My HLT project

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Bobby_M-I hope the guy is good. Man, I have seen some horrible Rhino and Line-X jobs as if it was their first time on the gun. I've also seen some amazing jobs.

He seems to do good work. I explained how much work I put into it and what I expected. He just smiled and told me I would be more than happy. I don't have much to tape off on the tuns anyway. The tops, of course, will be stainless and he will run the wired-edge tape right at the top skirt weld-line. The only other things are the power cord and the Ranco/ball valve. I told him I wanted the Ranco taped right below the front cover so I could get into it if needed in the future. Everything else that I need a hole for will be drilled and cut out later. I taped over the bottom coupler in my MT so a utility knife will take care of that and the sight glass hole as well.

Bobby_M-What do you suppose the max temp for that stuff is before it starts emitting noxious fumes?

I am not sure, but I will ask. I assume you don't want it that close to a heat source or open flame. It is reinforced with Kevlar so it is really tough. Their site says, "Professionally installed by an authorized LINE-X Dealer, the surface dries in 3 to 5 seconds...the total job including masking and spraying, only takes about 2 to 3 hours. Your truck is ready immediately, but wait 24 hours for rugged use." I was worried about the heat messing with the insulation, so I taped it all up. Then I was worried about the 3M adhesive releasing during the shoot. Both problems I was told won't be an issue, so it sounds like it goes on and just hardens real quick as it is cooling in the 3-5 seconds. It says, "LINE-X is environmentally friendly; no hazards like V.O.C.'s or C.F.C.'s, and it's solvent free."

You guys can check out their website.

Killian-How did you decide on the size of the element to use ?
Well, it chose me, lol. It is the only thing on my brewery that came from Home Depot. You can read my rant thread about HD, but needless to say I had to argue with the guy to show me where they were. They did not have 120V elements or horizontal mountable ones either so I went with a 240V 5500W. I told the guy I was going to run it at 120V for less wattage (1375W) and he told me it wouldn't even turn on, lol. So, this element isn't beefy at all and that is ok for my application.

I plan on using constant circulation via a small fan stirring the water and my good insulation to heat the HLT water as fast as possible. After a true test I will determine if if is fast enough to work with my "topping off" during the mash and sparge (I really need a larger HLT). If it doesn't work fast enough, I will simply incorporate my kettle for initial fast heating and then transfer to the HLT where the element and ETC will keep me at constant temperature. I am really optimistic though that I shouldn't need any extra heat source and I will be able to refill after dough-in and get to temperature before infusions. We will see and I will write down all my info once I run these tests.
 
Is there any chance you can run yourself a 220v line from the panel so you can use the full wattage?

The reason I asked about the max temp is that although I wouldn't think so apply direct flame, it seems like a nice way to seal in whichever style of insulation one may wrap around a keg.
 
That would be a lot more trouble for my setup. I wanted everything on 110V so I wouldn't have to rewire the house to use my system. 220V would definitely be a beefy setup and would get me to temperature very fast, but GFI and the electrician for wiring up 220V would make this very expensive for something I simply want to keep water at a constant temperature. If I need more heating power I will use my boil kettle and keep everything else easy on 110V. I am planning to wire up my stand so I plug it into a wall and plug all these gadgets into the stand. Actually, does anyone know how that would work out. Would I need a couple of different supply lines providing power to the stand or would one work? I am thinking the HLT element and the MT mash mixer (ice cream motor) wouldn't overpower a wall outlet, but I have no idea.
 
Electricity is one of those things that tends to make my head hurt for some reason. But I think you'll be fine so long as you are pulling less than what the breaker is rated for on that circuit. So if you have a 15amp breaker and everything on that circuit pulls less than the 15amps, your ok. If you have a bunch of stuff on it though, it will likely trip your circuit or gfi if one is on the circuit.
 
General rule is to have a maximum load of 80% of the rated circuit. So if you have a 20Amp breaker on that circuit Dont put more than 16 amps of load on it. I think you will be fine. you're pullin roughly 10 amps on the heater element and I cant imagine your mixer being more than an amp or 2.

My rig will have a dedicated 240 on the 4500W boil element and that I am tapping from my water heater. The rest of the system is going on a 110v 20 amp circuit, with the MLT pulling about 9 amps off of it with my March Pumps.
 
wortmonger said:
Would I need a couple of different supply lines providing power to the stand or would one work? I am thinking the HLT element and the MT mash mixer (ice cream motor) wouldn't overpower a wall outlet, but I have no idea.

Circuits are usually either 15 or 20 amps. If your outlet is on its own circuit (which is definitely preferable for something like this that's going to be drawing a lot of current), then:

1375 watts for the heating element. The maximum load you want to put on a circuit is 80% of its rated load, so 1440 watts for a 15 amp, 1920 watts for a 20 amp. A 15 amp circuit would only leave an additional 65 watt allowance for your motor, or on a 20 amp circuit you would have a 545 watt allowance for the motor.

Conclusion: it depends on your wiring and motor.
 
How far away from the main panel is your brew station going to be? If it's in the same area and you have a couple free breaker slots, it's quite a no brainer to me. If you're gonna go electric anyway, why not make it an all in one operation (heat and maintain). 5500 watts on 240 is 22ish amps. All it would take is a run of 10/2 romex and a 30amp breaker.

If you have this element on 110v and you know for a fact that the circuit you use isn't shared with much more than a few lightbulbs, I think you'll be OK. If SWMBO plugs a curling iron or hair dryer in at the same time, fuggetaboutit.
 
Brew station right now is in the garage right next to the panel, actually on the other side of the wall inside the house from my location. I'm going to wait to do anything 220V until I absolutely have to. I feel like this will accomplish my brewery system plans especially with the steam infuser I am making for step mashes and the ability to pre-heat water in my kettle.
 
You've got me on pins and needles with anticipation. I've been looking for a good excuse to buy some kegs.

Don't keep us hangin'...
 
I know, I know..... take what you're feeling and multiply it by 100. :D That is what I am feeling right this second. I wish the guy would call me and tell me to come pick them up. As soon as I get them back and run the temperature test I will post new pictures and other relevant information.
 
Well, I pick them up today from the liner place and then I have to test and post. :D Sorry it has taken so long, but I can't wait more than you can't wait. :p Keep checking in, a little later today I should have pictures up and more information.
 
wortmonger said:
Well, I pick them up today from the liner place and then I have to test and post. :D Sorry it has taken so long, but I can't wait more than you can't wait. :p Keep checking in, a little later today I should have pictures up and more information.
:ban: :ban:
 
wortmonger said:
Ok, I decided not to take any more pictures of before and surprise everyone that has been watching a little bit.

I have been so excited and have posted way too many unfinished pictures of this project. I went with a little more design on my HLT than just the waves. Also, the color choice has changed once again from all the other changes made, lol. I am so excited the guy was just busy and really did want to do the project.

I called Friday and he said he could squeeze me in sometime this week, but to go ahead and drop them off on Monday so he could at least get them taped up and ready for a break from all the cars and trucks he was doing. He talked to me for about a half hour about brewing and other stuff relative to the project and was rather impressed. He said this project definitely makes it into their picture book for corporate, so it may make it to their website, lol. I told him how this is the biggest project I have done in a while and how long it has taken me to this point all for something I could have just replaced with a frickin picnic cooler and the same valves, lol. He assured me that he would make sure this is an admirable project when finished on his end and to not worry about a thing......so we wait!

Hope you guys are having as much fun following this as I am doing it. I love to follow Yuri and others threads on builds and stuff here at HBT. Seems everyone has the same type of wanting to share and man do I get some great ideas from all you members, so thank you HBTer's. Both of these tuns are beautified in your honor, so I have to make them look good :D Ok, maybe tun dedications are a little over the top (he he), but I really do appreciate all the information I have gathered from this forum. I will always keep this new brewery, even as a pilot brewery if I go larger one day. Anyways, I hope to have these tuns back quickly and I will post immediately with pictures so you guys can ask away. :rockin:

Hey there crazy, when are you writing a friggin book? You have some pretty good ideas, and I like the way you document everything.

Is there a place where you got this idea originally? Care to state your source? I think that would be a good thing for noobs like me to read so we can get a little more background on what's going on here.

Can't wait to see how everything turns out! :ban:
 
Well, I'm pissed. I was told yesterday that they were being shot and would be ready today. They are not ready today:mad: I went there and they swore they would be shot today and ready tomorrow for pickup. It kinda was a blessing as my house paperwork came in the mail today and I had to get it signed and notarized before 4:00.

My mother also came into town today and the house is a mess from her baby crib project. I swear guys (Bobby_M) :) that I will post the pics and then test so you can see them as soon as I have them. This is driving me nuts, but at least my house selling is done and the stress from that is over. So......the waiting continues.

TheGAC, I just came up with the bed liner idea after trying to think of a way to cover the insulation so it wouldn't get damaged. I started researching and found that this would be an easy and long lasting product. As for the design, I just can't stop at good enough. These things have to make people's jaws drop in order for me to have accomplished my goal. I am not a bragger or conceded but I do like nice things and I don't do half ass so.... It is what it is and I hope you guys are blown away.
 
We'll only let it slide because we have no other choice. However, in the future, you should consider using violent force to stick to your deadlines. Many of us will now have to drink uncontrollably to mask our disappointment in your delay. And you know how we dread drinking...
 
I haven't gotten used to the way a small town operates again. This was supposed to be done last week. I'm just glad you guys are so interested.
 
Nope, lived in Lubbock for about 10 years and now I am back to my small little hometown of Ada, OK. This place pisses me off in more ways than one. Oklahoma doesn't have car inspections anymore, so everyone drives around with tail lights out and crashed up cars with stuff hanging off of them. I miss Texas so much and can't wait to get back one day.
 
wortmonger said:
I haven't gotten used to the way a small town operates again. This was supposed to be done last week. I'm just glad you guys are so interested.

... wait, what are we interested in again? I just read someone say we need to drink uncontrollably, and I skipped all the rest...
 
OK, I went in today because they told me to pick them up at 5:00. I go in and they are sprayed, but with my design hanging off in some places. I specifically asked the guy if I needed more prep or if it would fill in the spaces and he said I was golden. Well, I asked him why he didn't and he said it just slipped his mind. They look great, but need more work. He assured me (like that is worth spit) that tomorrow they would be finished to my specifications. Hopefully the second coat won't hide the already perfect portions and will fill in the spaces underneath my design and look spectacular. Sorry guys, but at least I know they are almost done. On a second note, I am completely done with selling my home in my last town I lived in and will hopefully have my own place to brew besides doing it at my parents home. Keep checking in because, believe me, they are going to blow you away. Chrysler silver.... sweeeeeeeeet!!!!!!!!
 
wortmonger said:
OK, I went in today because they told me to pick them up at 5:00. I go in and they are sprayed, but with my design hanging off in some places. I specifically asked the guy if I needed more prep or if it would fill in the spaces and he said I was golden. Well, I asked him why he didn't and he said it just slipped his mind. They look great, but need more work. He assured me (like that is worth spit) that tomorrow they would be finished to my specifications. Hopefully the second coat won't hide the already perfect portions and will fill in the spaces underneath my design and look spectacular. Sorry guys, but at least I know they are almost done. On a second note, I am completely done with selling my home in my last town I lived in and will hopefully have my own place to brew besides doing it at my parents home. Keep checking in because, believe me, they are going to blow you away. Chrysler silver.... sweeeeeeeeet!!!!!!!!

Hey, you need me to go down there and monkey-stomp their a$$es? TheGAC no happy he no get to see... TheGAC SMASH!!!
 
Ok, well they turned out a little poorer in fabrication as I am used to (perfectionist), but I think they look damn good.
DSCN1867.JPG


Here is the Mash Tun. Notice the built up liner in some places. I don't know why the guy was so unprofessional and had to spray them twice, but I learned not to take a $27,000 new truck to get lined by him so saving future pissed offness.
DSCN1868.JPG


Here is the Hot Liquor Tun.
DSCN1869.JPG
 
Here's the backs.
DSCN1870.JPG


Here you can see how my question of, "Should I caulk or seal around the artwork?" that I asked the guy should have been answered with a YES!!!!!!!
DSCN1872.JPG


And here's a nice shot of what I wanted it to look like.
DSCN1871.JPG


A very good lesson learned, when a guy says it will be one price and done at a certain time, get it in writing. The guy got an extra $25 out of me because of his screw up. I also had to wait an extra week. I hate small town BULLSH!T!!!!!!!!!!
 
wortmonger said:
Ok, well they turned out a little poorer in fabrication as I am used to (perfectionist), but I think they look damn good.

Here is the Mash Tun. Notice the built up liner in some places. I don't know why the guy was so unprofessional and had to spray them twice, but I learned not to take a $27,000 new truck to get lined by him so saving future pissed offness.

Here is the Hot Liquor Tun.

Those are looking pretty sweet dude! I can't wait to hear how awesomely they work!
 
I know, I wish I had time to test before I posted, but everyone has been waiting with baited breath to see them. I still need to cut out some of the stuff and put my sight gauge and stuff back on. then I get to water test again and temperature test after that. Can't wait to use these bad boys.
 
I'll agree with you about the truck, but they look like they'd obey the 10 foot rule. Touch up any spots that were not thick with some silver paint to make em less noticeable. Besides that, at least you learned about em before you did something super expensive. That is some premo looking gear man, if you're not satisfied with the results, I'm sure someone will take em off your hands :D
 
They are cool. I must have missed if you said they were going to be silver, for some reason I was expecting black. Looks neat.

Care to share what the cost of the spray was?
 
Drac0nic said:
I'll agree with you about the truck, but they look like they'd obey the 10 foot rule. Touch up any spots that were not thick with some silver paint to make em less noticeable. Besides that, at least you learned about em before you did something super expensive. That is some premo looking gear man, if you're not satisfied with the results, I'm sure someone will take em off your hands :D

10' rule? Yeah the paint is actually Testors model paint/ Chrysler Silver. I am planning to fill in all the gaps and repaint. I know next time to fill all the gaps and don't listen when someone tells you not to worry it will all fill in. Definitely not taking my truck in there to get done. I am sure everyone else who didn't make them and isn't a perfectionist would love to have these, and I love them as well. I am just not overly happy with the results.

Jester369 said:
Do you have plumbing actually running through the Ranco box?

Yes, the coupler, union, and ball valve all go into and through the Ranco. Talk about a chore, that was one PITA of a fabrication. I did it so the sensor wire would be right there coming out of the Ranco and so that it would have a better look to it. It also serves to hold the Ranco in place without having to attach it. Honestly, even though it was a PITA, I would recommend it if the same problem ever came up with anyone else because it made attaching the Ranco so easy.

BillyA said:
Looks good man. The stools not so much.

Watch it man, my Mom might find out and come and get you for saying stuff about her hideous stools, lol. What she was thinking when she did that I will never know. First signs of senility I guess. :D

Ryan_PA said:
They are cool. I must have missed if you said they were going to be silver, for some reason I was expecting black. Looks neat.

Care to share what the cost of the spray was?

T/Y and I have said they might be several different colors throughout this documentary of the project, but silver just looked so good I had to go with it.

As for the cost, $100 for both and a little over a weeks worth of, "It will be done tomorrow, I promise." This is coming from a guy that told me $70 and it would be ready later on last week. I will get a written PO or contract next time, and I won't be going to this guy. They must be making money because they were so packed and busy, but the guy really needs to work on his promises and stand behind what he said he would do.

This stuff is super strong but flexible. It is really neat stuff. I wonder what just spraying a keg would have done for insulation value, but I am so glad I have 3 layers of Reflectix under the liner.
 
While this project is well beyond where I am in the brewing process, just want to point out that, while I understand from personal pain what you mean by the "perfectionist" aspect and you being a bit disappointed, they look great.

Rick
 
Well thanks Rick, but I will never accept these as what I truly wanted. Working with them a little more and removing the excess has been enlightening. The stuff cuts like bull hide, stretches like thick rubber (tire), and is only painted silver. I can fill in all the imperfections, other than the now too much liner in certain places, and then repaint and it should look more like I want. My problem was going to a small town guy that hasn't done much more than pick-up beds.
 
They look good man. I am pretty confident that their performance will mitigate your disappointment. Really excited to see how well they work.

When I was in product development we always joked about how the people how develop cutting edge technology are on the bleeding edge. You may friend are on the bleeding edge ;) Thanks for being a pioneer
 
I don't know man. People would have to hide the baseball bats from me. I just HATE incompetence with a passion. If that was my pickup bed, they'd be having the dealer order a replacement bed. I don't mean to make you feel bad about it but I know how you feel. I don't trust anyone to do what they advertise. At least they should function well right?
 
They should function great. The guy can't communicate is all. He was way busier than getting these ready that quick, he just wouldn't say that. I am the other way, I scare people away telling them worst case scenario just so when everything said and done it turns out better than expected. I am definitely checking the work of the sprayer the next time I get bed lining done. These will turn out great, just a little more work is all...... and some silver model paint.
 
I am going to love these things, I have worked a little more on them and they will be as close to perfect from this point as I can get them. I hope everyone enjoys looking at them as much as I enjoyed making them.
 
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