My first shot at it ! 1 question.

[flyguy784]

Good morning folks. As I've thoroughly mastered the consumption side of beer, my kids bought me a brewing set up for Christmas. Good kids.
My first batch is an English Nut Brown, from a kit. I'm following the instructions implicitly. So far it all looks good. Had my wort in the primary fermenter for 5 days now. Bubbled away great for 1st couple days, now shes slowed down considerably. According to the instructions, I carefully siphoned my liquid into my glass secondary. SP is 1.11. I had to taste it! put a small amount in a glass and while it's rich in flavor, it's quite bitter. I'm praying this is merely because my brew is so "green". I'm figuring after a couple weeks in the secondary and aging a couple weeks in the bottle she'll lose some of the bitterness.
Sound about right???
Oh, looking forward to being a member and learning from you guys.

 

[HomebrewSupply]

Good morning folks. As I've thoroughly mastered the consumption side of beer, my kids bought me a brewing set up for Christmas. Good kids.
My first batch is an English Nut Brown, from a kit. I'm following the instructions implicitly. So far it all looks good. Had my wort in the primary fermenter for 5 days now. Bubbled away great for 1st couple days, now shes slowed down considerably. According to the instructions, I carefully siphoned my liquid into my glass secondary. SP is 1.11. I had to taste it! put a small amount in a glass and while it's rich in flavor, it's quite bitter. I'm praying this is merely because my brew is so "green". I'm figuring after a couple weeks in the secondary and aging a couple weeks in the bottle she'll lose some of the bitterness.
Sound about right???
Oh, looking forward to being a member and learning from you guys.

First, welcome to the hobby! It's a blast, and you're sure to get hooked. Sounds like you've got some good kids there, too!

I definitely think time will be your friend, especially just 5 days after fermentation. Whether you move it to secondary or just leave it in primary for a bit before bottling, you'll be in good shape. I know many, myself included, are moving away from racking their beers to secondary for most beers, to reduce oxygenation and the chance of infection. Just something to consider as well!

Good luck!

 

[PlexVector]

@flyguy784,
Great! Welcome to HBT. Never did a kit, but some questions that will get asked:
Maybe the specific gravity is 1.011 and not 1.11?
What kit did you get?

 

[lowtones84]

Welcome, and congrats on your first brew!

Yes, the "bitter" flavor you're describing is most likely a product of the beer not being quite ready yet and should age out. Just so you know, most of us here will advise you to not use a secondary vessel the majority of the time, or if you do, not until fermentation is totally complete. Taking a beer off of the yeast cake can slow fermentation and other processes.

I'm sure it will be just fine though, it was likely done or very nearly done by the time you racked it to secondary. Good luck!

 

[m00ps]

I would advise to not use a secondary. 99%of the time, it is not needed. The general idea (which is outdated) is that you need ot get the beer off the yeast cake to prevent autolysis. I have left beers in the primary for months without issue

As an inexperienced brewer, all transferring the beer to a secondary will do is expose it to oxygen and potential infection

If you are referring to the actual IBUs of the beer, it will not really fade with age. There are a number of "green" beer off flavors that should get resolve themselves with time. The key is to be patient and not constantly open the fermentor to check on it. I would use 3 weeks as a general rule of thumb before bottling, but the main thign is to have consecutive gravity checks to ensure that it is done fermenting before packaging. Even if the gravity is stable, another few days to let the yeast finish cleaning up is always a good idea

good luck!

 

[ruascott]

What temp do you have your fermenter?

Definitely don't worry too much about how it tastes right now. In the future you can likely not worry with transferring into secondary. Just leave it in primary for 3 weeks or so.

Then really wait 3 weeks in bottles...it may be drinkable before then, but will get better with time. 3 weeks at room temp, then another couple weeks in the fridge...ideally

 

[flyguy784]

Thanks, I think you're right on all fronts. I did learn one important lesson this morning while racking to my secondary. I'm sure many have been here. I popped my plastic lid off and to my delight, it looked like nut brown. Loving the grainy/malty aromas of good beers, I plunged my face into the bucket to wiff up it's fineness. Holy crap! I think the blast of fumes may have burned out my nose hairs. I had no idea, lesson learned.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

Welcome aboard!!
You don't need a secondary.Leave it in the primary the entire time till your ready to bottle..(next time). 5 days is way to short to rack to secondary anyway.I doubt your beer was completely finished..Next time just leave it in the primary for 2 weeks and your pretty much guaranteed complete fermentation.OR check gravity starting at day 10 day 11 and day 12.If your numbers haven't changed in three days it finished. What yeast did you use and what was your fermentation temp at.

 

[ballsy]

Good morning folks. As I've thoroughly mastered the consumption side of beer, my kids bought me a brewing set up for Christmas. Good kids.
My first batch is an English Nut Brown, from a kit. I'm following the instructions implicitly. So far it all looks good. Had my wort in the primary fermenter for 5 days now. Bubbled away great for 1st couple days, now shes slowed down considerably. According to the instructions, I carefully siphoned my liquid into my glass secondary. SP is 1.11. I had to taste it! put a small amount in a glass and while it's rich in flavor, it's quite bitter. I'm praying this is merely because my brew is so "green". I'm figuring after a couple weeks in the secondary and aging a couple weeks in the bottle she'll lose some of the bitterness.
Sound about right???
Oh, looking forward to being a member and learning from you guys.

Congrats and welcome!!
1st off, read a lot on HBT re: how to do an extract batch well because following the instructions in the kits, though it does lead to the creation of "beer", it doesn't necessarily mean good/drinkable beer.
Re: racking (siphoning) your beer from primary to secondary, I strongly advise you to NOT do secondaries at all until you get a good process down. I've brewed about 40 batches thus far and not once done a secondary ferment. It's just more time, and another step that risks infecting the beer for someone who is new to brewing and still getting down a technique.
Re: "SP is 1.11", do you mean the gravity reading? If so, check the notches again. Typically a standard brown like yours probably had an OG anywhere b/w 1.04 and 1.055, extract beers typically finish around 1.014 give or take so I'm thinking you mean 1.011?
Re: tasting it at different time frames, it's a good learning thing to do so you get a sense of how it changes with time (just be sure and sanitize the sampling container) but don't get caught up in analyzing it. Just take notes on it. Standard times in primary fermentation should be around 3 wks before you should think about making sure it's at true FG (take SG read, re-check again 2-3 days later and if same SG then it's done if it's lower than the first read then leave it going).
My biggest word of advice and what changed my beers the most was paying attention to & controlling ferment temps. Don't just let it sit in a room with thermostat at normal living temp's initially (that's typically ok after the first 5-7days of fermentation but that first week it should be kept in low to mid 60's F).
Good luck and let us know how it turns out!

 

[flyguy784]

Thank you guys. My Fermenter temp is between 68F-72F, specified range in the instructions. Got it, no secondary racking. I've read that before. My kit was a "Brewers Best", English Nut Brown Ale. Had to steep grains/coffee and as I recall Carpals. Some dry malt and some liquid malt. Two types of hops.
With the long fermenting, aging times, sounds like I better get a couple more fermenters going.
I also see now, I need a clip board and keep up on my documentation. This is fun.

 

[flyguy784]

This is soo helpful, thanks guys. Yes, it is 1.011, my mistake. The instructions did say ferment at 64F-72F, sounds like it should be at the lower end of this range.

 

[Firewalker11]

My first was a Nut Brown as well from a kit. The key is patience, ours tasted like schmidt for a month and then it got nicely mellow.

Good luck and welcome to the fray!

 

[bernardsmith]

I don't know very much about kits... but I see that Brewer's Best recommends a transfer to a secondary vessel and while I agree with everyone here who suggests that good technique rarely requires racking to a secondary vessel, if a kit advises that you follow their instructions AND something goes awry then you may have recourse. If for whatever good reason you have chosen not to follow their instructions and something goes wrong then the manufacturer can always shrug their shoulders and say that neither they nor their product is at fault. The fault, lies with you because you failed to follow their instructions... So I would argue that for a first time brewer you ought to follow the recipe instructions as closely as you can, and then when you understand what under-girds each piece of action , each ingredient then you are in a far better position to make decisions about best or good practice.. Good luck! This is a wonderful hobby

 

[AZCoolerBrewer]

Very exciting. I remember my first brew kit. That was only 3 batches ago, so I'm new too. My limited knowledge says that bitter flavors will age out, but that is after months of aging. The bitter flavor comes from the alpha acids in your hops isomerizing during your boil. Many hops will have a range of alpha acids. Let's say the beer kit company developed their recipe with 3.5% alpha acid UK Fuggle hops and then sent you 6.5% UK Fuggle hops for your kit. Your beer would have nearly twice the alpha acids as the developed recipe making your beer more bitter.

I'm not saying this is what happened or even that your beer will be bitter when it is done. In your effort to make great beer, a light will come on exposing all these really interesting things you never knew you didn't know about how beer can, might, "should" taste. When your beer is done, decide for yourself if you did what you set out to do and whatever you want to change then research it and try something different. It sounds like you are off to a great start.

Here is the BJCP information about the beer style you are making. I like to look at these styles for inspiration since they are tried and true styles of beer that people like to drink. http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style11.php

Your beer style is likely 11B or 11C.

 

[ballsy]

I don't know very much about kits... but I see that Brewer's Best recommends a transfer to a secondary vessel and while I agree with everyone here who suggests that good technique rarely requires racking to a secondary vessel, if a kit advises that you follow their instructions AND something goes awry then you may have recourse. If for whatever good reason you have chosen not to follow their instructions and something goes wrong then the manufacturer can always shrug their shoulders and say that neither they nor their product is at fault. The fault, lies with you because you failed to follow their instructions... So I would argue that for a first time brewer you ought to follow the recipe instructions as closely as you can, and then when you understand what under-girds each piece of action , each ingredient then you are in a far better position to make decisions about best or good practice.. Good luck! This is a wonderful hobby

"if a kit advises that you follow their instructions AND something goes awry then you may have recourse."
I'm confused by this, so you're saying if you follow the shoddy directions we all know these kits come with and the beer ends up tasting like crap, we can write them a letter saying "hey, I followed your instructions exactly and my beer tastes crappy....please give me my money back!"? hahaha, seriously doubt that, but if so I would like to order strictly from them! I believe it is important to discover the good habits which lead to good extract beers as early on as possible (late extract additions to prevent caramelization, good ferment temp control, good sanitary practices, knowing when to dry hop, knowing when to keg/bottle,etc....). If someone is following the instructions these kits come with then they are not learning good habits.
Perfect example: I just brewed an extract Rye IPA kit that was on sale from NB yesterday ( a well known, respected company, right?). No lie, their instructions said "cool the wort down to 100 degrees and then add the yeast"!! If I were to follow that, I would have a crap end product thank to diacetyl production...straight from John Palmers book "How To Brew" Chapter 8 "A common mistake that homebrewers make is pitching the yeast when the wort has not been chilled enough, and is still relatively warm. If the wort is, e.g. 90F, when the yeast is pitched and slowly cools to room temperature during primary fermentation, more diacetyl will be produced in the early stages....
OP, do yourself a favor and practice the good techniques you can read all about on this forum. The sooner you stray from those instructions in the kits the better tasting your beer will be! After all, YOU are the one drinking the final product not the company who made the instructions!

 

[Gavin C]

Good morning folks.....

Congrats on the brew. Well done.

I think you're ahead of the curve finding HBT so early in your brewing career and not breaking your hydrometer the instant you got it out of its box like someone I know. Kudos.

Welcome to this wonderful forum. Happy brewing.

 

[GHBWNY]

I don't know very much about kits... but I see that Brewer's Best recommends a transfer to a secondary vessel and while I agree with everyone here who suggests that good technique rarely requires racking to a secondary vessel, if a kit advises that you follow their instructions AND something goes awry then you may have recourse. If for whatever good reason you have chosen not to follow their instructions and something go wrong then the manufacturer can always shrug their shoulders and say that neither they nor their product is at fault. The fault, lies with you because you failed to follow their instructions... So I would argue that for a first time brewer you ought to follow the recipe instructions as closely as you can, and then when you understand what under-girds each piece of action , each ingredient then you are in a far better position to make decisions about best or good practice.. Good luck! This is a wonderful hobby

I see your point, but if you are an experienced brewer and have never read a set of instructions from a kit, then you owe it to yourself to see how vague, over-generalized, and incomplete they really are. From someone who got his start with kits and has read reams of kit instructions, it is my opinion that "failing to follow instructions" can actually improve both your brewing process and product, while following them to a 'T' can create a greater liability to the success of your brew. Say a beginner has something go wrong while following kit instructions to a 'T'; how does he know it isn't because of something they DIDN'T tell him (like, the secondary they recommend doing increases the chance of oxidation and infection)? If the only advantage of following the instructions is possible "recourse" (good luck) if something goes wrong, then I would want to do what is best for my brew regardless of what the person taking my money tells me.

 

[ZmannR2]

How are we supposed to keep the fermenter at mid to low 60's? That's impossible

 

[lowtones84]

Swamp cooler! Get a big rubbermaid tub, put your fermenting vessel in it. Fill to about the level of the wort inside (not much over, or it will float ). Chuck in some frozen water bottles from time to time.

Additional options: Cover with a wet t-shirt while in the swamp cooler. Aim a fan at the wet t-shirt covered fermenting vessel.

Or, buy/find a fridge that will fit buckets/carboys and wire up a temp controller.

 

[Gavin C]

How are we supposed to keep the fermenter at mid to low 60's? That's impossible

Some ways include

• Cold garage/basement
• Swamp cooler
• Wet towel and fan method
• Fridge/freezer with external thermostat
• Jacketed fermentor using chilled glycol
• A repurposed A/C unit cooling a small enclosed space

Pros and cons to each. Other methods are available

 

[ZmannR2]

Oy! Not sure if I have the willpower to do all that lol

 

[nDub]

... I plunged my face into the bucket to wiff up it's fineness. Holy crap! I think the blast of fumes may have burned out my nose hairs. I had no idea, lesson learned.

CO2 will do this. I get that burning smell/feeling after opening an empty keg. I'm sure if you breath enough it'll cause asphyxiation. Good times.

 

[flyguy784]

I'm starting to see that this is a hobby that takes time to really learn.
I was hoping that the kits would be a good intro, apparently not.
I also see that I need more primary's.
I also get, "NO GLASS CARBOYS".

As far as my first brew goes; she's sitting in the "not necessary" secondary. In a back room that stays around 63F. I'm happy to report that it's still popping off CO2 thru the airlock. Must be working. After cleaning out the primary and seeing that lovely "yeast cake" at the bottom, it makes perfect sense not to disturb things pre-maturely. But I'll bet my septic tank appreciates the new addition.

Last but not least, don't take a big nasal sniff of a newly opened, fermenting, batch.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

I'm starting to see that this is a hobby that takes time to really learn.
I was hoping that the kits would be a good intro, apparently not.
I also see that I need more primary's.
I also get, "NO GLASS CARBOYS".

As far as my first brew goes; she's sitting in the "not necessary" secondary. In a back room that stays around 63F. I'm happy to report that it's still popping off CO2 thru the airlock. Must be working. After cleaning out the primary and seeing that lovely "yeast cake" at the bottom, it makes perfect sense not to disturb things pre-maturely. But I'll bet my septic tank appreciates the new addition.

Last but not least, don't take a big nasal sniff of a newly opened, fermenting, batch.

That lovely yeast cake is your friend.Swirl it up(next time) and pour it into mason jars and store in the fridge.Each 5 gallon batch will give you 3 more batches of free yeast.It adds up pricewise if you continue brewing.

 

[wyccad915]

I'm starting to see that this is a hobby that takes time to really learn.
I was hoping that the kits would be a good intro, apparently not.
I also see that I need more primary's.
I also get, "NO GLASS CARBOYS".

As far as my first brew goes; she's sitting in the "not necessary" secondary. In a back room that stays around 63F. I'm happy to report that it's still popping off CO2 thru the airlock. Must be working. After cleaning out the primary and seeing that lovely "yeast cake" at the bottom, it makes perfect sense not to disturb things pre-maturely. But I'll bet my septic tank appreciates the new addition.

Last but not least, don't take a big nasal sniff of a newly opened, fermenting, batch.

Secondary is good for you for now if you do want to get another brew going. It just depends if you can get the ingredients, and if you have a LBHS. Get that pipeline going. I started a couple of months ago and I have a loose pipeline in the works. One ready, one sorta ready (it's ok, could age more), and one fermenting

 

[GHBWNY]

Oy! Not sure if I have the willpower to do all that lol

It's not difficult at all. Get yourself a plastic tub, put your fermenter in, fill it with cold water, grab some old t-shirts or towels. Note that yeast activity during fermentation will raise the inside temp of the wort anywhere from 5-10 degrees F, so if your recommended ferm temp is say, 65F, you'll want to have your bath ~60F-ish. If the water isn't cold enough, add ice as needed. Soak and drape t-shirts/towels over the fermenter so they hang into and wick up the water. Easy, low-maintenance, and works like a charm. Everyone here will agree that your beer will THANK YOU for keeping the ferm temp as steady as possible. Brew on, bro!

 

[ballsy]

It's not difficult at all. Get yourself a plastic tub, put your fermenter in, fill it with cold water, grab some old t-shirts or towels. Note that yeast activity during fermentation will raise the inside temp of the wort anywhere from 5-10 degrees F, so if your recommended ferm temp is say, 65F, you'll want to have your bath ~60F-ish. If the water isn't cold enough, add ice as needed. Soak and drape t-shirts/towels over the fermenter so they hang into and wick up the water. Easy, low-maintenance, and works like a charm. Everyone here will agree that your beer will THANK YOU for keeping the ferm temp as steady as possible. Brew on, bro!

It really is easy. The highlight to my girls day is each grabbing a frozen 1L bottle and tossing it into the swamp cooler for me hahaha (at 4 & 6 this is what makes them happy!).
Re: the internal ferment temp variation vs outer temp there's a lot of conflicting info. Surrounding it in a solution (bath) gives the least variation, I remember reading it's less than 5 degrees from the surrounding bath water temp. If sitting in a room then it can get as high as 10 degrees above ambient.

 

[HomebrewSupply]

Swamp cooler! Get a big rubbermaid tub, put your fermenting vessel in it. Fill to about the level of the wort inside (not much over, or it will float ). Chuck in some frozen water bottles from time to time.

Additional options: Cover with a wet t-shirt while in the swamp cooler. Aim a fan at the wet t-shirt covered fermenting vessel.

Yup! This is a great route to go, did this for my first few years of brewing before moving to a chest freezer fermentation chamber.

 

[lowtones84]

I've been brewing for 5 years and still use this method. I'm poor and don't have space in my tiny basement apartment for a chest freezer, just keeping my minimal brewing equipment is tough. I think I might actually be able to do a lager in the middle of winter

 

[flyguy784]

Ok, I moved (carefully) my secondary to a room that I maintain at 63-64 F. It did "burp" for the first day. Seems to have either stopped or slowed down considerably. I'm not concerned, seems logical. I think she's done but will leave the brew in there, undisturbed for another week or so. At the end of another week, I'll take gravity readings to make sure she's ready to bottle.
After reading many posts on the forum, I've purchased another fermenter, bubbler, star-san, stoppers etc from Northern Brewer. I also ordered one of their extract kits. I've read that their kits are fresh and on the money. I love Hefe and the reviews for the kit were all 5 stars. It's their "Bavarian Hefeweizin" kit and I opted for the upgraded yeast, "Wyeast 3068 Weihenstephan Wheat".
Any opinions on their kits?
I'm sure I will eventually move into BIAB, and all grain brewing but for now, till I get my techniques and knowledge base down, the extract kits seem to be my best option. I'm afraid my kids have created a monster. Wish they would have given me a big sack of patience with the brew kit.

 

[HomebrewSupply]

Wish they would have given me a big sack of patience with the brew kit.

Don't we all, haha! I still maintain one of the hardest part of homebrewing is waiting for the next batch to be ready.

 

[ruascott]

Ok, I moved (carefully) my secondary to a room that I maintain at 63-64 F. It did "burp" for the first day. Seems to have either stopped or slowed down considerably. I'm not concerned, seems logical. I think she's done but will leave the brew in there, undisturbed for another week or so. At the end of another week, I'll take gravity readings to make sure she's ready to bottle.
After reading many posts on the forum, I've purchased another fermenter, bubbler, star-san, stoppers etc from Northern Brewer. I also ordered one of their extract kits. I've read that their kits are fresh and on the money. I love Hefe and the reviews for the kit were all 5 stars. It's their "Bavarian Hefeweizin" kit and I opted for the upgraded yeast, "Wyeast 3068 Weihenstephan Wheat".
Any opinions on their kits?
I'm sure I will eventually move into BIAB, and all grain brewing but for now, till I get my techniques and knowledge base down, the extract kits seem to be my best option. I'm afraid my kids have created a monster. Wish they would have given me a big sack of patience with the brew kit.

I'm sure the hefe kit will make a good beer...but it's really the process more than ingredients that give you a good finished product.

Do some reading on good extract brewing technique....particularly adding most of the extract late in the boil (likely different than the instructions tell you).

Also, try to boil the maximum volume possible. I don't know your equipment size, but after being less than pleased with my first extract brew, increasing to a full boil has really helped. At least try to get as close as possible, limiting top off water.

Finally, research advice for the particular yeast you are using. It's likely a bit different in behavior than the one you used for the nut brown...regarding ideal temp, activity, etc...may even need a blow off tube for this one.

 

[Gavin C]

"Wyeast 3068 Weihenstephan Wheat".
Any opinions on their kits?

Good kits. I made a few when I was starting out.

That yeast is a very good idea for a hefe as it is the big player in the resulting flavor of the Hefe.

Make a starter if you can. (More on making one in my sig below)

Make sure you have plenty of headspace in your FV. This yeast needs a lot of room.

Here it is in action on a ~5 gallon batch in a 6 gallon carboy. (Beer at 66F) A too narrow blow off was in place but not needed this time.