Need some legal advice...

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Cathedral

Cathedral

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So heres my quandary:

My neighbors are trash. Absolute trash. There are a bunch of kids who run around all hours of the day, totally unsupervised. They yard is always full of garbage that blows into my yard. But you know what? I can deal with that. I can ignore the kids. I can pick up the trash. There is one thing that I can't deal with:

Someone in the house pisses out the top floor window. Everyday. Down the side of the house.

I live in a somewhat dense neighborhood. My driveway is right next to my house, just barely big enough for my truck, and then the next house is right there. The pisser pisses inbetween our houses.

I can't even pull my truck up fully because it will get pissed on.

The worst part? When it gets warm, the smell of ****ing piss will waft everywhere. I can't even enjoy sitting on my back porch due to the aroma of piss.

I have security cameras all around my house, but unfortunately the phantom pisser doesn't make himself obvious, otherwise I know I would have grounds for public lewdness or something related. As it stands, I can't figure out how to go about this to get it to stop. I'm thinking maybe notifying child protective services? What do you guys suggest?
 
cluckk said:
Get a lawyer. The only legal advice any non-lawyer should ever give.
Click to expand...

You need a lawyer if you're going to sue, get sued, or get charged with something. I think a lawyer would laugh at you if you brought this to them, and rightly. But they'd charge you for it.

Here's some advice: Put a note in their mailbox that says "Hi, stop pissing from your upstairs window, it smells like piss and it's gross."
 
fearwig said:
You need a lawyer if you're going to sue, get sued, or get charged with something. I think a lawyer would laugh at you if you brought this to them, and rightly. But they'd charge you for it.

Here's some advice: Put a note in their mailbox that says "Hi, stop pissing from your upstairs window, it smells like piss and it's gross."
Click to expand...

I think you could actually get in trouble by putting a non mailed note/letter in their mailbox.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100723205519AAc2vHj
 
fearwig said:
You need a lawyer if you're going to sue, get sued, or get charged with something. I think a lawyer would laugh at you if you brought this to them, and rightly. But they'd charge you for it.

Here's some advice: Put a note in their mailbox that says "Hi, stop pissing from your upstairs window, it smells like piss and it's gross."
Click to expand...

I agree with the lawyer part. As far as I can tell, I don't even know if this is against the law. To be clear, I'm just looking for suggestions or advice of something to do, not a definitive legal course of action. Homebrewtalk would not be my first stop if I was looking for a step by step procedure. I just want to know what you guys would do.
 
Cathedral said:
I agree with the lawyer part. As far as I can tell, I don't even know if this is against the law. To be clear, I'm just looking for suggestions or advice of something to do, not a definitive legal course of action. Homebrewtalk would not be my first stop if I was looking for a step by step procedure. I just want to know what you guys would do.
Click to expand...

I agree with others I would call the non emergency number of your local pd and try there first. If that doesn't work maybe contact your township/ city council. Health department maybe an option as well.
 
Aha! Found something:

Section 8.04.060 part F of the Toledo municipal code defines odor noticable at the property line as a nuisance, and thus violates city ordinance.

That might be my go-to line right there.

EDIT: derp! That was for Toledo, Oregon. Boy do I feel dumb.

But then I did find this for MY city:

SECTION 12. Disposal of house slops. No person shall discharge or permit to be discharged urine, fecal matter, contents of a chemical commode, kitchen wastes, laundry wastes, slop sink drainage, or other household wastes, onto the surface of the ground or into a street, road, alley, open excavation, abandoned well or cistern, storm water sewer, land drain, ditch, watercourse, or body of water. Such wastes shall be deposited or discharged into a sanitary sewer or an approved sewage disposal system.
 
Alright already, I'll stop peering out the window !!! Sheesh - I was just trying to save those twelve steps to the turlet :)
 
Before spending $$ on a lawyer, check out a few things. 1. Call the city and ask what their standards are for enforcing their nuisance ordinances. This varies widely by jurisdiction, but maybe some of the neighbors' shenanigans will rise to the level of "public nuisance." 2. Call child protective services and inform them that you have reason to believe that the neighbor's house may be unsanitary/unfit for those children, etc.

Third option: you can always move.
 
Next time you see it going down, launch a bottle rocket!! No way they use that side of the house ever again.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
 
Maybe redirect your camera? I mean, the dude (well most likely it's a dude, but a chick pissing out a window might be kinda hot, if she's really good looking.....in a trashy sorta way.....no, nevermind, I didn't say......or think that), couldn't be that sneaky that you can't capture a stream of piss flying out a window???? Mybe you need better cameras?????
 
#1 Document, date, time and concern. keep records, pictures etc. If you have neighbor hood policing, talk to them. ask "what if" questions. Are any other neighbors affected or have expressed concerns, if so have them document also. Or you can alwasy do the Justin Bieber thing an degg their house.
 
Looks like you found the code you need to file a complaint. If you do file one, it seems likely that they will know it was you. And, if they truly are trashy, I would say the likelihood of retaliation is high. That said, you should try talking to the parents (although I can understand if you don't want to do that or already have a bad relationship).

Before you do anything (talk to them or call the cops or both) make sure you have your cameras pointed where you need them and good lighting to protect your stuff, especially near the doors and your truck.
 
By the way, I do recommend the personal approach or police over the child services route unless you suspect some abuse other than trashiness, that probably does border on vicious and is the sort of thing that may encourage your redneck friend to stick you like uh payg.

Prolly it's a kid doing the pissing, for starters.
 
Getting a lawyer won't really do you any good if he/she is not pissing on your property. There is no damage, hence, no claim. I would contact the PD and tell them your neighbor is urinating out the window and ask them to follow up. If it still occures then I would contact child services and tell them about the deplorable living situation the children are living in, being forced to pee outside.
 
passedpawn said:
Call the police, report it. The cops might knock on the door, and the problem might go away. Of course, there is the chance of retaliation/escalation; the perp might start launching #2's at your truck.

What you don't want to do is join the craziness with some crazy of your own. That never ends well.
Click to expand...

there goes my Hormel Chili, heavy whipping cream, and ExLax idea...
 
Take a crap on his porch! Then tell him you didn't think he would mind seeing as how he didn't use the toilet either! :D

Or shoot him in the junk with a paint ball gun every time the stream starts, after all how would he complain? :D
 
I was on my hometown city council for many many years. You want this to stop? First thing is to log a complaint with the police department...and then talk to your city council elected official. If their yard is in bad shape...most city ordinances will be enforced only AFTER an official complaint. If you do not get resolve...go to another official. That is why they are there...I trust you will then see action.
 
OK now, aren't we the same group who had a multipage thread celebrating the joys of whizzing off the back porch?

Heck, there's probably someone on this site saying "Dang, I live in Toledo and whizz out the window, was I wrong to do that?"

but more to the point, since the OP hasn't seen the actual whizzing, is it possible that it could be a very consistent dog?
 
Rhumbline said:
OK now, aren't we the same group who had a multipage thread celebrating the joys of whizzing off the back porch?

Heck, there's probably someone on this site saying "Dang, I live in Toledo and whizz out the window, was I wrong to do that?"

but more to the point, since the OP hasn't seen the actual whizzing, is it possible that it could be a very consistent dog?
Click to expand...

Minor detail is that this is pissing basically onto the neighbors yard / driveway / truck, and not into lawn.
If it was off the back, and only hit lawn that would absorb it, the only problem would be either more grass to mow, or burnt / dead patches of lawn, depending on frequency of the deposits.
 
bb guns are really accurate these days. if he does it every night id get a bb gun and lose a little sleep. whats he gonna report ( um yea officer i was pissin out my window and my nieghbor shot me) prove it was me
 
This is why I'm so glad I live in the county. I would not survive if I was surrounded by the types the OP is describing. I would take matters into my own hands and end up being the one taken away in the cruiser.

I hope he beats this. I would lose my crap real quick if I was him and saw some punk peeing on my truck and onto my property, especially if I had to smell it and it was a regular occurrence.
 
littletommy said:
Maybe redirect your camera? I mean, the dude (well most likely it's a dude, but a chick pissing out a window might be kinda hot, if she's really good looking.....in a trashy sorta way.....no, nevermind, I didn't say......or think that), couldn't be that sneaky that you can't capture a stream of piss flying out a window???? Mybe you need better cameras?????
Click to expand...

That opens up way to many possibilities of backfire. I'm not sure about any legalities of pointing a camera directly at someones house to record hours of video; and if the phantom whizzer is a minor that I happen to catch on a camera that I purposely pointed at a house... well, you can see why I don't want to even go there.



blizzard said:
Looks like you found the code you need to file a complaint. If you do file one, it seems likely that they will know it was you. And, if they truly are trashy, I would say the likelihood of retaliation is high. That said, you should try talking to the parents (although I can understand if you don't want to do that or already have a bad relationship).

Before you do anything (talk to them or call the cops or both) make sure you have your cameras pointed where you need them and good lighting to protect your stuff, especially near the doors and your truck.
Click to expand...

This is a sad truth. As I said before, all the kids are pretty much unsupervised, so I don't expect any enforcement from just the parent. That's why I want to have all my ducks in a row so I can have a solid, legal foundation if anything escalates.

fearwig said:
By the way, I do recommend the personal approach or police over the child services route unless you suspect some abuse other than trashiness, that probably does border on vicious and is the sort of thing that may encourage your redneck friend to stick you like uh payg.

Prolly it's a kid doing the pissing, for starters.
Click to expand...

I agree, CSB would be my last line of defense.

Espkelly said:
Getting a lawyer won't really do you any good if he/she is not pissing on your property. There is no damage, hence, no claim. I would contact the PD and tell them your neighbor is urinating out the window and ask them to follow up. If it still occures then I would contact child services and tell them about the deplorable living situation the children are living in, being forced to pee outside.
Click to expand...

I couldn't claim they are being forced to pee outside; for all I know it's just some kid who thinks he's found a clever way to avoid having to leave his room. Since I have never seen the parent walk anywhere outside of his house aside from going from the front door to his van, I'm sure he's unaware of it.

Rhumbline said:
OK now, aren't we the same group who had a multipage thread celebrating the joys of whizzing off the back porch?

Heck, there's probably someone on this site saying "Dang, I live in Toledo and whizz out the window, was I wrong to do that?"

but more to the point, since the OP hasn't seen the actual whizzing, is it possible that it could be a very consistent dog?
Click to expand...

Peeing out of a third floor window, in the middle of winter, requires more skill than any dog I'm aware of possess (like being able to open a window.) Regardless, even if it were a dog, it would still violate code.

Chadwick said:
This is why I'm so glad I live in the county. I would not survive if I was surrounded by the types the OP is describing. I would take matters into my own hands and end up being the one taken away in the cruiser.

I hope he beats this. I would lose my crap real quick if I was him and saw some punk peeing on my truck and onto my property, especially if I had to smell it and it was a regular occurrence.
Click to expand...

I'm trying to avoid a knee-jerk reaction that would lead to more trouble than it's worth.

This is a problem that has been happening for a while. At first I thought it was a dog--I know they have dogs, even though I've never seen them being let outside or taken for a walk, but I've heard them bark. It kept happening, and the "spot" on the ground would be fresh every couple days. I assumed they were letting the dog out of the basement window to piss. However, as time went by and it kept happening, a residue trail has built up on the side of the house, and it leads directly up from the spot to the third floor window. It has also spread on the side of the house, what from the phantom pisser pissing in the wind.

So the problem is not only odorous and unsanitary, but a physical blight.

I'm pretty sure I've researched enough information now to start a complaint and make sure something gets done.
 
I think the best way to start would be to go next door & inform the head of household about the problem. Could be it's 1 of the kids doing the pissing & the parents are unaware of it. Ask that whoever it is stop it. Be polite, but make clear that it needs to stop; it's hardly an unreasonable request & most times resolving problems without involving the police or legal system is cheap, quick & easy.

If that doesn't work, then you have to decide whether you will go the legal route, starting with the police, or whether you will take matters into your own hands. Urine is considered a bio-hazard, and pissing out the window is dumping raw sewage. If you go the legal route, document everything; especially make sure you get the perp in the act on video, with time & date stamp. If you decide to do something else, don't admit to it. But I do like the paintball idea. ;)
Regards, GF.
 
I generally advise to not get into pissing matches (sorry, couldn't help myself) with morons. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.
 
Look - of course pissing out the window is illegal. It's a nuisance and, if it's getting on your property, it's a trespass and they could be enjoined from further trespassing.

But applying the law and getting tickets, injunctions, etc. is not always the best solution. I agree with Passedpawn above. Go to the law, and they'll start launching #2s or worse.

Just talk to them. Say that someone pisses out the window and it gets on your truck. It could be one of the kids, and mom will holler at them. It could be the husband, and mom will holler at him. He could be really embarrassed and stop. Or start pissing out the other side of the house. But telling them what's up is the first step, IMHO.
 
JonM said:
Look - of course pissing out the window is illegal. It's a nuisance and, if it's getting on your property, it's a trespass and they could be enjoined from further trespassing.

But applying the law and getting tickets, injunctions, etc. is not always the best solution. I agree with Passedpawn above. Go to the law, and they'll start launching #2s or worse.

Just talk to them. Say that someone pisses out the window and it gets on your truck. It could be one of the kids, and mom will holler at them. It could be the husband, and mom will holler at him. He could be really embarrassed and stop. Or start pissing out the other side of the house. But telling them what's up is the first step, IMHO.
Click to expand...


You're right, of course, that is my intention. But I'm cynical of most people nowadays, especially people who would think this is ok in the first place. Now that I know there can be legal ramifications, if I tell him to stop and he doesn't, I know the next step. In my younger days I would have told him to stop, and if he didn't, I would have punched him in the balls next time I saw him. But that ain't the world we live in anymore.
 
I feel your pain. There is a group of kids in my neighborhood who are lawless little heathens that think my yard (and stuff) is an extension of their own, and their parents are too lazy/busy to do anything about it. My only advice is document and report. Don't retaliate, as you open yourself up for legal trouble, and don't say or print anything that could be taken as a threat.

The biggest problem I've had in my dealings is that the police can't/won't do much if they aren't caught in the act. Whenever something happened, I discovered it several hours after the fact. The first time I had something vandalized, I spent half an hour trying to track down the culprit. Each kid pointed their finger at whomever wasn't present, so I delivered an ultimatum to everyone that the next time something happened, I wasn't going to bother playing whodunit; I was calling the cops and they would sort it out. Sure enough, I had more trouble only a few weeks later. The location of the damage made it pretty obvious which house it came from, but when I called the police, they said that since I didn't see it happen, they could only deliver a warning, and the family could not be held responsible for replacing the damaged item.

Of course, as you've already mentioned, your situation has a much bigger legal gray area when it comes to catching proof of the deed being done.
 
Confucius say "better to be pissed off, than pissed on"

You might want to speak with other neighbors, Possibly they are aware of other situations with your neighbors, thus giving you and them more ammunition to take to the police/neighborhood standards/CPS.

Are they renters? If so start making things difficult for the landlord as well.
 
I was kind of kidding about the dog, but I'll agree that your first course of action should be to speak to someone in the house about it. I think that's just the reasonable thing and if it doesn't work then you'll be able to say you gave them the chance to avoid further unpleasantness.

I'm the type who figures that if someone is doing something that gets under my skin, they probably don't realize it or it isn't intentional. I'd bet this is kids and that the parents don't know it's going on.

If you do mention it to them and nothing is done I'd talk to them again and then I'd have to decide whether it was worth escalating it to involve the authorities or landlord if they're renters.

This is what's worked for me on the few occasions that I've had issues with my neighbors or coworkers.
 

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