My semi walkin 5000 btu fermentation chamber

[n240sxguy]

Lots simpler. I will only have to make or break one contact then.

 

[limulus]

I always keep a spare STC-1000. For the $19 Amazon price, it made sense for me to buy spares. I even found a guy on ebay selling extra probes and these have metal tips instead of plastic. I have two of those, but have not tried them yet.

As far as crash cooling, I use our garage fridge for that. My wife allows me a little space in there for that. When I built my fermentation cabinet, I originally planned a wall inside splitting it in half. I have double doors so it would work. One side would be cold crash or lager temp and the other side for ales. I was going to use two STC-100s. One would control the A/C on the coldest side and the other would control a bilge blower that would be mounted to the separating wall which would turn on and blow cool air into the ale side when needed. The separating wall would be two pieces of plywood or OSB or something similar sandwiching a piece of foam. My only fear is that this may overwork the A/C unit. I would also lose fermentation capacity. It holds 6 fermenters now, but I will probably never have that many going at once.

The same could be done for yours, just in a vertical layout instead of horizontal. You could use one door or change it to two.

My layout:

 

[n240sxguy]

I always keep a spare STC-1000. For the $19 Amazon price, it made sense for me to buy spares. I even found a guy on ebay selling extra probes and these have metal tips instead of plastic. I have two of those, but have not tried them yet.

As far as crash cooling, I use our garage fridge for that. My wife allows me a little space in there for that. When I built my fermentation cabinet, I originally planned a wall inside splitting it in half. I have double doors so it would work. One side would be cold crash or lager temp and the other side for ales. I was going to use two STC-100s. One would control the A/C on the coldest side and the other would control a bilge blower that would be mounted to the separating wall which would turn on and blow cool air into the ale side when needed. The separating wall would be two pieces of plywood or OSB or something similar sandwiching a piece of foam. My only fear is that this may overwork the A/C unit. I would also lose fermentation capacity. It holds 6 fermenters now, but I will probably never have that many going at once.

The same could be done for yours, just in a vertical layout instead of horizontal. You could use one door or change it to two.

My layout:

I don't think it would overwork the A/C to do that. The volume to be cooled would be half what you have now. I have a keezer I can put carboys in to lager if the need ever arises. I would like to make a bock eventually. I should probably try a real one first to make sure I like it as much as the more commercial ones I've tried. Not sure if there is a difference. I just bought a STC-1000 for $17.99 on amazon. Every time I buy a controller it's less. I paid around $30 for the one on my chamber, $22 for my keezer, now this one is even less. Free prime 2 day shipping to boot. You find all sizes of thermocouples on Amazon cheap too. I paid $6 for the one in my chamber. It's 4" stainless.

 

[bleme]

All the room in the world won't help you if you can't get it down to cold crashing temps. And if you ever find an old fridge on Craigslist that's still under warranty, let us know, will ya?

Cold crashing is nice, but totally no necessary, and pretty pointless if you are kegging.

 

[trbig]

Cold crashing is nice, but totally no necessary, and pretty pointless if you are kegging.

He was the one saying he wanted it to get to the 30's. I just guessed that was why. Plus, cold crashing sure helps to clear things up and get settled out BEFORE kegging or bottling. (Or getting rid of the "rhino farts" in ciders) You don't think it's necessary, some think it's critical for the final product. So who's right?

 

[n240sxguy]

He was the one saying he wanted it to get to the 30's. I just guessed that was why. Plus, cold crashing sure helps to clear things up and get settled out BEFORE kegging or bottling. (Or getting rid of the "rhino farts" in ciders) You don't think it's necessary, some think it's critical for the final product. So who's right?

I don't know that I've ever successfully done a cold crash, or know that what I did had any effect. I dropped the temp in my old fridge for the last batch before it died, but I wouldn't swear it did any good. It was the only one I've kegged without filtering, and it was pretty clear. Just want to have the capability to do so if I want.

 

[limulus]

I keg almost all my beer and I also cold crash every batch before kegging. It really clarifies the final product. The only beer I have not cold crashed in the last two years was a bottle conditioned barleywine that has been excellent and will be brewed again this year. However, this year, I'm going to keg 2.5 gallons and bottle the rest.

 

[bleme]

He was the one saying he wanted it to get to the 30's. I just guessed that was why. Plus, cold crashing sure helps to clear things up and get settled out BEFORE kegging or bottling. (Or getting rid of the "rhino farts" in ciders) You don't think it's necessary, some think it's critical for the final product. So who's right?

The guy who is right is the one making the beer that he drinks. Putting down the OP because he didn't go with a fridge to suit YOUR process is downright rude.

 

[n240sxguy]

Alright, here's the update. I got my relay order cancelled, my STC-1000 ordered, and in the meantime discovered that if I back my A/C off of the max setting, it doesn't seem to freeze up. I think 7 is the highest setting. I backed it off to around 3. Came back an hour later and it was getting warmer. Turned it to 4. Came back an hour later. Still getting warmer. Turn it to 5. Come back an hour later, and it's sitting comfortably back at 62 with the A/C off. I set it to 61 a few minutes ago. I'll see how it's doing in the morning.

 

[trbig]

The guy who is right is the one making the beer that he drinks. Putting down the OP because he didn't go with a fridge to suit YOUR process is downright rude.

LOL.. Could you please post where I've put anyone down? Asking questions about something and why they did something is putting someone down? My point was exactly as yours is. Whoever is doing the making and drinking is correct.. meaning they are both right. You don't think cold crashing is absolutely necessary. Fine and good. Works for you, right? So should I be offended by you inadvertantly putting others down if they do? Isn't it rude to assume the way YOU brew should be good for all and that everyone should deem cold crashing unneeded as you do? Is it rude to simply think otherwise or state something that has worked for them? Others think it's absolutely necessary. Fine for them, right? *Insert smiley face again?*

As I stated, I thought he was wanting this chamber to get into the 30's so he could cold crash in there, so I asked why he didn't just get a fridge for that, which was answered. Then you go off topic to state your opinion and say that cold crashing isn't even needed, but I'm the rude one if I state anyone else's opinion if it's contrary. Mmkay. Got it.

To anyone finding my posts rude, I truly apologize. I thought the LOL's and smilies would be an indication of my intent, but things get lost in writing. Again, I'm sorry, and I'll refrain from any further posts here to avoid confusion. Cheers, and good drinking to you all.

 

[bleme]

LOL.. Could you please post where I've put anyone down? Asking questions about something and why they did something is putting someone down?

I took the tone of your post to be condescending. After quickly reading several of your other posts on other threads, I see that isn't your MO and I'm sorry for the misunderstanding.

It can be quite frustrating to be a pioneer on this forum. There are always people putting you down for not brewing the same way they do. I can get a bit touchy.

 

[PLOVE]

I opted to put an off delay relay on the A/C's internal fan to run it after the temp controller turns off the compressor. I figure running it for a couple minutes would move more air than a computer fan running constantly. By the time any temp stratification occurs the A/C will probably be kicked back on. That's all speculation at this point. I'm gonna try to measure some temps in the next few days.

I built a nearly identical ferm chamber with an a/c unit, but ended up just switching the outlet with an SSR, and shorting the thermocouple to keep it running below 50. It works fine, and definitely can cool below 35, but the coils do appear to freeze. I suspect this is happening because the whole unit is shutting down and there is no air movement. How did you bypass the compressor and fan separately? Is this obvious from the wiring inside? Maybe a constantly running computer fan would solve my problem. . .

 

[n240sxguy]

I built a nearly identical ferm chamber with an a/c unit, but ended up just switching the outlet with an SSR, and shorting the thermocouple to keep it running below 50. It works fine, and definitely can cool below 35, but the coils do appear to freeze. I suspect this is happening because the whole unit is shutting down and there is no air movement. How did you bypass the compressor and fan separately? Is this obvious from the wiring inside? Maybe a constantly running computer fan would solve my problem. . .

I would say yours is freezing before it shuts down. The fan keeps pulling moisture across the coils while its running; making a big block of ice. That's what I've been running into. I switch the outlet to power the A/C like you do. I spliced into the high speed wire for the fan, ran it to be the trigger for the off delay relay, ran a hot wire to the input of the relay, and ran a wire back to the other side of where I spliced into the fan wire to provide the power for the fan. A little difficult to see what I did in these pics, but maybe.
















The wire I spliced is coming out of the high/low/ high cool/low cool switch. The piece of extension cord hanging above the outlet is the wire to the relay and back. The piece of cord going to the outlet is the power for the always on outlet. I broke the little tab on the side of the outlet so I could switch one. The single black wire is the switched power for the A/C.

As far as computer fans go, I'm kinda on the fence. I'm thinking about getting a couple, but not sure where I should put them. I'm gonna take the cover off the A/C so I can have maximum airflow over the coils. I've thought about putting them in front of the coils. My concerns were which way to face them. Blowing toward the coils may keep them from frosting up. Blowing away would keep air circulating, but would fight the A/C fan. I think my best option would be to mount them on the back side of the shelf blowing down. I'm also thinking about adding a deflector to flow the air over my fermenter so it's not blowing right on it. I have the louvers turned toward the upper back, but some air still hits the fermenter directly. May not be a big issue though.

 

[TechMiller]

I know this won't help you or anyone right now, but maybe next year this will be a helpful Temp Controller!

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/new-temperature-controller-brewbit-417306/

 

[n240sxguy]

That is very cool. I would love to have something like that. I could never make myself pay for it though. Guess I'm stuck in the old ages of just going and looking at my chamber to adjust it.

 

[Yretsof]

Just a suggestion, if you end up having a problem with drastically different temps from top to bottom, you could use a computer fan at the bottom, connected to a piece of PVC (3 or 4") as ducting to pump the cold air up to the top of the chamber.

 

[n240sxguy]

Just a suggestion, if you end up having a problem with drastically different temps from top to bottom, you could use a computer fan at the bottom, connected to a piece of PVC (3 or 4") as ducting to pump the cold air up to the top of the chamber.

I will take that under advisement. I've been pondering the fan setup I want to use.

 

[limulus]

Just a suggestion, if you end up having a problem with drastically different temps from top to bottom, you could use a computer fan at the bottom, connected to a piece of PVC (3 or 4") as ducting to pump the cold air up to the top of the chamber.

That is what I did in my coffin keezer.

 

[PLOVE]

I would say yours is freezing before it shuts down. The fan keeps pulling moisture across the coils while its running; making a big block of ice.

Appreciate the thoughtful response and pics. So, in your estimation is running the fan after the compressor turns-off effectively "melting" any ice build-up off of the coils? I'm starting to see why you had made a comment about tilting the A/C unit to drain water. In my system I'm using a BCS to monitor temps (wort and air), and turn on heat (lightbulb) and cooling (A/C) as needed. This perhaps gives me two options: (1) by pass fan and run continually. Only turn on/off compressor. Or (2), bite the bullet, by another SSR and independently control fan and compressor. I can regulate timing easily enough on the software side.

Guess I have a little more thinking to do. Fortunately, I'm currently only fermenting ales in the mid-60's. A/C comes on occasionally, but the insulation and placement of my fermenter in the garage minimizes need for cooling.

Thanks again. . .
P

 

[n240sxguy]

Appreciate the thoughtful response and pics. So, in your estimation is running the fan after the compressor turns-off effectively "melting" any ice build-up off of the coils? I'm starting to see why you had made a comment about tilting the A/C unit to drain water. In my system I'm using a BCS to monitor temps (wort and air), and turn on heat (lightbulb) and cooling (A/C) as needed. This perhaps gives me two options: (1) by pass fan and run continually. Only turn on/off compressor. Or (2), bite the bullet, by another SSR and independently control fan and compressor. I can regulate timing easily enough on the software side.

Guess I have a little more thinking to do. Fortunately, I'm currently only fermenting ales in the mid-60's. A/C comes on occasionally, but the insulation and placement of my fermenter in the garage minimizes need for cooling.

Thanks again. . .
P

I figured using the internal fan would give you the maximum cooling from the coils after the compressor kicked off. As long as the coils don't actually freeze solid, it should defrost them.

You could control the fan with a cheap ice cube relay. No need for a solid state unless you find them cheap.

 

[n240sxguy]

Alright everybody, drumroll please.




Cymbals crash. Da da da da.

Here's the ghetto, half done, gotta do this before I go to work this morning version. It is mostly done. Just need to cut a hole to mount it. I took the front cover off the A/C, spread a couple fins, and put the sensor in there. It was super easy to wire. Sensor in, power in, disconnect out put from original controller, and wire this one in that circuit. Seemed to be working pretty well for the 10 minutes I had to watch it. I had the door open checking on it, so it was too warm for it to really frost up. I set it at .5 C, differential 3 C, and timer for 6 minutes. That should give it enough time to thaw out if it does freeze up. Gotta wait til the rest of the house wakes up now so someone can go check on it for me.

 

[n240sxguy]

It was holding at 55 at 8am with the A/C shut off, and no frozen coils. I may have finally tamed this beast. When I get my batch out of there I'll see how low she'll really go.

 

[limulus]

Sounds interesting. I have to read through this again to figure out what you've done. If it allows you to go below 40F, then you've figured out a way to make your own CoolBot for probably $200 less.

 

[n240sxguy]

Sounds interesting. I have to read through this again to figure out what you've done. If it allows you to go below 40F, then you've figured out a way to make your own CoolBot for probably $200 less.

It basically does exactly what a coolbot does. The only difference is how it controls it. It cycles power to the unit vs tweaking the factory sensor. I don't know if it would work as well without the time delay keeping the fan blowing. I do admire the compactness and simplicity of the coolbot though. I'm not trying to take anything away from it as a product. Also, my way wouldn't work with a larger digital A/C since they wouldn't just fire back up when you reapplied power.

 

[Cape Brewing]

One tip for anyone else thinking about doing this... use a vapor barrier. Wrapping the entire thing (between the studs and sheeting) with 6MM plastic will save you a ton of headaches on frosting up.

Mine (in my gallery) has kept a steady 41 degrees for years. I use mine as storage for my serving kegs and run my draft lines from it.

Vapor barrier is a huge, huge help. To finish mine off, I simply wired the A/C unit to a PID (like in this thread) but then wired the fan to run 24/7. It circulates the air int he walk-in so I don't get any variation in levels, it instantly defrosts the coils if I happen to get a little frost, and those fans draw nothing in terms of power so it's not like my electric bill is sky high.

 

[n240sxguy]

That's a good idea about the vapor barrier. The only reason I didn't use that is the foam sheets I used are impervious to moisture, and the seams are taped. The bottom doesn't have that, so I may coat it with something. It would only take one wire nut to run my fan 24/7. I wasn't sure how long the motor would stand up to that, and I didn't want to have to replace the A/C because the manufacturer use a cheap motor and it burnt out.

 

[Cape Brewing]

my last A/C unit... which... I'm not joking, was at least 11-12 years old when I hooked it up, ran 24/7 for about three years. I finally replaced it with a new model (fan was still running the day I disconnected it) and my new one has been running a solid year straight.

I used the same foam sheets... I would still do the vapor barrier.

 

[n240sxguy]

Good to know they can last that long. I hope the new ones are as well built as the old ones. I've been curious about the cfm rating of an A/C fan. I haven't seen any numbers to compare with a computer fan. I know it's nowhere close, but I'd like to know none the less. I think one or two computer fans would move enough air to keep the temp constant. I also wonder if it's better on the fan to be running nonstop vs switching on and off.

Better to over prepare than under prepare with the vapor barrier. My sheets are glued to the studs so too late for mine.

 

[n240sxguy]

Got the box tidied up a bit this morning.













It was sitting at 42 before I shut it off to work on it. I set it to 35, so I'll see how far it will drop it by the time I get home this evening. I hated the wire nuts I had in there, so I got a terminal strip from RadioShack; and put spades on all the wires. Much better connection in my opinion. I didn't attach the relay socket because I ran out of time. I may attach it this evening.

 

[Yretsof]

Thats a good looking setup. Nice job. Do you have controls or refrigeration experience or are you just going by the seat of your pants? I would like to do a ferm chamber like this, but a bit larger. Maybe an 8' cube or 8x12. I am not a big lager guy so I wouldnt need to get it down to the temps you are taking it too.