for at 75F. I do not advise using lager yeast (except maybe for the california lager strand) at temperatures above 60 degrees. They will most likely be downright nasty.

 

[Weezknight]

Well we keep the house at 62 in the winter, and this will be fermenting in the basement. The ambient temp in the basement this time of year is about 58-60. I then use an aquarium heater in a tub of water to keep the fermenter warm, but at full tilt it still only gets the water around the bucket to about 66-68.

Do you think that will be warm enough to get the flavors I want from the Trappist yeast?

 

[maida7]

You can not make authentic belgian ale without belgian ale yeast. I'd use the trappist yeast and see what happens. Start cool and gradualy increase the temp. Idealy it would finish in the 70's but even if it never gets that warm it will still be way better then if you had used a lager yeast.

I made a dubble recently that fermented at 68 and it was awesome.

 

[mithion]

From what I understand, belgian yeasts will throw off more flavors than other yeasts at similar temperatures. Now you said you plan on using "trappist yeast" so I'm assuming you're planning on using the Wyeast 3787? If so, Wyeast claims the yeast is good to ferment down to 64F. If you can keep it around 66-68, you should get a beautiful belgian beer. From my personal taste and experience, I brewed a triple with this yeast before and ended up fermenting around 78F. I thought the beer tasted like vomit. I think you're better off fermenting in the 65 to 70 range.

 

[KellyK]

No offense intended, but why are you using Trappist and fermenting warm for a Biere de Garde? Biere de Garde has a charactistic flavor that is quite different from the pear/apple esters thrown by most belgian yeast at higher (75+) temperatures. For example, Wyeast 3725 is Biere de Garde yeast. It's one of their premium collection yeasts and isn't always available. Standard Beligan Strong Ale yeast can work for a biere de garde as you're looking for a well attenuating yeast. As you can see in the BJCP guides, BDGs use either lager yeast or belgian ale yeast fermented at cooler temperatures (low 60s) with periods of cold conditioning after fermentation. BDGs are designed to have a rounder, richer, malt focused profile rather than the typical "belgian esters" associated with saisons, tripels, dubels, etc.

Cheers, and happy brewing.

 

[Brew-boy]

I just made one with the new White lab WLP072 French ale which is supposed to be from a Biere de Garde brewery. Brewing classic Styles has the European Ale yeast listed as the one to use.

 

[Weezknight]

No offense intended, but why are you using Trappist and fermenting warm for a Biere de Garde? Biere de Garde has a charactistic flavor that is quite different from the pear/apple esters thrown by most belgian yeast at higher (75+) temperatures. For example, Wyeast 3725 is Biere de Garde yeast. It's one of their premium collection yeasts and isn't always available. Standard Beligan Strong Ale yeast can work for a biere de garde as you're looking for a well attenuating yeast. As you can see in the BJCP guides, BDGs use either lager yeast or belgian ale yeast fermented at cooler temperatures (low 60s) with periods of cold conditioning after fermentation. BDGs are designed to have a rounder, richer, malt focused profile rather than the typical "belgian esters" associated with saisons, tripels, dubels, etc.

Cheers, and happy brewing.

I'm glad you pointed this out, so no offense taken. I'm trying to remember where I read it, but I had done some googling and came across an article on brewing BDG's and said to ferment warmer.

At the time I put the recipe together I was using the Wyeast website for suggestions, and that's where i got the Trappist from.

Thanks for the tips, though. Makes it seem like I will be able to do this at the temps I have right now.

 

[WickedLB]

Weezknight,

Have you made this beer yet? I just picked up WLP072 at my LHBS to brew a Biere de Garde next month. I was curious about your recipe, fermenting and conditioning timeline, and anything you noted from early samples.